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Topping PA5 Review (Amplifier)

jokan said:
...

It is my opinion that you have the start of a great sounding system. I think there is room for improvement. Take the time to learn about VTA. Almost all Regas have poor VTA, as in the arm is lifted lightly instead of a very slight downward angle. Feel free to DM me if you have questions.
Click to expand...
Roy Gandy's (owner of Rega) view of VTA adjustments:

 
JeffGB said:
I have to admit, I am finding the discussion of gain and volume to be pretty funny. I guess it's because I am old and grew up with records, FM tuners, and tape decks that all put out different voltages. There is NO optimal gain for an amplifier because there are too many variables in people's systems. Anyone believing that the CD standard of 2.0 v changes that is not considering that our sources still vary greatly depending on how the producer recorded it. Youtube has dramatic differences in volume level between different videos for instance.

Trying to get the maximum output of a DAC to match perfectly with the input sensitivity of an amplifier is not necessary nor possible in most scenarios unless the user is actually doing the matching themselves for their specific installation. How much gain do you lose in EQ? That depends on your system so unless we are mandated specific speakers connected to specific amplifiers with specific EQ we don't know.

Most volume/level/gain controls are potentiometers. They are simply attenuating the input signal not changing the gain of the amplifier. You can create a volume control that also changes the amount of feedback in a circuit and that could actually be considered a gain control. 95% of this is just semantics though. I find the gain of the PA5 perfect for my use, connected to my PC via a MOTU M4. The gain of the Aiyima was too high and when the DAC was set to output close to full output the volume control on the Aiyima was nearly zero and it was too loud. Clearly, John Yang was thinking of people driving the PA5 with a simple balanced DAC and in this use, I find it perfect.

Once again, a purchase was made based on Amir's testing and I have another winner. I couldn't be happier.
Click to expand...

Keywords you mentioned are "most". Many do not fall into your most statement. Nor do input/output impedance which has a drastic effect on sound quality that any high-end company will attest to.

Aiyama, Topping, SMSL (I own one presently, sold another) either publish the I/O impedance along with voltage or ignore it all together.
I do expect this information to be forthcoming. Usually they are within reason or margin of error, but there are quite a few that are way off.
I know what i/o impedance does to sound, do you and can you explain it?
It is absolutely necessary to get the most out of your equipment to get near as possible to the correct impedance. The correct use of a non-parametric EQ is not to boost but to cut frequencies, this has always been the case.

Your statements are completely contradictory of your very own statements. Instead of trying to put a hit piece on me, let me let you know that I have been professionally involved in the hi-fi industry since 93-94 until present day. I have many clients that seek me out, and they are top line manufacturers. Ones that I am allowed to divulge are SPEC corp from Japan, Amtrans also from Japan that deals with both Valve amplification and solid state amplification. I'm also a personal friend of Kii's president. YES that Kii audio of Kii Three BXT. I just spoke with him the other day. (actually he called me).

Before you go questioning or attempting to insult me, you might want to check yourself and be sure that you have the knowledge, the whereweall and fundamental understanding of what Gain control is, how it is use. And there is nothing wrong with a potentiometer for gain adjustment. It's convenient but should be adjusted with the use of a scope to be sure of the results.

WAIT, this is a thread on the
TOPPING PA5.

The sole reason why I brought up gain, and how to understand gain and that it IS NOT a volume control is because I read the previous 150 or so pages full of incorrect at times information.
This is a disservice to those who are just starting in the game of amplifiers.
Many amplifiers (mostly class D) have jumpers, some lucky ones have fragile dip-switches for gain adjustment but they are not to be confused with volume adjustment. They are for electrical matching and nothing more. If you want more volume, there are devices to increase the output after the fact.

I am not being or trying to condescend.
I just want people to know exactly what a gain control is used for.
I'm sure there are youtube videos explaining the correct method of adjusting and using gain controls.
Frankly I couldn't be bothered to explain it all as I will be repeating myself yet again.
 
tonycollinet said:
Roy Gandy's (owner of Rega) view of VTA adjustments:

Click to expand...

Sorry, I want to open the link but NORTON 360 or whatever my Virus program is wouldn't let me open the link.
Can you DM it to me? I would like to keep the REGA discussion CLEAR away from the Topping PA5 discussion. I struggled with VTA myself.

DM me! I will respond within 24 hours. maybe less.

Thanks,
Jokan
 
jokan said:
Sorry, I want to open the link but NORTON 360 or whatever my Virus program is wouldn't let me open the link.
Can you DM it to me? I would like to keep the REGA discussion CLEAR away from the Topping PA5 discussion. I struggled with VTA myself.

DM me! I will respond within 24 hours. maybe less.

Thanks,
Jokan
Click to expand...
That's odd - it is very simple HTML wihtout any sort of scripting - and with certificate. Head, body, headings, paragraphs, fonts etc. Nothing more.

Your norton has unreasonably thrown it's toys out of the pram, and has further justified my position of having no truck with it. :)

I'll PM you the text.
 
This FMOD Passive Line-Level Crossover (Balanced XLR) is pretty cool. A little on the pricey side, but finished product, ready to purchase. ie: use the High Pass 70 Hz ones and the PA5 will now have more power available for 70Hz and up since it will no longer need to push below 70Hz . Great combo if using a Subwoofer.

Or could build some with better parts too, good Teflon caps...

image517.jpg
 
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dwkdnvr said:
Wow - this is close to the holy grail. Finally a great and inexpensive power amp to go with all the great DACs (and headphone/preamps) that we've seen.
Better pick one up before the ASR community drains the supply chain :)
Click to expand...
amirm said:
This is a review and detailed measurements of the Topping PA5 stereo desktop amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $349.

PA5 enclosure looks like their standard DACs and such:

View attachment 168483

Hard to imagine that an amplifier can fit in the same size but here we are. There are large slots for cooling on the bottom and sides which worked well to keep the unit cool during testing.

Back panel shows dual inputs which is nice:

View attachment 168484

The beefy power supply reminds me what used to come with large gaming laptops. It is rated at 38 volts and 4 amps. In use, its temperature did not even rise above room temperature so I imagine it has good bit of headroom. Connection is a secure, screw on, two pin din style which I much prefer to flimsy barrel connectors used in many desktop amps.

Back to inputs, they are TRS balanced input which is fine by me. If you don't have such balanced cables, you can either use an adapter or get an XLR to TRS cable which is what I use. The compact form factor of these allowed it to have two such inputs instead of just one.

Speaker binding posts are the usual small ones on desktops but here they are spread apart thankfully which gets rid of 90% of the aggravation of inserting my large, locking banana plugs into them.

Note that there is no remote and volume control is the traditional one (not rotary). So if you need a remote, you should use a DAC with such and leave the amp with fixed volume.

Topping PA5 Measurements
As usual, we start with our dashboard:
View attachment 168485

Wow, it has been a long time since I have seen such great SINAD score. Rounding it, it lands at 106 which puts it second in a list of over 160 amplifiers tested to date!

View attachment 168551

Typical desktop budget amp struggles to get in the green. The better ones are in the upper half of the green. The PA5 is not only in blue but almost at the top of it. This is incredible achievement.

Yes, there is a bit of "cheating" going on in the form of low gain of 19 dB. Benchmark AHB2 which landed on top used the same. In practice, this is not a problem at all since max power was achieved at 2.5 volt which is well within the 4 volt range of balanced DACs.

And this is one extremely quiet amplifier:
View attachment 168487

My standard at 5 watts is 96 dB or 16 bits of dynamic range. PA5 sails past that to 18 bits or 107 dB. Just remarkable. Many amps can't even get to 96 dB. At full power, it clears 20 bits of dynamic range which means even then the noise it produces is below threshold of hearing.

Multitone test shows some distortion rise with frequency but still remarkably low:

View attachment 168543

I am always nervous running the frequency response test on class D amplifiers, worrying that their output filter interacts with the load and cause audibility issues. That was a worry for not:

View attachment 168491

Yes, there is some variation but the design has made sure that happens a) in ultrasonics and b) with very low amplitude of change. We can see the reason for this in wideband FFT spectrum analysis:


View attachment 168492

Class D amps usually run at a frequency of 300 to 400 kHz. PA5 pushes this up to 600 kHz. This gives the output filter more room to roll off the response where its ringing is above audible band. Unrelated, we also see a super clean spectrum here. None of the usual messiness is here which we even see in high-end class D amps. Attenuation of the switching frequency is almost 40 db and not the usual 10 to 20 dB.

Crosstalk is extremely low:
View attachment 168501

Considering how tiny this package is, I am so pleasantly surprised to see this level of performance.

Despite the tiny package, we have good bit of power into 4 ohm:

View attachment 168544

Allowing for 1% distortion, the available power naturally goes up even more:
View attachment 168497

Naturally switching to 8 ohm, cuts the power:

View attachment 168498

But notice how the PA5 matches and slightly outperforms the noise level of our current class D champ, the Purifi.

Sweeping the frequency vs power and distortion we get:

View attachment 168502

We usually do not get curves that point down this much. This happens when distortion is so low that noise dominates. So very good showing there. Yes, there is rise in higher frequencies but we are starting at such a low baseline that this is exaggerated compared to other amplifiers.

Topping PA5 Speaker Listening Tests
I am confident of the transparency of this amplifier with respect to noise and distortion. However, I was curious how far its power goes. So I hooked up the PA5 to my Infinity Reference 253 speaker. I must stay, I was not prepared for the level of impact, fidelity and overall quality of the sound. The PA5 grabbed the ears of this speaker and pulled it any direction music asked it to like nobody's business! There was thundering bass. Superb high frequency and ability to fill my space despite only playing one speaker. It was hard to imagine this little amplifier powering this speaker so beautifully.

Conclusions
It is abundantly clear that ton of great engineering has gone into the design of Topping PA5. It breaks all barriers as far as noise and distortion, not only in its own budget/desktop class, but way, way outside of that. If it had double the power, it would obsolete all of them and in a hurry! As it is, I would certainly use it in a desktop or secondary system. And even primary if you are not going to blast the volume with super inefficient speakers.

It is my absolute pleasure to recommend the Topping PA5. The dynamics of stereo amplifier market just changed folks!

------------
As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.

Any donations are much appreciated using: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-support-audio-science-review.8150/
Click to expand...
Would have made a lot more sense to hook this little guy up to your Revel Salons (the pair) instead of 1 inexpensive speaker. Doesn't do the engineering team that made this amp the second best amp ever measured by you justice to connect it to one speaker. These measurments mean nothing if you're not willing to put this little guy to a real test on really great speakers and put it through it's paces for real.
 
Hi all. My first post here so excuse my naivety and lack of scientific nous but I have a couple of questions about this product that I'd be keen to hear the answers on if that's okay?

I am looking at purchasing this amp for a second system for my bedroom. I have recently purchased the Topping Dx3 Pro + which I think is a fantastic product and would be looking to connect that to the PA5 amp and then into a pair of bookshelf speakers. I understand that this would require using a special cable to attach a RCA to a balanced input, if I did this would it diminish the quality of the signal chain? And, would it reduce the volume/gain? And finally, and most importantly, what would be the optimum settings I'd need to dial in on the Dx3 preamp? Would I need to set it at the highest volume on the preamp and then just control the volume via the master pot on the PA5, or would I need to somehow match the two gains/volumes on both devices? If the latter can someone please recommend thenl ideal gain settings on the preamp?

Sorry for all the questions but just need to know whether it is viable to do it this way or would it be better all round to buy a topping E50 and to it all balanced (although I'd rather not go to that expense!!)

Cheers
 
you could hook up RCA to TRS cables or adapters, turn the volume to max on PA5 and use the volume control on DX3. Will loose approx. 1/2 of the PA5’s volume potential by using RCA outputs of DX3. Depending on the sensitivity rating of your speakers, and if it’s just for low level background music… you may find it’s enough volume? Try it out, if you don’t like it you could sell it and get something like a Topping EX5 or E50…
 
AudioArchitech said:
you could hook up RCA to TRS cables or adapters, turn the volume to max on PA5 and use the volume control on DX3. Will loose approx. 1/2 of the PA5’s volume potential by using RCA outputs of DX3. Depending on the sensitivity rating of your speakers, and if it’s just for low level background music… you may find it’s enough volume? Try it out, if you don’t like it you could sell it and get something like a Topping EX5 or E50…
Click to expand...
Brilliant, thanks mate, that's really useful. Do you think that method (using the rca to TRS) would be ample to drive for instance the Elac DBR62 (86db) at say a level of 70db for bedroom listening with no clipping, or should I aim for more sensitive speakers? Similarly do you think I could replicate this method for the second input and connect that to a phono stage (Cambridge Solo - obvs bypassing the DX3) or is that volume reduction going to be too much of an issue with the already lower gain of a record cartridge?

Cheers again!
 
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If the RCA out from the DX3 Pro+ doesn't give you enough volume, you can also drive the PA5 using its 3.5 mm headphone output (with the appropriate adapter, see below for examples). The DX3 Pro+ headphone out goes to 8 V.

Cheap adapter cable:

Expensive adapter cable:
 
NTK said:
If the RCA out from the DX3 Pro+ doesn't give you enough volume, you can also drive the PA5 using its 3.5 mm headphone output (with the appropriate adapter, see below for examples). The DX3 Pro+ headphone out goes to 8 V.

Cheap adapter cable:

Expensive adapter cable:
Click to expand...
Thanks for the advice, would the headphone amp method provide the same level of sound quality as the former?
 
Jimbo said:
Hi all. My first post here so excuse my naivety and lack of scientific nous but I have a couple of questions about this product that I'd be keen to hear the answers on if that's okay?

I am looking at purchasing this amp for a second system for my bedroom. I have recently purchased the Topping Dx3 Pro + which I think is a fantastic product and would be looking to connect that to the PA5 amp and then into a pair of bookshelf speakers. I understand that this would require using a special cable to attach a RCA to a balanced input, if I did this would it diminish the quality of the signal chain? And, would it reduce the volume/gain? And finally, and most importantly, what would be the optimum settings I'd need to dial in on the Dx3 preamp? Would I need to set it at the highest volume on the preamp and then just control the volume via the master pot on the PA5, or would I need to somehow match the two gains/volumes on both devices? If the latter can someone please recommend thenl ideal gain settings on the preamp?

Sorry for all the questions but just need to know whether it is viable to do it this way or would it be better all round to buy a topping E50 and to it all balanced (although I'd rather not go to that expense!!)

Cheers
Click to expand...

You could watch the Topping PA3s, I had a friend buy it. It has the DAC Topping DX3 pro. The PA3S has two inputs, one XLR and one RCA. My friend has several amplifiers and he loves it, he listens at times to quite loud music (87db hp) and the amplifier holds up well. The chips is MA12070 doubled.

US $149.00 | TOPPING PA3s MA12070*2 fully Class D balanced amplifier TRS balanced RCA single-end input power amplifier 80w*2 hifi digital amp
a.aliexpress.com

149.0US $ |Topping Pa3s Ma12070*2 Fully Class D Balanced Amplifier Trs Balanced Rca Single-end Input Power Amplifier 80w*2 Hifi Digital Amp - Home Theater Amplifiers - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com
a.aliexpress.com a.aliexpress.com
 
TimF said:
there is very little if any sound quality identifiable difference between the Hypex NC MP modules, the Purifi modules and the Topping PA5 for general home listening (assuming that I do not need a high power amp)?
Click to expand...
Purifi will run circles around PA5.
 
Jimbo said:
That looks very interesting, I'll await a review hopefully from Amir.
Click to expand...
It's up to you, the A5 is an IcePower and not the best model.

The Topping PA3s is a 2x ma12070 and surely more musical. I have the Sabaj A20a on my second chain, and the MA120470 is really good.
 
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