Topping D10 Balanced Review (USB DAC)

[Rottmannash]

Amazing value although destined for use in relatively sparse systems. There is no RCA out for subs and of course only USB in. Thank you @amirm .

Perfect for my desktop system-PC > D10B > XLR > THX 789. Since my D70 is now in my main system.

 

[JohnYang1997]

Is there something about the output circuitry in the D10B that would make Balanced TRS-to-Unbalanced RCA cables—pictured below—cause a failure in the D10B?

View attachment 142548

From Rane Application Note AN110, Sound System Interconnection. Output from D10B on Left. Input to other device on Right.

Other than the signal level drop, increased SINAD, and possible ground loop issues caused by going from balanced to unbalanced, this has been standard practice for decades.

No matter how I will not recommend it. All the needed information is published in the spec. I did my part. After that you have to be on your own.

 

[Toku]

Please give me advice.
As for the balanced output method, the information I got from the article of L7 Audiolab initially said that the transformer output was adopted. Is it actually a transformer method? Or is it a method using a general OP amplifier?

 

[Balle Clorin]

Useless connection, only USB in, who needs Spdif OUT from a DAC?

 

[Blumlein 88]

Is there something about the output circuitry in the D10B that would make Balanced TRS-to-Unbalanced RCA cables—pictured below—cause a failure in the D10B?

View attachment 142548

From Rane Application Note AN110, Sound System Interconnection. Output from D10B on Left. Input to other device on Right.

Other than the signal level drop, increased SINAD, and possible ground loop issues caused by going from balanced to unbalanced, this has been standard practice for decades.

If you haven't seen this, it is noted the D10 balanced does not support any adapter to single ended.
https://www.tpdz.net/productinfo/666141.html

I don't know about the D10. In general going RCA to XLR inputs isn't a problem. There is a small chance of problems going XLR outputs to RCA inputs. The adapter may short one side to ground and if both sides are active that may not be good for the device. I'm thinking with the D10 that is the case. So listen to the guy who makes the D10 and don't use it unbalanced.

 

[JohnYang1997]

Please give me advice.
As for the balanced output method, the information I got from the article of L7 Audiolab initially said that the transformer output was adopted. Is it actually a transformer method? Or is it a method using a general OP amplifier?

Transformer is for the coax output. The dac circuit is just normal balanced implementation.

 

[raif71]

Useless connection, only USB in, who needs Spdif OUT from a DAC?

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...d10-balanced-review-usb-dac.25094/post-853225

 

[Toku]

Useless connection, only USB in, who needs Spdif OUT from a DAC?

The D10 series is a model that combines a USB-DAC with a DDC (Digtal To Digital Converter). If you don't understand this, the D10 series will look like a pointless product. Never look at it in the same way as a typical DAC.

The DDC function enables USB connection between a PC and a device that has only S/PDIF (COAX/OPT) digital input.
I have purchased the D10 and D10s and are using them as USB-DACs as well as testing equipment for other audio equipment. Sometimes it is used as a signal generator for S/PDIF. The D10 Balanced, which has a balanced output, is now on sale, further expanding the range of applications for this series.

Originally, this series is a model with a limited purpose of use and the price is set low. For those who need it, buying both the D10s and D10 Balanced doesn't cost much.

 

[Lupin]

Is there something about the output circuitry in the D10B that would make Balanced TRS-to-Unbalanced RCA cables—pictured below—cause a failure in the D10B?

View attachment 142548

From Rane Application Note AN110, Sound System Interconnection. Output from D10B on Left. Input to other device on Right.

Other than the signal level drop, increased SINAD, and possible ground loop issues caused by going from balanced to unbalanced, this has been standard practice for decades.

Just go for the D10s if you don't have any intention of using balanced.
Why purchase the balanced version when you're not going to use balanced?
The D10s is still by all means a good performing little DAC, not like it's going to be an audible issue or anything.

 

[raif71]

Just go for the D10s if you don't have any intention of using balanced.
Why purchase the balanced version when you're not going to use balanced?
The D10s is still by all means a good performing little DAC, not like it's going to be an audible issue or anything.

@JohnYang1997 , I take it that the D10s will still be maintained and sold alongside the D10b ?

 

[JohnYang1997]

@JohnYang1997 , I take it that the D10s will still be maintained and sold alongside the D10b ?

That's correct.

 

[Sharur]

ordered one

 

[Blumlein 88]

ordered one

Me too.

 

[jannek]

Useless connection, only USB in, who needs Spdif OUT from a DAC?

Great little USB only D/A converter, but totally silly idea to have SPDIF/Toslink out instead of in. Just makes no sense. Think of all the millions of people wanting to upgrade a CD/DVD/TV sound etc.

Useless connection, only USB in, who needs Spdif OUT from a DAC?

Allow me to frame the question differently.

What purpose is there to have optical and coaxial SPDIF on this DAC at all? I see wasted real estate.

Maybe this is not the standard configuration of a DAC, but it is (besides the Soncoz devices) the only one to have this.

The use case it is 100% perfect for is like mine:
- Only source is a Raspberry, streaming via USB
- Headphone amp needs balanced in because of seriously hard to drive headphones
- Speakers are powered DSP Speakers (so with internal digital processing an input via a high quality SPDIF is best to avoid unnecessary conversions)
- Volume control is done in the HPA and in the speaker DSP

Apart from that it is pretty tedious to read posts with a wishlist what features this little gem should also have like Bluetooth, more inputs, remote control, volume knob or even multichannel and streaming. NO. This is a high performance DAC reduced to the minimum (apart from the digi outs) to make it as affordable as possible and that's the concept. Get yourself a Mini DSP SHD or any other full featured DAC and face the price.

Sorry for the rant.

 

[PeteL]

Great little USB only D/A converter, but totally silly idea to have SPDIF/Toslink out instead of in. Just makes no sense. Think of all the millions of people wanting to upgrade a CD/DVD/TV sound etc.

There is the E30 for this? Silly maybe but there are hundreds of the Dac you describe, way enough to chose from for those millions of people, they are well tought about I don't worry for them. There are however receivers out there, and dsp units, with spdif in and no USB, If this is your need options are much more sparse if you need to connect a computer digitally.

 

[Lupin]

- Headphone amp needs balanced in because of seriously hard to drive headphones

I wouldn't consider Aeon "seriously hard to drive" unless you want to EQ +20dB in the lower ranges or something.
Any recent and decent HP AMP can drive these fine over SE.

 

[ceausuc]

Yes, I noticed it right away. That's very strange.

Well, I wouldn't consider it that strange.
Shenzen Audio is probably watching this site and using it as an advertising instrument in order to boost their sales.
So.. they are happier, Topping is happier, ASR..., we are happier

 

[jannek]

I wouldn't consider Aeon "seriously hard to drive" unless you want to EQ +20dB in the lower ranges or something.
Any recent and decent HP AMP can drive these fine over SE.

Sorry, but my SH-9 is not sufficient if driven SE from the Hidizs S9 - and I'd call both recent and decent. No relevant EQ band is more than 5 dB, preamp is -3.5dB.
With a raised volume (not skull vibrating as Amir likes to say, but bearable only for a single track or so) it runs almost full throttle. I would like to have some headroom left.

 

[111a111sk]

Useless connection, only USB in, who needs Spdif OUT from a DAC?

Me for example. I have headphones amp connected to D10 RCA, and distant integrated speaker amp to the SPDIF.

Anyone knows where to buy the topping TRS-RCA (TCT2) cables? Neither hifigo nor shenzenaudio have them. https://www.tpdz.net/productinfo/666157.html

 

[Lupin]

Sorry, but my SH-9 is not sufficient if driven SE from the Hidizs S9 - and I'd call both recent and decent. No relevant EQ band is more than 5 dB, preamp is -3.5dB.
With a raised volume (not skull vibrating as Amir likes to say, but bearable only for a single track or so) it runs almost full throttle. I would like to have some headroom left.

Hidizs S9 is a portable dongle. As far as I can see it doesn't provide an actual line-out to properly feed the SH-9.