The Truth About Vinyl Records

[Galliardist]

Ok gotcha! Btw I'm not sure if you made it to the Pacific Audio Fest show in Seattle but it was my first time hearing analog tape which was playing Herbie Hancock Empty Pockets to me it sounded amazing! Btw I saw Amir there too! He had so many fans around him!

Hardly. I'm in Sydney Australia, so it would be a bit of a trek...

 

[IPunchCholla]

Hardly. I'm in Sydney Australia, so it would be a bit of a trek...

It surprised me that the closest inhabited spot to the antipode for Sydney is the Azores. Funnily enough, Seattle’s and Albuquerques are both Port Aux France. Most of the US ends up in the Indian Ocean.

 

[Kw6]

Hardly. I'm in Sydney Australia, so it would be a bit of a trek...

Ah I see!

 

[KellenVancouver]

 

[KellenVancouver]

 

[Sal1950]

From the mouth of a 6 yo,
"Oh that sucks" LOL

ROTFLMAO

 

[AdamG]

That put a smile on my face! Kids are incredible and so smart. The two older kids (Boy and Girl) are going to be Engineers that I have no doubt.

 

[MattHooper]

From the mouth of a 6 yo,
"Oh that sucks" LOL

ROTFLMAO

Also: “record players are the best!”

You seem to have missed those kids look like they were having lots of fun - a lot more than blankly staring down at their phones and swiping.

Anything that leads to more hands on time less screen time is a good thing.

 

[antcollinet]

I am freaking out at the way those records are being treated.

 

[antcollinet]

From the mouth of a 6 yo,
"Oh that sucks" LOL

ROTFLMAO

And this after being shown the most low tech appalling quality version that could be found.

 

[Sal1950]

And this after being shown the most low tech appalling quality version that could be found.

For sure, they're kids, and always looking for a new toy to play with.
Just like some adults. LOL

 

[antcollinet]

For sure, they're kids, and always looking for a new toy to play with.
Just like some adults. LOL

Oh no, no - you don't get to justify your position because "even the kids say it" - then dismiss the other thing they say by "for sure they're kids"

 

[Sal1950]

Oh no, no - you don't get to justify your position because "even the kids say it" - then dismiss the other thing they say by "for sure they're kids"

Who says I can't ???

 

[MattHooper]

Who says I can't ???

“Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes)”

—WW

 

[Anton D]

So, I think a few of us listen to music recorded before the digital era. Did good sound exist before then? When did the era of high fidelity actually begin for the non-analogue people?

Good example: "Masterpieces" by Duke Ellington was recorded 73 tears ago and it sounds fantastic on a record player. Or, is that wrong?

With all the primitive technology they used back then, how did they get all of that information onto that Flintstones machinery and have it translate into really fine sound in 2023? (Feel free to play the CD or the LP, both sound pretty amazing.)

The OP was fine until it fell into this: "Don’t forget, the reproduction equipment cant put back what is missing from the disc mastering process. Speaking of which, due to the the amount of missing and compromised information on an LP, it can’t really be considered “HiFi” in the current era. Compared to the excellent capabilities of digital recording, especially in the area of dynamic range, noise, wow & flutter and accuracy, a vinyl LP and it’s playing method is thoroughly primitive."

I gotta ask: do you only listen to digital recordings?

I guess recency chauvinism is inevitable.

 

[antcollinet]

So, I think a few of us listen to music recorded before the digital era. Did good sound exist before then? When did the era of high fidelity actually begin for the non-analogue people?

Good example: "Masterpieces" by Duke Ellington was recorded 73 tears ago and it sounds fantastic on a record player. Or, is that wrong?

With all the primitive technology they used back then, how did they get all of that information onto that Flintstones machinery and have it translate into really fine sound in 2023? (Feel free to play the CD or the LP, both sound pretty amazing.)

The OP was fine until it fell into this: "Don’t forget, the reproduction equipment cant put back what is missing from the disc mastering process. Speaking of which, due to the the amount of missing and compromised information on an LP, it can’t really be considered “HiFi” in the current era. Compared to the excellent capabilities of digital recording, especially in the area of dynamic range, noise, wow & flutter and accuracy, a vinyl LP and it’s playing method is thoroughly primitive."

I gotta ask: do you only listen to digital recordings?

I guess recency chauvinism is inevitable.

It's really easy. The Hi in HiFi is relative. To SOTA. So when it was the best available then of course it qualified as Hi

Today - when digital is streets ahead in terms of capablity, vinyl has to take a second tier position, even though it sounds every bit as good as it did pre-digital, which can be surprisingly good.

I Listen to both. But I'm not daft enough to think that vinyl is even close to the equal of digital - let alone, somehow, magically superior.

And it is easy to hear the weaknesses of 60's and 70's recording technology. It is one of the privileges of the current age, that I can easily afford reproduction equipment that puts the top of the line recording studio kit of the 60's to shame.

 

[Sal1950]

I gotta ask: do you only listen to digital recordings?

Who are you asking, me?
No, of course not. I have analog recordings from the 1920-30s going forward.
All contained on digital files on my computers hard drives.

Analog recordings where on a continually improving curve from invention day 1.
Early ones could be horribly noisy and distorted but by the late 1970s they could be quite excellent.
But when compared on balance against a modern digital recording they are still a distant second place.

With all the primitive technology they used back then, how did they get all of that information onto that Flintstones machinery and have it translate into really fine sound in 2023?

They didn't, there's musical information missing that could have been there IF modern digital recording tech had existed then.
But it didn't so there's no way to compare the two.
Most recording engineers that were around during the time of change-over to digital all made the same comments,
"it was the first time I heard a recordings playback sound exactly like the microphone feed".
Your personal evaluation of "fine sound" is just that, your opinion.
Without bringing in the science of the various technologies, sighted listening opinions have zero value.
Sorry.

 

[Sal1950]

Good example: "Masterpieces" by Duke Ellington was recorded 73 tears ago and it sounds fantastic on a record player. Or, is that wrong?

In a way, yes.
If a good digital recording of that 73yo master tape exists, it will would allow you hear exactly whats on that master tape today.
A modern vinyl pressing of that 73yo master will be significantly less transparent to the tape source.
You might like it, but a digital exact copy would still be better.

 

[Anton D]

Without bringing in the science of the various technologies, sighted listening opinions have zero value.
Sorry.

Now I'm curious to see how you shop for gear!

I admit to using sighted listening.

I also confess to using sighted listening in how I evaluate friends' systems, etc. My whole Hi Fi Club suffers from this flaw in methodology.

But, we do use blind comparisons when comparing recordings and changes in gear that can be quickly accomplished, so not completely a Luddite!

I am yet to be fooled by any system into thinking I am hearing live music, ever, so I also confess to coming at this from a point of view that all Hi Fi gear fails the ultimate litmus test, no matter how perfectly it may measure.

(None of this was meant to be disagreeable, I think we all have slightly different approaches.)

 

[DonR]

I am yet to be fooled by any system into thinking I am hearing live music, ever, so I also confess to coming at this from a point of view that all Hi Fi gear fails the ultimate litmus test, no matter how perfectly it may measure.

I have. I heard music coming from a small bar once that advertised "Live" music and was convinced it was a live performance. Alas, the musician was on break and a CD was playing. Often when I hear a live band playing I know it is live because inevitably one or two instruments are playing too loud for the rest of the band or the timing isn't perfect. All things that are "corrected" in the studio.