The quest for my hyper speaker - Very Large room dilemma

[computer-audiophile]

Home - Avantgarde Acoustic

Über 30 Jahre sind Matthias Ruff und Holger Fromme gemeinsam bestreben ihren Traum: "Den besten Lautsprechern der Welt zu verwirklichen"

avantgarde-acoustic.de

Has it already been named? They fit well into a stylish interior. I have good experience with it. In a group of musicians and composers I'm a member of, we used speakers from them as a hi-fi PA. Once also in a big church. There are so many possibilities, actually no problem if you have the space and the money.

 

[Axo1989]

... I was going to suggest Grand Utopia to the o/p - I didn't realise how high the price had gone!

Has that happened everywhere? I thought it was just the local distributor being greedy. Maybe out of the OP's budget then.

 

[RobL]

I am not sure about the frequency response of these. I'll try to find it. Also I think I might need subwoofers. Also, they are large boxy fridge like speakers, and would command a lot of the visual real estate even in my room, which, although not a deal-breaker is far from ideal. Ditto for the Everest except of course the more likely ideal frequency response and lower bass.

Don’t think those need subs…I doubt you’d find anything more efficient either.

 

[aliqaz]

Has that happened everywhere? I thought it was just the local distributor being greedy. Maybe out of the OP's budget then.

More of a value proposition. Apart from the looks which are amazing, I don't think they do anything more special than any other large speaker.

 

[Axo1989]

Home - Avantgarde Acoustic

Über 30 Jahre sind Matthias Ruff und Holger Fromme gemeinsam bestreben ihren Traum: "Den besten Lautsprechern der Welt zu verwirklichen"

avantgarde-acoustic.de

Has it already been named? They fit well into a stylish interior. I have good experience with it. In a group of musicians and composers I'm a member of, we used speakers from them as a hi-fi PA. Once also in a big church. There are so many possibilities, actually no problem if you have the space and the money.

Their Trio plus stacked s/steel subs was exactly what I had in mind when I said "extravagant horns". I did think of the Magico effort later though.

 

[Axo1989]

More of a value proposition. Apart from the looks which are amazing, I don't think they do anything more special than any other large speaker.

You were always paying for style, fit & finish with the Utopia line, now you pay some more.

 

[MKR]

I am not sure about the frequency response of these. I'll try to find it. Also I think I might need subwoofers. Also, they are large boxy fridge like speakers, and would command a lot of the visual real estate even in my room, which, although not a deal-breaker is far from ideal. Ditto for the Everest except of course the more likely ideal frequency response and lower bass.

I don’t think you will need subs, unless you want flat response <18Hz. But yes, these are definitely large boxes. I have not heard them yet myself, but plan to do so. I have spoken to a few folks whose ears I trust that have heard them, and they were very impressed.

 

[Mr. Widget]

Not sure if these were mentioned already, but another possibility …

Jubilee Floorstanding Speaker | Klipsch

The larger-than-life Klipsch Jubilee Heritage floorstanding speaker is the new flagship of the Heritage Series. Find a dealer and bring this powerful speaker home today.

www.klipsch.com

Looking purely from an aesthetic perspective, a pair of JBL DD67000s could look appropriate in the room... I'd have a hard time accepting the Jubilees.

 

[MKR]

Looking purely from an aesthetic perspective, a pair of JBL DD67000s could look appropriate in the room... I'd have a hard time accepting the Jubilees.

Agree, the JBLs are much more visually appealing

 

[Mart68]

Has that happened everywhere? I thought it was just the local distributor being greedy. Maybe out of the OP's budget then.

£170K in the UK. Evo version is £199K

 

[Duke]

I'll have to disagree with you on this one. I have owned Sound Labs panels and they have plenty of great attributes and I wouldn't hesitate recommending them in many applications, but they do not have the same pattern control that the Wisdoms or Steinway Lyngdorf line array speakers have. Both of these have better control and vastly superior dynamics that the Sound Labs lack.

Note that I am not advocating SoundLabs for @aliqaz 's big room. I used them as an example of in-room measurement-confirmed line-source-approximating behavior.

The faceted-curved panel of the SoundLabs results in an unusually uniform pattern across the region where panel geometry dominates, transitioning to the familiar dipole squashed-figure-8 at longer wavelengths. SoundLab makes two radiation pattern widths: 45 degrees and 90 degrees, and imo both result in very good room interaction characteristics.

Whether or not this constitutes "better" pattern control than the presumably wider-pattern line array speakers from Wisdom and Steinway Lyngdorf probably depends on what one's priorities are.

 

[Philbo King]

If you have a big room maybe with a lot of acoustic issues arising I'd recommend a floor standing D'Appolito speaker. This way you have an "audio lense" and avoid many ceiling and floor bounces naturally and have a much higher ratio of pure source material vs. reverb.

For visualising:
View attachment 282095

Plus it should be at least three way, better four way.

That's just my opinion, but I reckon this is probably the best idea if you don't want to get a reverb party.

I was going to suggest something like a line array speaker pair. This one looks like it would do nicely.

 

[FrantzM]

Hi

I cannot help but notice that in this thread and others.. there is a HEA mentality creeping slowly in...
We are in this thread mentioning >$50,000.oo speakers ... whose only redeeming qualities could well be their looks...
We are moving quite far from some basics, that have become tenets at ASR:
Smooth Directivity
Linear(Smooth) frequency response.
Low THD
Published and verified specifications...

Interestingly, the OP has speakers that adhere to those principles (Revel f208 and JBL 4349) and love them. I would surmise that within the constraints of aesthetics (he stated so) ,he stays within this frame of thought.


For laughs:
thus I am not seeing a Genelec 1236A in this room , however much I try,
The Fugly Genelec 1236A,

SPL: 130 dB
Frequency Response: 17.5 Hz - 26 kHz (-6 dB)
Dimensions: H 1180 x W 960 x D 650 mm
.
Problems solved

Peace.

 

[Adi777]

Problems solved

Measurements?

 

[Duke]

but seriously - room that big - is a pair of speakers the best way to solve the problem, when there are so many excellent high tech, multi-speaker, solutions?

In my opinion, there is a valid argument for using just two speakers with good pattern control in a room that size.

One of the issues in a room that size is, getting a good direct-to-reverberant sound ratio throughout as much of the room as possible. In general, the lower this ratio, the less clarity and the less dynamic contrast, as (to some extent) the reflection field constitutes a "noise floor" which can mask new sounds whose loudness falls below the detection threshold set by this "noise floor". (Imo even the 120-degree-wide pattern of the JBL M2 may be wider than ideal in this situation, as significant sidewall interaction will be inevitable; imo something in the 60-degree ballpark over most of the spectrum would make more sense.)

Note that one of the arguments for multichannel done well (in a suitably treated room) is that it can simulate the acoustics of a much larger room. No such simulation needed in this case!

 

[Inner Space]

Also, they (Klipsch Jubilees) are large boxy fridge like speakers, and would command a lot of the visual real estate even in my room, which, although not a deal-breaker is far from ideal.

Well, they're large but not boxy - they're roughly triangular in plan, so you could tuck them into, or toward, the corners. Much less dominating than you would think, given the 6' x 4' frontal plane. I haven't received mine yet, but I'm really looking forward to getting them.

 

[FrantzM]

Measurements?

Genelec own measurements tend to be reliable, I'll give them credits...


Peace.

 

[Mr. Widget]

SoundLab makes two radiation pattern widths: 45 degrees and 90 degrees, and imo both result in very good room interaction characteristics.

I didn't realize they had a narrow dispersion option... good to know, I'll check this out.

Still, regarding this application where the OP is looking for dynamic slam and SPL output, the Sound Labs are not the right choice.

 

[computer-audiophile]

When it's not about beauty - but sound!

This was one of most impressive speakers I ever heard - so incredibly good simply indescribable. (I had my red 211 tube amps connected to the mid/high)
I do not know if they are still made today.

 

[anphex]

@aliqaz

Nubert Fanboy again. While I would never recommend their electronic devices (currently), their passive speakers - which was their foundation for decades - are incredible in value.

The NuVero 170 are pretty cheap comparing it to other speakers for 7900,00 € a pair. They magic is probably that they don't do buzzword bullshit are add some super convoluted technology that costs a lot but doesn't deliver. They aren't even using proprietary chassis and are basically playing LEGO. But they are doing it incredibly well. Those speakers handle everything you throw at them, no matter what. Why spend more money when there isn't more value to get out of it?

They even say they would love to add an AMT speaker to their portfolio but the current calotte tweeters and especially the ScanSpeak 2608 is just so insanely good that there is no more value to add by using a more expensive tweeter (the spec sheet is actually incredible for the price of this tweeter). Also they are one of the very first manufacturers who saw the potential in BMR.

All in all the NuVero 170 is a very scientific no-bullshit speaker.
I found some old measurement where I measured the horizontal dispersion. It's almost flawless. Note that the measurement was in room without EQ, hence the wiggle in the bass.