SMSL DA9 - Wait and see, or solid buy?

[milan616]

NY Time's Wirecutter just published a review of several amplifiers,

The review is fairly old at this point and Archimago took issue with his measurements and listening results. I think a lot of the internet consensus is the SA300 is much better than Brent's round up gave it credit for. Shame as I rather like Brent's reviews and he's contributed a lot of measurements, particularly for subwoofers, to the community.

 

[ArtDJ]

The review is fairly old at this point...

Ah, so it is. Wirecutter tweeted the link to it this afternoon and I missed the published date on the story, I thought they tweeted it because it was new.

...and Archimago took issue with his measurements and listening results. I think a lot of the internet consensus is the SA300 is much better than Brent's round up gave it credit for.

That's good to know. I was disappointed to see the measured output power and distortion of most of the amps in his roundup were worse than I had expected.

Shame as I rather like Brent's reviews and he's contributed a lot of measurements, particularly for subwoofers, to the community.

Agreed, I normally trust his reviews, one of which helped me choose my HSU sub.

 

[SOUNDSONIC]

A member here, Toku san, have bought all the available colors of the SA300. I read that in the SA300 thread here in ASR. He, among other SA300 owners praise this amp. So I said to myself: "This must be a good amp.".

That made my decision to pull the trgger to buy the SA300 and I was not disappointed. My good impressions of this amp led me to purchase the DA9 just a few days later. And I was imptessed even more.

With these two German chip based amps in my possessions, I can tell that the DA9, matched with appropriate DAC is a big leap fm the SA300....

 

[dmac6419]

A member here, Toku san, have bought all the available colors of the SA300. I read that in the SA300 thread here in ASR. He, among other SA300 owners praise this amp. So I said to myself: "This must be a good amp.".

That made my decision to pull the trgger to buy the SA300 and I was not disappointed. My good impressions of this amp led me to purchase the DA9 just a few days later. And I was imptessed even more.

With these two German chip based amps in my possessions, I can tell that the DA9, matched with appropriate DAC is a big leap fm the SA300....

I'm holding off on the DA9 until Amirm measures it,SMSL is playing around with not getting stuff measured,I don't hold on to spending money long,hope these manufacturers are hearing this.

 

[SOUNDSONIC]

Id love to see the measurements too.

 

[adamjohari]

You guys can correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the other stuff matter too? Not just the chip right? The quality of the power supply and overall architecture must have an influence as well I'd imagine.

 

[Toku]

A member here, Toku san, have bought all the available colors of the SA300. I read that in the SA300 thread here in ASR. He, among other SA300 owners praise this amp. So I said to myself: "This must be a good amp.".

That made my decision to pull the trgger to buy the SA300 and I was not disappointed. My good impressions of this amp led me to purchase the DA9 just a few days later. And I was imptessed even more.

With these two German chip based amps in my possessions, I can tell that the DA9, matched with appropriate DAC is a big leap fm the SA300....

Certainly I bought three SA300s in black, red and blue. Despite the small case and cheap product price, it gives me a very good sound. I love this product.
And I also bought the higher model DA-9 and Sabaj A20a using the same amp chip. These were wonderful things that further evolved the sound of the SA300. However, there was a serious problem with these products delivered to me and I returned them immediately. I would like to buy again if the problem is solved because the sound of these products is wonderfully good.

 

[Poultrygeist]

If the DA-9 outperforms the Volt+D I'll jump for joy. Can't wait to find out.

 

[mario_rouge]

Received my DA-9 yesterday. It replaced the ancient onkyo TX-NR905 receiver I've been using as a power amp through pure audio mode. My speakers are Martin Logan motion 40s. I use a RPi (moode audio) feeding an SMSL Sanskrit 10th Mk2 which connects to the onkyo via analog inputs (RCA)
The onkyo sounded really good - good midrange and the voices sounded very real, but lacked a bit in low down bass.

The DA-9 is very neutral, very clean and the bass in the low range has improved - BUT - the midrange sounds very lean. The SDB filter helps a little bit but the voices are not engaging as the onkyo.

I understand the Sanskrit 10th is a very analytical sounding DAC. I wonder if I get a better DAC (SMSL SU-9 gets great reviews as a 'warm' DAC), I can get back the mid range?

Do you guys think I'm wasting my time with trying different/better DACs? Maybe I should get back to Class AB amps or even better class D ones like Hypex/Purifi?

The new SMSL A1 - Class A also sounds good

i have the same problem here. Human voices are not very evident and clear and are often submerged by the bass. it is an equalization problem. with my old amplifier everything was more balanced. is it possible to equalize the source a little to improve the sound? I have Elac dbr62. Rock eq brings midrange out a little more.

 

[Poultrygeist]

The strength of my full range single drivers is the midrange. If that's a DA-9 shortcoming I'll know it instantly.

More likely a synergy issue.

 

[SOUNDSONIC]

Certainly I bought three SA300s in black, red and blue. Despite the small case and cheap product price, it gives me a very good sound. I love this product.
And I also bought the higher model DA-9 and Sabaj A20a using the same amp chip. These were wonderful things that further evolved the sound of the SA300. However, there was a serious problem with these products delivered to me and I returned them immediately. I would like to buy again if the problem is solved because the sound of these products is wonderfully good.

Hi, Toku San. Thanks for confirming....

 

[SOUNDSONIC]

If the DA-9 outperforms the Volt+D I'll jump for joy. Can't wait to find out.

View attachment 135512

We'd love to see your comparison. Looking forward to it. Thanks.

 

[jokan]

I've read a comment/question regarding noise that appears to emanate from the display driver. I can tell you that within the PSU, the display driver module is directly next to the switching unit which is shielded. The grey box has an EMI/RFI shielding tape applied which I can tell you made my very minimal, barely noticeable noise go away in it's entirety. The black, metal cover is the PSU, the yellow taped box is another part of the PSU, most likely a part of a coil.

Hope this info helps the poster with the display noise. Like I said mine came with some noise from the factory. I don't mind breaking the warranty and found 2 major issues, I had the tell-tale noise coming from surrounding electronics, in my case my computer which has it's own power source separate from all audio equipment which is all connected to a huge power filter feed my audio gear cleaner power. I live in Tokyo in an apartment complex with over 460 individual units. The power is actually virtually noise free. Our complex has annual timed black-outs for maintenance of the mains power and it's relatively clean.

When my DA-9 arrived, it replaced my the older DA-8s. That unit had a brick style adaptor which I really hate as they are built as cheaply as possible. The DA-9 when it first arrived and placed in the same place as the da8s had immediate noise issues. Moving it around while plugged in would change the level of noise. So I promptly removed the rear cover and found that the two power chips had 20% in total of the chip's surface area covered with thermal paste. This prompted me to remove all of the thermal grease with new grease. While I was in there, I had some of the silver coloured tape which is EMI/RFI rejection tape, so I applied it to the display driver. I applied the tape and the thermal grease at the same time since I was already in there. Upon reassembly and reconnecting the DA-9, all noise was gone. My DA-9 has been dead quiet/silent since I applied the new thermal grease. I used a grease that was rated in the mid 6's, you can find thermal grease under amazon and you'll note that they have rejection and effectiveness ratings, since then I've replaced the thermal grease again with grease that is rated at 12.8. I don't know exactly how the ratings work, but descriptions indicate that the higher numbers seem to be used for higher powered GPU's in computers, and Graphics cards are extremely noisy. So the higher rating seems to help with cooling and with noise rejection. My DA-9 runs colder to the touch than my Audio rack made out of MDF and Steel reinforced. The opening of the bottom cover will give you access to the inside of the amplifier. Be careful if you intend to completely remove the internals though with the internal wire that connects to the BT antenna, I had to replace mine since mine was made to the exact length and had no slack or extra length. You do not need to completely disassemble the amplifier to gain access to the amplifier chips. Light grey rectangle are the two chips. The unfortunate thing is once you open the lid, regardless of if your unit lacks grease or not, you must apply new thermal grease and completely remove the original grease once you break that seal. Fortunately you can find 2gram tubes of thermal grease on amazon for $6-12. To remove the thermal grease, isopropyl alcohol or "rubbing alcohol" is the most effective, though you can also use "Flux Cleaner" which is what I used (I wanted to clean the flux around the solder joints).

This is my experience with some of the noise issues which sound very similar to what the other poster a page or two ago had mentioned and a possible remedy. Though without actually measuring both amplifiers there is no way to give concrete evidence of cause and effect. It is my belief that the noise in my amplifier was caused by a lack of thermal grease, I don't think the thin (0.1mm) thick tape that I used to cover the LED driver actually did much, There are 2 layers of the material on the driver in my amplifier.

I run my amp at a 2.7 ohm load with my self made speakers. It's 2.7 and I had the same speakers working with the da8s for it's entire life and the unit was turned off a maximum of 4 times. I can only remember 3 times that I unplugged it. The same speakers, the newer DA-9 and completely noise free after my intervention. The application of the thermal grease is very easy with the supplied spreader that comes with the new thermal grease. 2 grams is the perfect amount once you completely remove the original thermal grease both from the chips, and the reverse side of the bottom lid.

Hope this helps.

 

[1lifeliveit]

I can feel the excitement. Good luck then. Looking foreward to your test anf impressions on the A1...

Received the SMSL A1 today. This amp is in a completely different plane compared to the DA-9 (its nearly twice as expensive too). This has to be the best amp I've ever had. The midrange is back! Voices are completely natural, yet it doesn't lose any of the cleanliness and accuracy.

Maybe not for everyone though, it sorta loses its grip a little bit at very high volumes. I suppose its got to do with only 15w @ 4ohms?
Low to medium high volumes, it absolutely rocks. That's where 100% of my listening is.

Zero hiss at max volume. Runs hot though - its got a temperature display at the front. I was worried when it started to climb to 44 degrees C, but it stayed there even after 2 hours of operation at medium high volume.

I'm seriously impressed by SMSL and what they have achieved in such a small package.

 

[Poultrygeist]

I've read a comment/question regarding noise that appears to emanate from the display driver. I can tell you that within the PSU, the display driver module is directly next to the switching unit which is shielded. The grey box has an EMI/RFI shielding tape applied which I can tell you made my very minimal, barely noticeable noise go away in it's entirety. The black, metal cover is the PSU, the yellow taped box is another part of the PSU, most likely a part of a coil.

Hope this info helps the poster with the display noise. Like I said mine came with some noise from the factory. I don't mind breaking the warranty and found 2 major issues, I had the tell-tale noise coming from surrounding electronics, in my case my computer which has it's own power source separate from all audio equipment which is all connected to a huge power filter feed my audio gear cleaner power. I live in Tokyo in an apartment complex with over 460 individual units. The power is actually virtually noise free. Our complex has annual timed black-outs for maintenance of the mains power and it's relatively clean.

When my DA-9 arrived, it replaced my the older DA-8s. That unit had a brick style adaptor which I really hate as they are built as cheaply as possible. The DA-9 when it first arrived and placed in the same place as the da8s had immediate noise issues. Moving it around while plugged in would change the level of noise. So I promptly removed the rear cover and found that the two power chips had 20% in total of the chip's surface area covered with thermal paste. This prompted me to remove all of the thermal grease with new grease. While I was in there, I had some of the silver coloured tape which is EMI/RFI rejection tape, so I applied it to the display driver. I applied the tape and the thermal grease at the same time since I was already in there. Upon reassembly and reconnecting the DA-9, all noise was gone. My DA-9 has been dead quiet/silent since I applied the new thermal grease. I used a grease that was rated in the mid 6's, you can find thermal grease under amazon and you'll note that they have rejection and effectiveness ratings, since then I've replaced the thermal grease again with grease that is rated at 12.8. I don't know exactly how the ratings work, but descriptions indicate that the higher numbers seem to be used for higher powered GPU's in computers, and Graphics cards are extremely noisy. So the higher rating seems to help with cooling and with noise rejection. My DA-9 runs colder to the touch than my Audio rack made out of MDF and Steel reinforced. The opening of the bottom cover will give you access to the inside of the amplifier. Be careful if you intend to completely remove the internals though with the internal wire that connects to the BT antenna, I had to replace mine since mine was made to the exact length and had no slack or extra length. You do not need to completely disassemble the amplifier to gain access to the amplifier chips. Light grey rectangle are the two chips. The unfortunate thing is once you open the lid, regardless of if your unit lacks grease or not, you must apply new thermal grease and completely remove the original grease once you break that seal. Fortunately you can find 2gram tubes of thermal grease on amazon for $6-12. To remove the thermal grease, isopropyl alcohol or "rubbing alcohol" is the most effective, though you can also use "Flux Cleaner" which is what I used (I wanted to clean the flux around the solder joints).

This is my experience with some of the noise issues which sound very similar to what the other poster a page or two ago had mentioned and a possible remedy. Though without actually measuring both amplifiers there is no way to give concrete evidence of cause and effect. It is my belief that the noise in my amplifier was caused by a lack of thermal grease, I don't think the thin (0.1mm) thick tape that I used to cover the LED driver actually did much, There are 2 layers of the material on the driver in my amplifier.

I run my amp at a 2.7 ohm load with my self made speakers. It's 2.7 and I had the same speakers working with the da8s for it's entire life and the unit was turned off a maximum of 4 times. I can only remember 3 times that I unplugged it. The same speakers, the newer DA-9 and completely noise free after my intervention. The application of the thermal grease is very easy with the supplied spreader that comes with the new thermal grease. 2 grams is the perfect amount once you completely remove the original thermal grease both from the chips, and the reverse side of the bottom lid.

Hope this helps.

Thanks it does help but a noise free amp should be a minimal expectation for one's hard earned dollars. I've owned lots of inexpensive class D amps and beside an on/off pop with a couple all have been extremely quiet. If the one I ordered is noisy I'll send it back in a heartbeat.

I started this class D thread on AK seven years ago.

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/tpa-3116-vs-the-tripaths.574806/

 

[SOUNDSONIC]

Received the SMSL A1 today. This amp is in a completely different plane compared to the DA-9 (its nearly twice as expensive too). This has to be the best amp I've ever had. The midrange is back! Voices are completely natural, yet it doesn't lose any of the cleanliness and accuracy.

Maybe not for everyone though, it sorta loses its grip a little bit at very high volumes. I suppose its got to do with only 15w @ 4ohms?
Low to medium high volumes, it absolutely rocks. That's where 100% of my listening is.

Zero hiss at max volume. Runs hot though - its got a temperature display at the front. I was worried when it started to climb to 44 degrees C, but it stayed there even after 2 hours of operation at medium high volume.

I'm seriously impressed by SMSL and what they have achieved in such a small package.

Finally youve got what you like. Seems youve got no issues on the 15w driving your speakers. Thats good. Some speakers are quite difficult to drive. Congrats and enjoy your new amp.....

 

[jokan]

Thanks it does help but a noise free amp should be a minimal expectation for one's hard earned dollars. I've owned lots of inexpensive class D amps and beside an on/off pop with a couple all have been extremely quiet. If the one I ordered is noisy I'll send it back in a heartbeat.

I started this class D thread on AK seven years ago.

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/tpa-3116-vs-the-tripaths.574806/

I agree that a noise free operation should be an absolute minimum expectation today. However SMSL seems to be knocking out as many new models as it possibly can. There's a new Headphone amp and New DAC in the "8" series. The new "A" series, and the "9" series. The issue isn't the chips used as the chipset by infenion/Merius is extremely good, it's not even the application that is the problem, it's a question of their quality control which I cannot defend. Fortunately, in my particular case it was a matter of not bothering to apply thermal grease as only 20% in total of the 2 chips combined had any grease on them, and it was obviously hand applied, and never even spread. I dubbed my particular amplifier a Monday morning, or Friday Lunch time build. Tired workers, or exhausted workers not paying attention to small details. It is NOT an excuse, but it was in my case a very simple fix. I took the gamble to open mine because minus the noise that would change by moving the unit around while powered on, I had zero other sonic issues so I new the chips were ok, it was something internal that was assembly related that was the root of the problem. At $249, I don't expect much, but the noise was unacceptable, and again it was a very easy fix in my case. Did I forget to stress that my DA-9 after my intervention is dead quiet. As in ZERO noise coming from anything. The silence is literally pitch black, there is no noise no matter the brightness of the LED screen. The soundstage, scale is huge which is the really impressive thing about this amplifier. Most people who have a trouble free DA-9 all say the same thing, that the shape and size of the soundstage that the amplifier can produce is not something you can find in amplifier that cost many, many times more. It's great to introduce new products if the technology is truly new, and the sound is truly good and also have the Hi-Res label mean anything. If there is nothing above 20khz, then the amplifier doesn't comply to the Hi-Res standard yet they apply the silkscreen logo.

The TPA 3116 is not even close to what the Infenion/Merius chips can do as far as sound quality, though I do have a few 3116 amps. You can find them for $25 (at least in Japan) that have BT 5.0 and only 3.5mm inputs but can accept up to 24vdc and produce incredible sound for next to no money, however you have to supply your own 24vdc, 5-6amp power supply effectively doubling the price. The 3116's are great in their own regard (like I said I have a few), but this is a thread on the DA-9.

Like you, I have also been down the rabbit hole of class-D amplification for about 8 years now and with my equipment, the DA-9 is not only a standout, it's possibly my favourite amplifier that I own that isn't tube driven and fully customized by myself.

SMSL must get their act together as far as quality control. It doesn't matter what the financial spend is, it should be built right the first time. I will not make excuses for them. But I will offer a potential fix for users who've encountered the same noise issue that I did, and there are several users on this forum who have had the same issue, some have pre-empted the noise issue after reading my early contributions towards the first 10 pages or so.

My amplifier in it's current state hasn't been turned off/unplugged in over a month as I'm always listening to something. I've encountered absolutely zero issues of any kind much like my previous DA-8s which was also used in a manner where it was never turned off other than occasionally moving it from room to room, only to be immediately repowered. I stand by SMSL in the hopes that they will improve their quality control once they stop messing around and producing multiple units to see which one will "hit/sell". I'm sure that they are building all of these new units to see which ones will sell, and which won't. They use essentially the same chassis in 3-4 sizes and the guts can be swapped out to suit another device at a moments notice. I have no doubt that they will get their act together shortly. Once these new releases are over, hopefully they'll start on firmware updates and not entirely new circuit boards as they did with the first SU-8's (The silver units with tiny OLED screens).

Hopefully we'll get clear answers about the performance of the DA-9 that can be measured one day. And hopefully by that time the QC issues are rectified before Amir goes and measures the amplifier. I would volunteer my amplifier for measurements but mine is no longer "factory" so the measurements wouldn't be the same as a completely factory fresh unit. Plus I'm not paying for shipping to another country for testing.

 

[ShinMolina]

Have you people seen the SMSL AO200? I don't know if it's fake or something. It doesn't appear on SMSL website and there is nothing to be found on Google.

The chassis has screws on the front and it's not as sleek as the DA-9, it also costs a little bit more. Could it be revision to the DA-9? Here is a link to the product from Aliexpress:

Aliexpress SMSL AO200 Amplifier

 

[adamjohari]

Just got mine today. IT'S SO MUCH BETTER than my Fosi Audio

 

[SOUNDSONIC]

Just got mine today. IT'S SO MUCH BETTER than my Fosi Audio

View attachment 136130

I told you....