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PS Audio PowerPlant P12 Review (Video)

amirm

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It has been a while since I had done a video for the channel. So I decided to do one on PS Audio P12 AC Regenerator because so many youtubers had asked for it in the past comments. Was very tired from dealing with flood clean up in our home late at night so please excuse the bit of slowness at the start. Nothing new beyond the text measurement although you can read more into my voice than in few words that are in the review thread:


If you haven't seen the text review, here it is: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...io-powerplant-12-review-ac-regenerator.31298/
 

Zorlac

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I hope PSAudio and similar companies that have been scamming buyers are starting to get nervous. Hopefully this pushes the industry forward and we start seeing legit devices in this area (if that is even possible).
 

Tks

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I hope PSAudio and similar companies that have been scamming buyers are starting to get nervous. Hopefully this pushes the industry forward and we start seeing legit devices in this area (if that is even possible).
Theres a sort of phenomena where people in groups actually strengthen their roots when the main thing they admire makes bolder claims that go tested by outsiders and demonstrate the claims to be largely weak. It serves as validation of how vindicating such “haters” can be, in their minds seemingly wanting to do anything to “bring us down”.

For die hards, this is only more proof that objectivists/others only “listen to graphs”.

Its somewhat funny, when talking with heavy subjectivists, I have brought up a purposefully silly hypothetical where I ask should I lick my finger and touch a live outlet to test how much power is clean and available for my devices. The thing is, I was using this example in discussions over DACs and lossless file formats. In this case with power regenerators. Heavy subjectivists would have very little choice other than to actually bite this bullet un-ironically seeing as how its an apt example to the actual device reviewed here.
 

Lambda

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@amirm Was there a load on the Powersupply or the power re-generator?
How can there be a ground loop/what is the loop part? is the power brick you measured ground referenced?

You measure the distortion performance of your probe at 26V but it is to be assumed distortion rises with level?! so 26V distortion is not comparable to 120V distortion.

(i'm not saying the PS audio thing is improving the sound)

Also how can you claim -115dB is the absolute limit you can hear?
In this case you where talking about background noise ( so always present and not related to the signal).

Assuming for example the amplifier headphone combination could produce 120dBSPL at -20dB
it would make +25dBSPL alt noise even if the amplifier noise is only -115dB.

The numbers are made up but it shows that this statement is not to be generalized.
 

phoenixdogfan

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This probably makes perfect sense to those individuals who have been buying Brita Filters for their tap water all their lives. :facepalm:
 

Ismapics

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Like in other reviews, these things resolve a problem that does not exists. They are profit generators for the whole value chain. Imagine you are at the audio dealer buying 2 mono blocks for your system at $6K each or more. The salesman comes and says, are you going to trust your New mono blocks to the power company? Really. You need an AC Regan. Boom Sold $5,500 more to the tab. At 45% margin to the store that is $2,475 in additional profit, $275 in commissions to the salesman. PS Audio should be making gross 55%, $1,663 in profit or much more for each one sold. All for the un-informed consumer with disposable income.
 
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amirm

amirm

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@amirm Was there a load on the Powersupply or the power re-generator?
The raw AC measurements were unloaded. The Topping A90 and two power supply tests naturally presented their load, albeit small one.

As I have mentioned, the #1 application for these devices is low power, sources. Even audiophiles that believe in this stuff take advice of their amp manufacturer and don't plug them into these boxes.
 

Doodski

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Like in other reviews, these things resolve a problem that does not exists. They are profit generators for the whole value chain. Imagine you are at the audio dealer buying 2 mono blocks for your system at $6K each or more. The salesman comes and says, are you going to trust your New mono blocks to the power company? Really. You need an AC Regan. Boom Sold $5,500 more to the tab. At 45% margin to the store that is $2,475 in additional profit, $275 in commissions to the salesman. PS Audio should be making gross 55%, $1,663 in profit or much more for each one sold. All for the un-informed consumer with disposable income.
Hmmz. I sold home audio gear for 9 years and 5 years of that was straight commission. I earned commission on a sliding scale. So for example I earned 20% of the profit on 20%-25% markup, 21% on 25%-27% markup, 22% on 27%-29% markup etc up to a maximum of 25% of the profit margin. Then there where cash spiffs, perks like expensive dinners, lunches and breakfasts, free sports equipment or whatever the hardware gift was that day, free stereo gear, free after work parties, free PECS (professional education seminars) meetings for ~4 months of the year every Tuesday and Thursday with pizza and drinks and free trips to Las Vegas for the CES. To make ~$275.00 commission on a $2475.00 profit would be not enough to make a proper living. It's a difficult job and requires people with special skills to make it work. The demand on the position is pretty comprehensive and it's a lifestyle as well as a profession. Not for clerks and posers. The failure rate is high and those that can make a go of it earn enough coin to buy real estate, save for retirement, purchase stocks and live a decent lifestyle because they deserve that for their steady effort, steady dedication and loyalty to the occupation. It's not a easy job to do daily year after year and that's why the failure rate is so high. So your estimate of the commission is low.
 

Ismapics

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Hmmz. I sold home audio gear for 9 years and 5 years of that was straight commission. I earned commission on a sliding scale. So for example I earned 20% of the profit on 20%-25% markup, 21% on 25%-27% markup, 22% on 27%-29% markup etc up to a maximum of 25% of the profit margin. Then there where cash spiffs, perks like expensive dinners, lunches and breakfasts, free sports equipment or whatever the hardware was that day, free stereo gear, free after work parties, free PECS (professional education seminars) meetings for ~4 months of the year every Tuesday and Thursday with pizza and drinks and free trips to Las Vegas for the CES. To make ~$275.00 commission on a $2475.00 profit would be not enough to make a proper living. It's a difficult job and requires people with special skills to make it work. The demand on the position is pretty comprehensive and it's a lifestyle as well as a profession. Not for clerks and posers. The failure rate is high and those that can make a go of it earn enough coin to buy real estate, save for retirement, purchase stocks and live a decent lifestyle because they deserve that for their steady effort, steady dedication and loyalty to the occupation. It's not a easy job to do daily year after year and that's why the failure rate is so high. So your estimate of the commission is low.
I say you are right, I am just doing simple math. But reality should not be that far, they are a profit maker for audio stores like cables. Still they are sold under a premise of partly miss information and partly fear.
 
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amirm

amirm

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Also how can you claim -115dB is the absolute limit you can hear?
In this case you where talking about background noise ( so always present and not related to the signal).

Assuming for example the amplifier headphone combination could produce 120dBSPL at -20dB
it would make +25dBSPL alt noise even if the amplifier noise is only -115dB.
This is based on reference listening level of 110 to 120 dBSPL. BTW, it is trivial for a headphone and amp to generate 120 dBSPL. I test at 114 dBSPL in all of my headphone measurements.
 

Doodski

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I say you are right, I am just doing simple math. But reality should not be that far, they are a profit maker for audio stores like cables. Still they are sold under a premise of partly miss information and partly fear.
I never sold anything like a regen unit. Cables where for integrity of connections and conductors and not for sound quality, speakers where a major money maker and where upsold whenever possible and constituted a major major portion of the total sales. I can see where unscrupulous or unaware/ignorant sale people push regens and snake-oil cables etc onto trusting clients. But for long term success a salesperson needs a loyal following of repeat customers and that includes telling customers "No" sometimes to purchases that are a waste of money. It creates trust to tell them no and not be a yes man on everything.
 

CtheArgie

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Like in other reviews, these things resolve a problem that does not exists. They are profit generators for the whole value chain. Imagine you are at the audio dealer buying 2 mono blocks for your system at $6K each or more. The salesman comes and says, are you going to trust your New mono blocks to the power company? Really. You need an AC Regan. Boom Sold $5,500 more to the tab. At 45% margin to the store that is $2,475 in additional profit, $275 in commissions to the salesman. PS Audio should be making gross 55%, $1,663 in profit or much more for each one sold. All for the un-informed consumer with disposable income.
PS Audio only sells direct.
 

GDK

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PS Audio only sells direct.
AudioConnexion here in Canada sells them, but maybe it’s only direct elsewhere.

Edit: I tried to include a link, but it won’t work for some reason.
 

Doodski

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Where does it say that? That must be a Canadian issue or outside the US only.

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