Pioneer releases new Elite flagship AVR VSX-LX805 with XLR inputs/outputs for front L/R channels

[DrStranger]

More VSX, no SC in sight.

 

[ea666]

Pure out of interest. What was it that you missed about the Pioneers? I had a Denon 3805 way back, then Onkyo 905 and 906 and got a Pioneer LX85 and a LX59 next. Now on a Denon 4800H and got the feeling you described but then the other way around, so curious.

I must add that the remote of the LX85 was the best I ever used. Really missed that remote.

When watching movies, with my speakers package at the time Monitor Audio Gold AV the pioneer had more excitement. I never use the AV to listen to music so wouldn't have any experience on that side, but I have the Denon x3700H at present and whilst it's good, just not excited by it. I was originally looking at the X4800H but gonna wait for the pioneer now as it also support QMS.

 

[ea666]

More VSX, no SC in sight.

with the VSX-LX805 model already floating around at the £2,500 price range, god forbid what the SC models will come in at.

 

[sarumbear]

XLR input could be used by an external dac

So that it goes through a ADC then a DAC?

 

[sarumbear]

I don’t get component input in 2023, nor the AM radio, neither the balanced CD input. This is a digital device isn’t it, hence all analogue input will be digitised by an ADC.

 

[MarcT]

I don’t get component input in 2023, nor the AM radio, neither the balanced CD input. This is a digital device isn’t it, hence all analogue input will be digitised by an ADC.

Unless there is a "pure direct" mode you can use.

 

[sarumbear]

Unless there is a "pure direct" mode you can use.

There is indeed Pure Direct mode. But why would anyone use a 7.2.4 (11-ch) AVR with Dirac in 2.0 mode, and not even use a sub?

When analog signals are being input in the Pure Direct mode, the modes switches to the Analog Direct mode which passes signals directly to the amplifier without passing through the DSP (Digital Signal Processor). (p203)

https://www.pioneerhomeusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/VSX-LX805_Manual_En_29404079_Elite.pdf

 

[dlaloum]

I don’t get component input in 2023, nor the AM radio, neither the balanced CD input. This is a digital device isn’t it, hence all analogue input will be digitised by an ADC.

It does have analogue bypass ( pure direct ? ) , but then you also bypass room eq etc..

 

[Tanquen]

I'm waiting on the Denon X6800H if it comes out. The AH1 is just too much money with no improvement in sound quality. The only thing I'm hoping will improve the sound quality would be Dirac Live and the Denon doesn't even include the regular license, let alone the subs. At least the Pioneer comes with the main license, but I noticed it has the option for the multiple sub license but it doesn't seem to have discrete multiple sub outputs?

 

[dlaloum]

I'm waiting on the Denon X6800H if it comes out. The AH1 is just too much money with no improvement in sound quality. The only thing I'm hoping will improve the sound quality would be Dirac Live and the Denon doesn't even include the regular license, let alone the subs. At least the Pioneer comes with the main license, but I noticed it has the option for the multiple sub license but it doesn't seem to have discrete multiple sub outputs?

Well the X6800 should be interesting...

Especially now that it has some serious competition from PiOnkIo ... I expect it will be substantially more expensive than the equivalent PiOnkIo....

 

[AdilM]

Does Pioneer do the 'advanced pre amp' mode as Sound United does?

My SC-LX86 has the pre amp mode but I can't find that setting in LX805. Good thing is LX805 can set individual speaker frequencies unlike mine which can only do 80/100hz for all

 

[AdilM]

I have to say I’ve truly missed my pioneer av amp. Having had the LX83 and the LX95 never really been 100% with the denon’s. Looks like I’m going to have explain to the mrs why my son has an av amp in his room

I am going to have same problem with my mrs. I have configured many Denon for my friends but I never liked the sound. My LX86 is still the best and the iphone/ipad app is way ahead of time.

 

[JRColeman]

Does Pioneer do the 'advanced pre amp' mode as Sound United does?

I think the SC LX-904 does.

 

[Chr1]

I have the SC-LX86 and love it... and the phone app.
Just wish someone could get one of SC-LX class D AVRs to Amir for testing as I suspect they are pretty good.

 

[Goolsby]

I have the SC-LX86 and love it... and the phone app.
Just wish someone could get one of SC-LX class D AVRs to Amir for testing as I suspect they are pretty good.

This is an old review of the SC-95, my old receiver. It's not as in-depth as a review that Amir would do, but on sheer wattage delivery alone, it's pretty impressive, considering it still hits 108 watts with 7 channels driven. I hope the 805 can perform well with the symmetric AB design.

SC-95 Sound and Vision Review (Skip to the last page for the numbers)

Unfortunately, sound and vision stopped listing these numbers in more recent reviews.

 

[Chr1]

This is an old review of the SC-95, my old receiver. It's not as in-depth as a review that Amir would do, but on sheer wattage delivery alone, it's pretty impressive, considering it still hits 108 watts with 7 channels driven. I hope the 805 can perform well with the symmetric AB design.

SC-95 Sound and Vision Review (Skip to the last page for the numbers)

Unfortunately, sound and vision stopped listing these numbers in more recent reviews.

Thanks for the link.... Though I suspect that the figures quoted are straight from Pioneer rather than independently tested unfortunately. Hence ASR and Amir's testing being so interesting.

Can't remember what forum that I pulled it from but I have this in a file of info on the SC-LX86... It relates to German testing of the actual power output:

"Also just regarding the true power of the sc-lx86 from 12 months ago, here are some interesting measured lab results, which may clear up some posts earlier suggesting they have the same input power as output power... (translated to english,but honestly written as can be):

"Pulse amplifiers great fit for multi-channel receivers, high efficiency helps to solve some of the problems of thermal as well as reduce the overall dimensions of power. A single tip Pioneer generates power 171 W at 8 ohms and 283 W at 4 ohms - an excellent result, but in a direct comparison somewhat weaker than the Denon AVC-A1HD."

"The Pioneer stereo praises the power of 2 x 161 W and 2 x 264 W (8 and 4 ohms), performs well when connecting more channels, Five-channel (so we have a load test) providing 5 x 119 watts (8 ohms) and up to 5 x 142 W (4 ohms). As for the pulse system, the noise level (-83 dB) is not at all high, and the dynamics reaches 105 dB. Frequency response is a good illustration of the operation of the pulse amplifier, which play an important role output filters".

So the actual power was 161w into 2ch & 119w into 5ch both @ 8 ohms. So we can assume the sc-lx87 will be a little more powerful."

Anyway, my general feeling is that it can't be a good idea to cram lots of heat producing Class A/B amplifiers into a small space ala most AVR s, and that this is a classic example of where cool running Class D is most useful. Just a shame that we don't really have a lot of objective data to go on as yet...

 

[Goolsby]

Thanks for the link.... Though I suspect that the figures quoted are straight from Pioneer rather than independently tested unfortunately. Hence ASR and Amir's testing being so interesting.

Can't remember what forum that I pulled it from but I have this in a file of info on the SC-LX86... It relates to German testing of the actual power output:

"Also just regarding the true power of the sc-lx86 from 12 months ago, here are some interesting measured lab results, which may clear up some posts earlier suggesting they have the same input power as output power... (translated to english,but honestly written as can be):

"Pulse amplifiers great fit for multi-channel receivers, high efficiency helps to solve some of the problems of thermal as well as reduce the overall dimensions of power. A single tip Pioneer generates power 171 W at 8 ohms and 283 W at 4 ohms - an excellent result, but in a direct comparison somewhat weaker than the Denon AVC-A1HD."

"The Pioneer stereo praises the power of 2 x 161 W and 2 x 264 W (8 and 4 ohms), performs well when connecting more channels, Five-channel (so we have a load test) providing 5 x 119 watts (8 ohms) and up to 5 x 142 W (4 ohms). As for the pulse system, the noise level (-83 dB) is not at all high, and the dynamics reaches 105 dB. Frequency response is a good illustration of the operation of the pulse amplifier, which play an important role output filters".

So the actual power was 161w into 2ch & 119w into 5ch both @ 8 ohms. So we can assume the sc-lx87 will be a little more powerful."

Anyway, my general feeling is that it can't be a good idea to cram lots of heat producing Class A/B amplifiers into a small space ala most AVR s, and that this is a classic example of where cool running Class D is most useful. Just a shame that we don't really have a lot of objective data to go onbas yet...

I believe the tests were done in the sound and vision lab, as those numbers are nowhere to be found on Pioneers website, including the product sheet. Anyway, I think the idea behind the symmetric design (And I am no engineer) is that there are two separate rows of amplifier modules on separate sides of the receiver. This would isolate them from each other so they don't collectively produce more heat. It also appears the heatsinks are of higher quality in the 805, and the device also includes fans. Not saying this will outclass a class d (see what I did there), but it does show they are thinking of different ways to improve heat dissipation and efficiency.

 

[Chr1]

I believe the tests were done in the sound and vision lab, as those numbers are nowhere to be found on Pioneers website, including the product sheet. Anyway, I think the idea between the symmetric design (And I am no engineer) is that there are two separate rows of amplifier modules on separate sides of the receiver. This would isolate them from each other so they don't collectively produce more heat. It also appears the heatsinks are of higher quality in the 805, and the device also includes fans. Not saying this will outclass a class d (see what I did there), but it does show they are thinking of different ways to improve heat dissipation and efficiency.

Apologies. I was suspicious when I saw 135W x2, as it just seems like a number plucked from a spec sheet to me. Symmetrical design makes sense for sure but there is still a lot of heat in a small space. Anyway, the bottom line is that the data is minimal and doesn't really give a clear indication of real life performance unfortunately. Again, hence the value of Amir's testing.

 

[Goolsby]

Apologies. I was suspicious when I saw 135W x2, as it just seems like a number plucked from a spec sheet to me. Symmetrical design makes sense for sure but there is still a lot of heat in a small space. Anyway, the bottom line is that the data is minimal and doesn't really give a clear indication of real life performance unfortunately. Again, hence the value of Amir's testing.

Yes, it will be interesting to see what his tests reveal. It didn't go so well with the 505, which I currently have. I am very interested in selling my 505 and getting the 805 though.

 

[Goolsby]

Apologies. I was suspicious when I saw 135W x2, as it just seems like a number plucked from a spec sheet to me. Symmetrical design makes sense for sure but there is still a lot of heat in a small space. Anyway, the bottom line is that the data is minimal and doesn't really give a clear indication of real life performance unfortunately. Again, hence the value of Amir's testing.

Also, you may have been looking at the wrong spot. At the end of the review, it has a section called test bench. This is the first half:

Pioneer Elite SC-95 A/V Receiver Review Test Bench​

Test Bench
Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 132.4 watts
1% distortion at 159.0 watts
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 121.6 watts
1% distortion at 140.8 watts
Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 96.7 watts
1% distortion at 108.5 watts
Analog frequency response in Pure Direct mode:
–0.10 dB at 10 Hz
–0.03 dB at 20 Hz
+1.11 dB at 20 kHz
–1.08 dB at 50 kHz.
Analog frequency response with signal processing:
–0.80 dB at 10 Hz
–0.25 dB at 20 Hz
+0.97 dB at 20 kHz
–63.87 dB at 50 kHz.