NAD M33 Streaming Amplifier Review

[Geert]

I just came across Nad C298 amplifier review which rivals Benchmark AHB2 amps! Add a Node 2i and maybe Schiit Freya you are done and come in below M33!

Dirac?

 

[pdxaudio]

I have’t had these problems at all. Had my M33 for 3 months. I have my M33 connected by ethernet cable.

Mine is connected through Ethernet too but I’ve tried WiFi as well, but it doesn’t seem to be related to the network connection since I was also able to reproduce this issue from an external device like Node 2i which has this problem when connected through coaxial or optical but it plays fine when connected through line in.

 

[Kaboo]

Only you can say whether one sounds better for you. If the M33 is not a significant improvement to your ears over the c390dd then your decision to stick with what you have is 100% spot on. I know how you feel - took me many years to swap out my amp and it was the M33 that finally convinced me to do it because it is simply brilliant to my ears - but we're all different.

Also keep in mind that you can still do full room correction on the c390dd. A Roon subscription, a bluos network bridge MDC for the c390dd - which I think you said you had anyway ... ( MDC BluOS 2i - NAD Electronics ) ... and the free REW software gives you the ability to do anything that DIRAC can do (and better in my view).

I read a review that says the m33 is not using ess 9028 pro dac chips but is using ES9028Q2M mobile chips .Is this really the case.This is a much inferior chip.Is this the problem with the distortion as these are 2 channel chips and not eight as the pro are.Why use these cheap mobile chips on the m33?

 

[pogo]

But this has nothing to do with the distortion problem.
The dual ESS ES9028QM (each run in mono mode) was probably a conscious design decision and the better choice for this application.

 

[jaymusic]

I read a review that says the m33 is not using ess 9028 pro dac chips but is using ES9028Q2M mobile chips .Is this really the case.This is a much inferior chip.Is this the problem with the distortion as these are 2 channel chips and not eight as the pro are.Why use these cheap mobile chips on the m33?

I don't think that is the problem.
I do know that to my ears the M33 sounds superb, but the issue being highlighted is real. There is some clipping going on when using subwoofers.
It's not a problem for me as it's easily solved with Roon, but for others streaming direct from Qobuz, Amazon, Tidal , etc.. it can be on certain passages in certain songs.
I don't get too hung up on which chip is being used. The experience of the sound is more important.

 

[jaymusic]

I did not experience this problem in the 6 months or so that I had the M33. Don’t have it with the M10 that I own, either.

The problem is not there unless you are using subwoofers.

 

[SIY]

The problem is not there unless you are using subwoofers.

I am. 110Hz crossover.

 

[jaymusic]

I am. 110Hz crossover.

Well then you've either not noticed it (it is very rare - only certain passages of a few songs..maybe 1 in 1000 I have heard) - or there is some manufacturing difference/component difference in production runs. Might be the power module that is known to be an issue is only in some units???
Who knows.

 

[Kaboo]

Well then you've either not noticed it (it is very rare - only certain passages of a few songs..maybe 1 in 1000 I have heard) - or there is some manufacturing difference/component difference in production runs. Might be the power module that is known to be an issue is only in some units???
Who knows.

I believe the clipping is happening on a large percentage of new music because of how music is mostly recorded these days If you are a person who is trying to listen to new music recently recorded this clipping issue is a problem maybe this machine was made for the classic music listeners. What a shame. Nad is catering to a dying clientele.

 

[jaymusic]

I believe the clipping is happening on a large percentage of new music because of how music is mostly recorded these days If you are a person who is trying to listen to new music recently recorded this clipping issue is a problem maybe this machine was made for the classic music listeners. What a shame. Nad is catering to a dying clientele.

What utter nonsense.
You have clearly never heard the M33.
Made for classical music?

 

[Kw6]

Dirac?

Sorry there will be no Dirac!

 

[fcracer]

Well then you've either not noticed it (it is very rare - only certain passages of a few songs..maybe 1 in 1000 I have heard) - or there is some manufacturing difference/component difference in production runs. Might be the power module that is known to be an issue is only in some units???
Who knows.

I think we had already come to the conclusion many pages back that the M33 has a relatively common issue called intersample clipping with a specific combination of settings: Subwoofer output ON and tone controls OFF. I expect NAD will have a fix for this; given how easy it would be for them to attenuate the digital signal by 3db, I assume they’re looking at a more sophisticated fix (in the DA conversion itself) where they won’t lose SNR by attenuating.

You can learn more about what the root cause of the issue is at https://www.musictech.net/tutorials/10mm-no211-inter-sample-peaks/

Furthermore, many DACs have this issue so it’s not isolated to the M33. Because I don’t have a subwoofer attached, the issue never arises and has no impact on me. If I did have a subwoofer, I’d either run with the tone controls on (which attenuates the signal by 6db) or I’d avoid listening to music recorded so poorly as to cause intersample clipping. This really isn’t a big deal and I don’t know why people are making such an issue out of it.

 

[pogo]

I think we had already come to the conclusion many pages back that the M33 has a relatively common issue called intersample clipping with a specific combination of settings: Subwoofer output ON and tone controls OFF.

Don't forget the other case:

'Clipping bug confirmed by NAD engineers. Bug limited to only those who use subwoofer and never run Dirac live or use Dirac filters with too levels too high.'

In my case, the second case occurs with main speakers only. I had already uploaded an sound example in this thread.

And here is another review where the distortion issue was noticed:
M33 Review

 

[SIY]

Imagine, misadjusting settings can cause an issue. Inconceivable!

 

[Geert]

I don't know how Dirac is implemented on the M33, so does the M33 allow you to tune the filter level or is this fully automated?

 

[SIY]

I don't know how Dirac is implemented on the M33, so does the M33 allow you to tune the filter level or is this fully automated?

It is user controlled during Dirac setup.

 

[Kaboo]

What utter nonsense.
You have clearly never heard the M33.
Made for classical music?

I believe I said classic not classical.

 

[Kaboo]

What utter nonsense.
You have clearly never heard the M33.
Made for classical music?

And yes I own the M33

 

[Kw6]

Which speakers were used?
Dirac Live on/off?

Off but should try on again and as it totally change sound from warm to more neutral (colder) with way more bass and louder with same volume on the display screen! My speakers are Martin Logan motion ESL!

 

[jaymusic]

Off but should try on again and as it totally change sound from warm to more neutral (colder) with way more bass and louder with same volume on the display screen! My speakers are Martin Logan motion ESL!

Dirac made your volume louder with the same volume setting?
That's surprising.
Reduces my volume by about 8db for the same volume setting vs no DIRAC.