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KEF LS50 Meta Review (Bookshelf Speaker) Video

amirm

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VBSurrey

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Hi Amir,

Many thanks for an extremely informative video tutorial. I just have one question regarding listening distance. Due to room size and personal preference my listening distance (measured from the front of each speaker to my listening position) is 3 metres. Which graph would tell me if a speaker is appropriate for this listening distance?

If I may make the question more specific. Will the Genelec 8030 C which you have measured and rated highly the appropriate at this listening distance?

Greatly appreciate your assistance
 

MZKM

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Hi Amir,

Many thanks for an extremely informative video tutorial. I just have one question regarding listening distance. Due to room size and personal preference my listening distance (measured from the front of each speaker to my listening position) is 3 metres. Which graph would tell me if a speaker is appropriate for this listening distance?

If I may make the question more specific. Will the Genelec 8030 C which you have measured and rated highly the appropriate at this listening distance?

Greatly appreciate your assistance
Are you simply talking in SPL?
Amir doesn’t do max SPL testing for fear of damage and the fact that he does it indoors. He does comment on loudness in his listening test though. Active speakers will be based on internal amplification, but if a passive speakers has low distortion in the 96dB THD test, then it likely can get louder, but if it going wild then you likely won’t be able to go to 100dB on them.

I think only the larger coaxial Genelecs can perform in a living room, especially for movie duty, not sure.
 

VBSurrey

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Hi

Many thanks for the response. I am not really concerned about SPL. I listen at around 80db so I do not see that as a problem. The question really was about whether there is a difference between near field monitors and mid field monitors. If there is a difference which graph in Amir's reviews would highlight the difference?
 

testp

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Hi

Many thanks for the response. I am not really concerned about SPL. I listen at around 80db so I do not see that as a problem. The question really was about whether there is a difference between near field monitors and mid field monitors. If there is a difference which graph in Amir's reviews would highlight the difference?

you are about the same volume requirements i have, ~86db's max... i would say keep away from very small drivers ~4 inch and smaller,

5"+ seems ok, maybe just a little thin if no subs are planned..

i have found starting from 6.5" fits the best with no subs as a starting point
 

tomtoo

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Hi

Many thanks for the response. I am not really concerned about SPL. I listen at around 80db so I do not see that as a problem. The question really was about whether there is a difference between near field monitors and mid field monitors. If there is a difference which graph in Amir's reviews would highlight the difference?

Not realy. Usually you call something midfield or farfield if it has enough output for this scenario. Another thing is if the drivers far away from each other. If your tweeter is 1.50m away from the bass, its easy to imagine that a listening distance from 80cm is suboptimal. But with a coaxial there is nothing to talk about,
 

VBSurrey

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To be more specific. Will a pair of Genelec 8030Cs with subs sound any different from a pair of Genelec 1032Cs with identical subs?
The 1032s are roughly 3 times the price of the8030s.
Hence the question
Listening distance 3 metres and SPL 80 db
Many thanks for taking the time to respond
 

testp

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To be more specific. Will a pair of Genelec 8030Cs with subs sound any different from a pair of Genelec 1032Cs with identical subs?
The 1032s are roughly 3 times the price of the8030s.
Hence the question
Listening distance 3 metres and SPL 80 db
Many thanks for taking the time to respond

im no expert, but i'd approach it from SPL 80db point of view, that both genelec's provide the volume needed and genelecs are accurate, so i'd expect them to just about be the same...

however, just comparing bass driver size's of the 2, i'd say if you would go with 1032C, they have already 10" bass drivers, so you would maybe be happy without sub's with them, again 80db-86db isnt a big deal for most of them(genelecs)...

also i've seen users with 80... switch to 10.... genelec's for some reason, so maybe someone with this change can chime in...
 
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tomtoo

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To be more specific. Will a pair of Genelec 8030Cs with subs sound any different from a pair of Genelec 1032Cs with identical subs?
The 1032s are roughly 3 times the price of the8030s.
Hence the question
Listening distance 3 metres and SPL 80 db
Many thanks for taking the time to respond

There will be differences. Different speaker sound different. But i would not think they are realy big under this circumstancs.
 

VBSurrey

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Thanks for the responses. I am aware of the woofer size difference. But, given the use of subs and a high pass filter of, say, 80 Hz on the subs, will the smaller woofer in the monitor be audible?
 

tomtoo

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A 8inch supported by a sub is more than enough for this level.
 

rebbiputzmaker

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Interesting review. I have yet to hear any really "room shaking" five inch speakers :)

But..

I am curious, the JBL at A130 aprox $200 a pair, with probably, a $5 five inch woofer, has substantially more low frequency output? I know you also found the JBL to have very low distortion, what do you think is going on, how are they doing this? TIA
 

MattHooper

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Excellent review! Great technical discussion.

I've heard the originals and they were quite competent sounding. I'd like to hear the metas. The claims made for the technical improvements are fascinating.
 

phoenixdogfan

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im no expert, but i'd approach it from SPL 80db point of view, that both genelec's provide the volume needed and genelecs are accurate, so i'd expect them to just about be the same...

however, just comparing bass driver size's of the 2, i'd say if you would go with 1032C, they have already 10" bass drivers, so you would maybe be happy without sub's with them, again 80db-86db isnt a big deal for most of them(genelecs)...

also i've seen users with 80... switch to 10.... genelec's for some reason, so maybe someone with this change can chime in...
Answer might depend on whether he already has a subwoofer.
 

Koeitje

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Hi

Many thanks for the response. I am not really concerned about SPL. I listen at around 80db so I do not see that as a problem. The question really was about whether there is a difference between near field monitors and mid field monitors. If there is a difference which graph in Amir's reviews would highlight the difference?
At an average SPL of 80dB you will get peaks up to 100dB depending on the source material.
 

Steve Dallas

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Interesting review. I have yet to hear any really "room shaking" five inch speakers :)

But..

I am curious, the JBL at A130 aprox $200 a pair, with probably, a $5 five inch woofer, has substantially more low frequency output? I know you also found the JBL to have very low distortion, what do you think is going on, how are they doing this? TIA

If you look at KEF's white papers, you will notice many, if not most, of their speakers have a similar downward slope in the bass frequencies. It appears they assume room gain will be present in most installations, which is probably a very good assumption.

I had the original LS0s in my office for many years, placed about 12" from the front wall, and they had plenty of bass for the driver size, without the need to pull down extreme room modes. (I can probably dig up some in-room measurements to illustrate this point.) IMHO, this is a design choice, not a technical limitation.

Edit: Here is an in-room measurement showing raw vs. a 1st round of manual PEQ correction: (I am sure I pushed everything below 1KHz up a dB or 3, but can't find those measurements if taken--probably not taken, because probably sounded right. That is my MO.)
LS50 Stereo MMM Comparison.png


Thirty-seven or 38Hz in-room. Not bad for a 5" driver.

Also of note is the fact that the original LS50 can perform just as well as the Meta, assuming you have good EQ capabilities.

Finally the LS50 has a FAR more competent cabinet materials and construction than the JBL A series. And, it has much better vertical directivity, and is a work of art, comparatively speaking.
 
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amirm

amirm

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Hi Amir,

Many thanks for an extremely informative video tutorial. I just have one question regarding listening distance. Due to room size and personal preference my listening distance (measured from the front of each speaker to my listening position) is 3 metres. Which graph would tell me if a speaker is appropriate for this listening distance?
My pleasure. As to your question, I wish I could tell you that with specificity but I can't. I can tell you that my listening distance was near that in a large room with a single speaker and I thought it was fine if you did not want to listen at very high levels.

If I may make the question more specific. Will the Genelec 8030 C which you have measured and rated highly the appropriate at this listening distance?
I think it would run out of amplification power earlier than these would assuming you use a powerful amp for the Meta.
 

testp

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If you look at KEF's white papers, you will notice many, if not most, of their speakers have a similar downward slope in the bass frequencies. It appears they assume room gain will be present in most installations, which is probably a very good assumption.

I had the original LS0s in my office for many years, placed about 12" from the front wall, and they had plenty of bass for the driver size, without the need to pull down extreme room modes. (I can probably dig up some in-room measurements to illustrate this point.) IMHO, this is a design choice, not a technical limitation.

Edit: Here is an in-room measurement showing raw vs. a 1st round of manual PEQ correction: (I am sure I pushed everything below 1KHz up a dB or 3, but can't find those measurements if taken--probably not taken, because probably sounded right. That is my MO.)
View attachment 146337

Thirty-seven or 38Hz in-room. Not bad for a 5" driver.

Also of note is the fact that the original LS50 can perform just as well as the Meta, assuming you have good EQ capabilities.

Finally the LS50 has a FAR more competent cabinet materials and construction than the JBL A series. And, it has much better vertical directivity, and is a work of art, comparatively speaking.


have you tried low-pass filter below 35Hz, if so did the bass change or stayed the same?

rgds,
Tp
 

Dennis_FL

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I had been looking at Genelec powered, and the passives Polk Audio's L100, & Golden Ear BRX. I wish there was a store where you can do a side by side. The KEF looks great.
 
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