How to do a proper headphone review on Youtube (Oluv's Gadgets)

[Jimbob54]

I meant both. Where is your evidence that the headphones sound differentaly on that demo, and that's it's not the original track looped over and over again, and the change in sound is placebo, because he puts different texts in when another headphone is playing so you think the sound changes as well because of that, when it's nothing more than a text change?

And by the way, what do you think real time graphs would tell you if they were there?

 

[dasdoing]

@100rounddrum
Have you realy tryed? I can hear the diference very clearly on my Samsung TV speakers.
throw a spectrum analyser in the chain if you need a measurement.
I actualy think you have some personal reason for saying this. I just asked my girlfriend, who has no notion about audio at all, played a little on my TV at mid volume for her and she could hear it easily. it's not possible that you can't realy hear it. you are or lying to yourself, or to us

 

[richard12511]

Well I literally can't hear any difference between the headphones and the original tracks in those sound demos... Don't know how you guys are hearing the Sundara as bright in that demo, it literally sounds the same as the Verum-1 and the original track.

Conclusion: absolutely useless

You really can't hear a difference? The differences are significant.

I can obviously hear differences with EQ changes.

I'm just saying, with any sound demo on youtube, yes also from Oluv, all the headphones sound exactly the same to me. Putting the original tracks inbetween the demos is useless as well, since they sound the exact same as the headphones that are demo'ed.

Besides, you can't see a real-time graph when the headphones are being demo-ed, so there's no evidence of any of the headphones sounding any different, on sound demos.

Heck, he could be using the original track over and over again, and just claim that a certain headphone is being played, while it was the original song all along! That's how it sounds like to me anyway.

I listened to the sound demo with my Senn HD650 and JDS Atom labs

If you can hear differences between EQ changes, then you should be able to hear differences between those demos. In this case, the differences are large enough to where the headphones you're listening on shouldn't really matter. I'm not even using headphones(just using my laptop's built in speakers), and I can easily hear large differences between all 3. Something is amiss.

 

[Jimbob54]

You really can't hear a difference? The differences are significant.



If you can hear differences between EQ changes, then you should be able to hear differences between those demos. In this case, the differences are large enough to where the headphones you're listening on shouldn't really matter. I'm not even using headphones(just using my laptop's built in speakers), and I can easily hear large differences between all 3. Something is amiss.

I suspect he's trying to make a point. Badly.

 

[100rounddrum]

Has this site turned to head-fi? Where is the measurable evidence that there is a sound difference between those demo'ed headphones, and that it isn't pure placebo because he has put text in saying a different headphone is playing?

 

[Jimbob54]

Has this site turned to head-fi? Where is the measurable evidence that there is a sound difference between those demo'ed headphones, and that it isn't pure placebo because he has put text in saying a different headphone is playing?

Deary me, this got very boring very quickly.

 

[richard12511]

Has this site turned to head-fi? Where is the measurable evidence that there is a sound difference between those demo'ed headphones, and that it isn't pure placebo because he has put text in saying a different headphone is playing?

Nothing to do with the text causing a placebo, as I can close my eyes and still tell which is which. I'll admit that the Verum vs Source comparison is somewhat close, but it's still audibly different over my Macbook Pro built in speakers. The Hifiman vs Source or Hifiman vs Verum comparisons sound very different though.

 

[bobbooo]

Nothing to do with the text causing a placebo, as I can close my eyes and still tell which is which. I'll admit that the Verum vs Source comparison is somewhat close, but it's still audibly different over my Macbook Pro built in speakers. The Hifiman vs Source or Hifiman vs Verum comparisons sound very different though.

Does he level-match?

 

[Jimbob54]

Does he level-match?

We have absolutely no idea. I get the point and I wouldnt use a YouTube demo to make a purchase decision. We also only perceive a change in sound to our ears when the tracks purport to swap between headphones, we don't know for sure it's not a trick to make us think it's swapped. However, all but one person commenting here believe they hear the sound change when the swaps happen. I don't care to investigate further.

 

[bobbooo]

We have absolutely no idea. I get the point and I wouldnt use a YouTube demo to make a purchase decision. We also only perceive a change in sound to our ears when the tracks purport to swap between headphones, we don't know for sure it's not a trick to make us think it's swapped. However, all but one person commenting here believe they hear the sound change when the swaps happen. I don't care to investigate further.

I'm not doubting the tracks are indeed different and people are hearing that difference, my point is if they're not SPL-matched the difference heard may be primarily due to an overall level difference (which can manifest in a perceived frequency response change due to the equal loudness contours), and so any actual frequency response differences may be obfuscated (if they are audible at all).

 

[Jimbob54]

I'm not doubting the tracks are indeed different and people are hearing that difference, my point is if they're not SPL-matched the difference heard may be primarily due to an overall level difference (which can manifest in a perceived frequency response change due to the equal loudness contours), and so any actual frequency response differences may be obfuscated (if they are audible at all).

Phew! Yes I agree, there are many questions I would want answering about the set up including levels if I was to try and take anything from the demos at all . I suppose its better than not auditioning at all but only just. But as an addition to a purely verbal review, I kinda like the demo approach.

 

[dasdoing]

come on @100rounddrum
take this example:

listen to the first 5 notes of the guitar on the original. Once the Verum comes it sound like a diferent mix even, the guitar is much louder. also you can't realy volume match completly diferent curves. match the guitar on this one for example, and the rest will sound too quiet.
and once again: use a spectrum analyser. I just through one in and that loud guitar is clearly visable peaking much higher

 

[Jimbob54]

come on @100rounddrum
take this example:

listen to the first 5 notes of the guitar on the original. Once the Verum comes it sound like a diferent mix even, the guitar is much louder. also you can't realy volume match completly diferent curves. match the guitar on this one for example, and the rest will sound too quiet.
and once again: use a spectrum analyser. I just through one in and that loud guitar is clearly visable peaking much higher

Yes, but the man likes graphs and charts ;-)

 

[raistlin65]

come on @100rounddrum
take this example:

listen to the first 5 notes of the guitar on the original. Once the Verum comes it sound like a diferent mix even, the guitar is much louder. also you can't realy volume match completly diferent curves. match the guitar on this one for example, and the rest will sound too quiet.
and once again: use a spectrum analyser. I just through one in and that loud guitar is clearly visable peaking much higher

I agree. People take the concept of the necessity of level matching for DACs and amps and apply it to speakers and headphones where the question becomes what do you level match? A specific frequency? The entire frequency range?

Personally, I find level matching to often be useless, as some headphones sound better to me at lower volumes. Some at higher volumes.

For example, Grado SR225 sound very good to me at moderate volumes. Turn them up, and they quickly become fatiguing due to the forward upper mids and treble.

HD6XX sound meh at moderate volume due to the demure treble response. Crank them up, and they sound much better.

 

[100rounddrum]

come on @100rounddrum
take this example:

listen to the first 5 notes of the guitar on the original. Once the Verum comes it sound like a diferent mix even, the guitar is much louder. also you can't realy volume match completly diferent curves. match the guitar on this one for example, and the rest will sound too quiet.
and once again: use a spectrum analyser. I just through one in and that loud guitar is clearly visable peaking much higher

I don't care about about even a billion people claiming to hear a sound difference, when there's no factual evidence to back it up.

I used a spectrum analyser myself, and it shows that there's a 4khz peak in the Verum. This confirms the tracks are not one and the same, but still who is to say he didn't mess with the EQ settings on the original track to give a perception that the headphones produce different sounds on the demo?

I mean this is a freaking science site, y'all should know your ears are useless and measured data is the only way to describe music with a certainty.

 

[raistlin65]

I don't care about about even a billion people claiming to hear a sound difference, when there's no factual evidence to back it up.

I used a spectrum analyser myself, and it shows that there's a 4khz peak in the Verum. This confirms the tracks are not one and the same, but still who is to say he didn't mess with the EQ settings on the original track to give a perception that the headphones produce different sounds on the demo?

I mean this is a freaking science site, y'all should know your ears are useless and measured data is the only way to describe music with a certainty.

I don't know about the original track, but I seem to remember that he processes the audio coming from the headphones to make it more like the headphones actually sound to him.

I believe it was in this video where he was critiquing Zeos's headphone demo recording setup

It is worth watching the video if you want to understand his process. Of course it's about a year old, so it could have changed some in the time since.

 

[Objectivist01]

And connected to what? I've never looked into how to best get Youtube through my home stereo without going USB to DAC (dont want).

Pretty sure cheap earbuds into phone playing the vid wouldnt enable you to hear any difference at all- but maybe some decent IEMS? I will have to experiment with that Oluv clip

But unless everything in chain from his mics to our headphones is neutral its pointless to compare stuff from YouTube videos

 

[Objectivist01]

I don't know about the original track, but I seem to remember that he processes the audio coming from the headphones to make it more like the headphones actually sound to him.

I believe it was in this video where he was critiquing Zeos's headphone demo recording setup

It is worth watching the video if you want to understand his process. Of course it's about a year old, so it could have changed some in the time since.

And are you listening to super flat dacs amps and headphones to make sure what he recorded is what your hear ?

 

[Jimbob54]

But unless everything in chain from his mics to our headphones is neutral its pointless to compare stuff from YouTube videos

Its pretty pointless anyway. The point we were going on then to dicuss is whether the changes in cans during the demos was audible - more than did the demos accurately reflect the sound of the cans . Once chap swears he cant tell a difference when Oluv changes the headphones during the demos. Everyone else says they can. Is this proof? Not really, but its too hot to argue.

 

[dasdoing]

I used a spectrum analyser

finaly

who is to say he didn't mess with the EQ settings on the original track to give a perception that the headphones produce different sounds on the demo?

how do you trust any meassurement then?
but we are coming closer to what your real issue is? you have one of those headphones and believe it should sound exactly the same as the original, right? this is impossible. there isn't even an industrie standard to meassure headphones (realative to flat). they will all colourize. the thing about headphones is to find a colorization that you like. If you found one just stick to it