How to do a proper headphone review on Youtube (Oluv's Gadgets)

[dasdoing]

here is the red target curve that Harman found beeing equal to flat loudspeakers, which is NOT the Harman curve.
it was created in the process of creating the first Harman curve (which is not the red one).
in the graph one can see the big diference to the 2017 Harman curve versions

here is the target btw for using in REW for example: https://github.com/jaakkopasanen/AutoEq/blob/master/compensation/loudspeaker_in-room_flat_2013.csv

 

[Thomas_A]

Even if we are different, the site is quite useful. Comparing the "original file" with the different headphones, I found the good old HD600 and DT250 quite neutral, with some deeper bass for the DT250. The Audeze with EQ applied was also fairly neutral, but so would most HP when EQued.

It would be nice to hear what people think about the most neutral ones, compared to the original file.

 

[lashto]

Is the Harman curve not based upon real world listening tests of real people choosing their preferred sound signature? Personally, I think the whole shape of the ear thing is a meaningless concern. Our ears may all be different, but our hearing systems are all tuned to the same baseline - aka the world around us. We live our entire lives with our ears hearing the sounds of reality and our brains adapt to that so that the shape of our ears are essentially neutralized from the equation. To me it makes little sense to try and evaluate headphones based on the shape of an individual ear.

And I believe Oluv is pretty big on the Harman curve is he not?

You might be into something it all sounds quite logic. But reality is not always that logic.
Yes, Oluv seem to be quite into the Harman curve and as long as we don't have anything better I'd agree with him. And for my ears the curve works quite well.

 

[100rounddrum]

Even if we are different, the site is quite useful. Comparing the "original file" with the different headphones, I found the good old HD600 and DT250 quite neutral, with some deeper bass for the DT250. The Audeze with EQ applied was also fairly neutral, but so would most HP when EQued.

It would be nice to hear what people think about the most neutral ones, compared to the original file.

Well, I really can't hear any difference in sound between any sound demos, so it's objectively useless.

Graphs and measurments are the only reliable source of determing the sound of gear. Everything else is non-sense, and not useful for evaluting sound reviews.

 

[Thomas_A]

Tale of two

Well, I really can't hear any difference in sound between any sound demos, so it's objectively useless.

Graphs and measurments are the only reliable source of determing the sound of gear. Everything else is non-sense, and not useful for evaluting sound reviews.

Just by curiosity which headphones do you use to compare?

 

[100rounddrum]

Tale of two


Just by curiosity which headphones do you use to compare?

I use the Sennheiser HD650

 

[Jimbob54]

Tale of two


Just by curiosity which headphones do you use to compare?

And connected to what? I've never looked into how to best get Youtube through my home stereo without going USB to DAC (dont want).

Pretty sure cheap earbuds into phone playing the vid wouldnt enable you to hear any difference at all- but maybe some decent IEMS? I will have to experiment with that Oluv clip

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

As someone who doesn't prefer the Harmon target response curve, I'm not a fan of calling that "neutral." In fact, in Harman's testing, one out of three people did not prefer the Harmon target response curve.

And note how I keep calling it the "target response curve" which is a term that Harman uses. That is because it is a target response for designing headphones that suit the most people. It's important to remember that is the goal--designing a headphone to sell. And not confuse it as a one size fits all solution for headphone sound preference.

And as someone with an XXL hat size, I'm continually reminded when shopping for a new baseball cap how much the one size fits all view of the world sucks when you don't fit that one size fits all. lol

So I think it's a bad idea to equate the Harmon target response curve with neutral, when it excludes the listening preference of 1/3 of listeners.

Well, I didn't really say the harmon target was neutral. I realize it's not. But it is based on real testing of humans...and yes I'm also aware that 1 in 3 don't prefer it. But 2 in 3 do and that's pretty significant for this sort of thing. And the ones who don't are largely a group of younger folks who prefer a slightly "V" shape or older folks who likely have a bit of high freq hearing loss and prefer a bit less bass...

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

Well, I really can't hear any difference in sound between any sound demos, so it's objectively useless.

Graphs and measurments are the only reliable source of determing the sound of gear. Everything else is non-sense, and not useful for evaluting sound reviews.

nonsense. play around with the sliders on an Equalizer and see if you can't hear any difference in sound.

 

[100rounddrum]

nonsense. play around with the sliders on an Equalizer and see if you can't hear any difference in sound.

I can obviously hear differences with EQ changes.

I'm just saying, with any sound demo on youtube, yes also from Oluv, all the headphones sound exactly the same to me. Putting the original tracks inbetween the demos is useless as well, since they sound the exact same as the headphones that are demo'ed.

Besides, you can't see a real-time graph when the headphones are being demo-ed, so there's no evidence of any of the headphones sounding any different, on sound demos.

Heck, he could be using the original track over and over again, and just claim that a certain headphone is being played, while it was the original song all along! That's how it sounds like to me anyway.

I listened to the sound demo with my Senn HD650 and JDS Atom labs

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

I don't know what to tell you my friend. I'm listening at work here on a set of really crappy little 2 inch speakers attached to my pc and I can pretty clearly hear differences between the different headphone sample tracks...

 

[raistlin65]

Well, I didn't really say the harmon target was neutral. I realize it's not. But it is based on real testing of humans...and yes I'm also aware that 1 in 3 don't prefer it. But 2 in 3 do and that's pretty significant for this sort of thing. And the ones who don't are largely a group of younger folks who prefer a slightly "V" shape or older folks who likely have a bit of high freq hearing loss and prefer a bit less bass...

Like everything else in the world, the 2 out of 3 who are included think it's a good idea. And the 1 out of 3 who don't often do not.

This is how the one out of three have been recently described

“Harman curve Lovers”

: This group, which constitutes 64% of listeners, includes mostly a broad spectrum of people, although they’re generally under age 50. They prefer headphones tuned close to the Harman curve.

“More Bass Is Better”: This next group, which makes up 15% of listeners, prefers headphones with 3 to 6dB more bass than Harman curve below 300Hz, and 1dB more output above 1kHz. This group is predominantly male and younger -- the listeners JBL is targeting with its headphones.

“Less Bass Is Better”: This group, 21% of listeners, prefers 2 to 3dB less bass than the Harman curve and 1dB more output above 1kHz. This group is disproportionately female and older than 50.

https://www.soundstagesolo.com/index.php/features/217-where-are-we-at-with-the-harman-curve

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

Fair enough. I'm not really disagreeing with you. In fact, I never really was advocating for the harman curve. I mean we can all EQ our headphones to whichever curve we prefer.

As for the three listener groups...yep. That's essentially what I said as well...

 

[raistlin65]

Fair enough. I'm not really disagreeing with you. In fact, I never really was advocating for the harman curve. I mean we can all EQ our headphones to whichever curve we prefer.

As for the three listener groups...yep. That's essentially what I said as well...

Seems a male thing to neglect the gender differences in the different groups.

And a younger generation thing to assume that age preferences must be due to hearing loss. Here in the US, men are twice as likely as women to develop hearing loss. So if hearing loss were the explanation, then why is that group predominantly female? Seems there are other factors going on there.

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

yes that's true...the female aspect is interesting. Still though, I suspect a bit of hearing loss in high frequencies probably plays a part. I mean that's not a criticism in any way, it's just reality. I'm 53 and I can't hear a thing over about 14.5khz. That's just life sadly...

 

[Jimbob54]

I don't know what to tell you my friend. I'm listening at work here on a set of really crappy little 2 inch speakers attached to my pc and I can pretty clearly hear differences between the different headphone sample tracks...

Thank the lord. For once I can "pass" the test. I heard actual differences!

I usually fail miserably. The verum is far closer to the original, the move to sundara is quite jarring.
.

 

[100rounddrum]

Thank the lord. For once I can "pass" the test. I heard actual differences!

I usually fail miserably. The verum is far closer to the original, the move to sundara is quite jarring.
.

No real time graphs shown = no single difference. It's all placebo, don't put an ounce of faith on those demos.

 

[Jimbob54]

No real time graphs shown = no single difference. It's all placebo, don't put an ounce of faith on those demos.

Just to clarify, you are saying there is no change in the sound coming out of my headphones when the video changes from original, to verum then to sundara?

Or are you saying the recording of the different headphones isnt representative of how they would sound on my head?

Because if the former , you are plain wrong. If the latter, then yes, I wouldnt use this or any other such vid on a buy/ not buy decision.

 

[100rounddrum]

Just to clarify, you are saying there is no change in the sound coming out of my headphones when the video changes from original, to verum then to sundara?

Or are you saying the recording of the different headphones isnt representative of how they would sound on my head?

Because if the former , you are plain wrong. If the latter, then yes, I wouldnt use this or any other such vid on a buy/ not buy decision.

I meant both. Where is your evidence that the headphones sound differentaly on that demo, and that's it's not the original track looped over and over again, and the change in sound is placebo, because he puts different texts in when another headphone is playing so you think the sound changes as well because of that, when it's nothing more than a text change?

 

[Jimbob54]

I meant both. Where is your evidence that the headphones sound differentaly on that demo, and that's it's not the original track looped over and over again, and the change in sound is placebo, because he puts different texts in when another headphone is playing so you think the sound changes as well because of that, when it's nothing more than a text change?

Only my own ears, of course. And I don't propose setting out to test in more depth. I suppose I could close my eyes, say when I heard a change and get someone to verify the change in hp happened at that time. But what would be the point. I think you're being a little contrary.