Genelec 8020 or Kef LSX?

[doctorjuggles]

Currently considering these two speakers for a small room/study system. The Genelecs would be controlled via the XLR outputs of a DX7s, but they require extra cabling and the system doesn’t need to be complicated. I like the idea of the neater wireless option of the Kef and I’d be lying if I said the form factor didn’t appeal too. So in theory, what would one be “giving up” by choosing the LSXs over the 8020s? (By the way, they’ll be used with Roon so the integration there with the Kefs is also very appealing)
It’s quite hard to demo studio equipment next to consumer hifi so I will try, but would also like the opinions of the fine folk at ASR please

 

[Ron Texas]

That's a great question.

 

[SmarterThanU2]

LSX = coaxially aligned tweeter which is preferable if you listen from multiple positions throughout a room. Try both and return the one you dislike?

 

[GrimSurfer]

Currently considering these two speakers for a small room/study system. The Genelecs would be controlled via the XLR outputs of a DX7s, but they require extra cabling and the system doesn’t need to be complicated. I like the idea of the neater wireless option of the Kef and I’d be lying if I said the form factor didn’t appeal too. So in theory, what would one be “giving up” by choosing the LSXs over the 8020s? (By the way, they’ll be used with Roon so the integration there with the Kefs is also very appealing)
It’s quite hard to demo studio equipment next to consumer hifi so I will try, but would also like the opinions of the fine folk at ASR please

If the Bluetooth aptx implementation has been done really well on the LSXs, you're not losing much at 16/44. If you have aspirations to use 24/96 or higher, the data from your player/streamer to the speakers will be compressed. Either way, there is still a potential for RF interference whenever over-the-air transmission is used.

Here's a good article written by Brent Butterworth for Lifewire. Brent knows his stuff and explains all of this rather well.

https://www.lifewire.com/what-to-know-about-bluetooth-3134591

Wired XLR connections usually offer superior signal transfer and noise rejection over RF modes such as Bluetooth or wifi. By usually, I'm talking about wire and connectors properly lashed up. The XLR connectors in the Genelecs and your DX7 will be well done. All one has to do is obtain good cables.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...nects-is-there-a-difference.9448/#post-249234

Dispersion can be an issue with professional monitors. It's a key part of their design to support near field listening in a professional setting. Consumer audio is usually designed for broader dispersion in order to give greater flexibility wrt placement and off axis listening enjoyment.

 

[jonfitch]

LSX = coaxially aligned tweeter which is preferable if you listen from multiple positions throughout a room. Try both and return the one you dislike?

The 8020 is a waveguided tweeter with a 4" woofer. It should be virtually impossible to hear any imaging difference between this and a coaxial outside of the extreme nearfield where there will be variation on the vertical axis at the crossover frequency.

 

[Ilkless]

Currently considering these two speakers for a small room/study system. The Genelecs would be controlled via the XLR outputs of a DX7s, but they require extra cabling and the system doesn’t need to be complicated. I like the idea of the neater wireless option of the Kef and I’d be lying if I said the form factor didn’t appeal too. So in theory, what would one be “giving up” by choosing the LSXs over the 8020s? (By the way, they’ll be used with Roon so the integration there with the Kefs is also very appealing)
It’s quite hard to demo studio equipment next to consumer hifi so I will try, but would also like the opinions of the fine folk at ASR please

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/KH80--neumann-kh-80-dsp-4-inch-powered-studio-monitor

Neumann KH80DSP is on sale. Same form factor as the 8020. Cheaper on sale too. Extraordinary engineering, smoother and flatter on and off-axis. +/- 0.6dB on-axis out of the box and exemplary off-axis response (tested by an independent lab):

This is consistent with Neumann's own results:

 

[q3cpma]

Would be interesting to have measurements of the 8020D, though. Can't imagine that nothing changed in three generations.

EDIT: found it in the operating manual, no real change in FR, only max SPL.

 

[maty]

Of three, only Neumann has front bass-reflex-> they may be closer to the back wall.

Customer reviews:

* https://www.thomann.de/gb/neumann_kh_80_dsp.htm

* https://www.thomann.de/gb/genelec_8020_dpm.htm

 

[maty]

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/neumann-kh80-dsp

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/genelec-8320a-8330a-apm

https://www.thomann.de/gb/genelec_8320_apm.htm

 

[ernestcarl]

Does anyone know what that piece of circular plastic is behind the neumann's tweeter *grill? A phase plug of some sort? Just curious.

genelecs don't have it

As for the Kef tweeter... always seemed to look more like a star anise to me. Though I haven't heard anyone else point that out.

 

[TimVG]

Small acoustic lenses are sometimes used on larger (1" and up) tweeters to widen dispersion at the highest frequencies and keep the beamwidth from collapsing.

 

[garbulky]

I assume the LSx is similar to the LS50. If so, I would stay away from the LSx. Muddy, mediocre sound to my ears. I've never heard a Genelec so I can't comment. For an active, I would prefer an Emotiva Airmotiv 5 instead which sounded a lot nicer to me in nearly every way with a good bit more detail. (They are discontinued but can be bought used from the Emotiva forum's emporium. The warranty can be transferred).

 

[ernestcarl]

I assume the LSx is similar to the LS50. If so, I would stay away from the LSx. Muddy, mediocre sound to my ears. I've never heard a Genelec so I can't comment. For an active, I would prefer an Emotiva Airmotiv 5 instead which sounded a lot nicer to me in nearly every way with a good bit more detail. (They are discontinued but can be bought used from the Emotiva forum's emporium. The warranty can be transferred).

Interesting. But those are subjective opinions of sound preference. Not hearing these actual speaker models in the OP space (or one’s own) I would give more weight to objective criteria, wanted features set & connectivity options (e.g. wifi, air play, xlr/rca) and budget consideration... maybe aesthetics as well, for last — as amazing as the KH80 are, I would not even consider them for my living room. But since it’s just a study room then it should be fine.

*check out the prices for the Kef stands/mounting accessories. And here I thought Neumann accessories were already expensive.

https://www.shop.us.kef.com/lsx-s1-speaker-floorstand.html

 

[ernestcarl]

I thought it was for just a single stand. For a pair... maybe. Then again, I paid almost the near the same price for for a single L bracket and K&M stands here in canada...

 

[garbulky]

Interesting. But those are subjective opinions of sound preference. Not hearing these actual speaker models in the OP space (or one’s own) I would give more weight to objective criteria, wanted features set & connectivity options (e.g. wifi, air play, xlr/rca) and budget consideration... maybe aesthetics as well, for last — as amazing as the KH80 are, I would not even consider them for my living room. But since it’s just a study room then it should be fine.

*check out the prices for the Kef stands/mounting accessories. And here I thought Neumann accessories were already expensive.

https://www.shop.us.kef.com/lsx-s1-speaker-floorstand.html

Sure. I encourage the purchaser to evaluate it the best way they know how. I'm not the one buying the speakers.

 

[Hemi-Demon]

Has anyone been able to compare the Nuemann monitors to something like the Kanto Tuk monitors. I am curious about the Kanto's due to the tweeter these use, out of curiosity and wanting to try something different.

 

[ernestcarl]

Those Tuks look more like ‘all-in-one’ lifestyle speakers. Monitors with AMT tweeters in the pro realm are Eve and Adam audio among few more others. I’d be comparing those with the Tuk more likely if you want the same tweeter type. Pro monitors are a bit more utilitarian in the looks department and lack some conveniences found in consumer lifestyle speakers: e.g. remote, BT, RCA/3.5” input

 

[PresbyByrd]

I shared this in another discussion, but perhaps it will be helpful (although not about Genelec’s). I recently set up a small room with Adam X7 and Adam’s Sub10. I run those directly from an RME ADI-2 DAC. The whole setup is about $3600. It sounds as good as my $14,000 system with passive speakers. Both rooms are appropriately treated. For several reasons (family related) I have to scrap my larger set up. (Going to turn it into a home theatre and general play room). I thought the smaller room with “inferior” gear would be a compromise. Not at all! My other room consisted of Tyler Audio Monitors, Rel Stadium Subs (2), Cambridge Audio power and preamp (850 series), M2Tech Young Dac (not the newer one), Marantz cd, Mac Mini, monoprice wires. Some of this will be going on sale soon.

 

[stevenswall]

Why do those KH 80 measurements show an accurate frequency response, where the listed response I see is "Frequency Response: 57Hz-21kHz (±3 dB)"

Just because they are including the F3 point? I wish they made an 8" or larger version that had bass.

 

[Sancus]

Why do those KH 80 measurements show an accurate frequency response, where the listed response I see is "Frequency Response: 57Hz-21kHz (±3 dB)"

Bass rolloff below 60hz and maybe a bit more variation at the highest frequencies(hard to see). They spec 100hz - 10khz at +/- 0.7db. There is also 0.26db of sample variation at the most.

I wish they made an 8" or larger version that had bass.

Tell me about it, lol. I'm hoping the rest of their lineup, KH120 on up, will be gradually upgraded a la Genelec.