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Denon AVR-X8500H AVR Review

Dj7675

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If I am not using all 11 amplifier channels, can I turn off the un- used ones? Or is that only if you select pre amp mode or something? Or maybe if they are not being used they shut themselves off? Thanks if anyone knows.
With Denon you can’t turn off the amps but you can disconnect them so they don’t negatively affect performance of the DAC. Amir tested the full preamp mode in the x8500 and found it clipped at .6v. He reported it to Denon I believe and are waiting to hear back. With the 8500 you have another option in custom amp assign. Simply set whatever channel you want disconnected to “none”. It isn’t necessarily obvious in the menu, but go to:
Setup>speakers>manual setup>amp assign>set to custom
Then at the bottom left are “Settings”
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peng

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If using the 8500 preamp for channels l and r, the signal passes with the same sinad value to a power stage, if we use the 8500 preout ??

If you meant the same SINAD value that Amir measured, then yes, as long as you have front left and right channel internal power amplifiers disconnected.
 

bigguyca

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If I am not using all 11 amplifier channels, can I turn off the un- used ones? Or is that only if you select pre amp mode or something? Or maybe if they are not being used they shut themselves off? Thanks if anyone knows.


The subject of this thread is the Denon X8500H that has 13 power amplifier channels. Is the subject of your post the X8500H or some other product?
 

studiocity

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The subject of this thread is the Denon X8500H that has 13 power amplifier channels. Is the subject of your post the X8500H or some other product?
Yes you are correct, it should say “if I am not using all 13 amplifier channels“. Yes that was a x8500h post. Thanks for pointing out the mistake. .
 

studiocity

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With Denon you can’t turn off the amps but you can disconnect them so they don’t negatively affect performance of the DAC. Amir tested the full preamp mode in the x8500 and found it clipped at .6v. He reported it to Denon I believe and are waiting to hear back. With the 8500 you have another option in custom amp assign. Simply set whatever channel you want disconnected to “none”. It isn’t necessarily obvious in the menu, but go to:
Setup>speakers>manual setup>amp assign>set to custom
Then at the bottom left are “Settings”
View attachment 79018
Thank You!!
 

Rubicon

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Sound United has come up with a series of training videos on what differentiates Marantz from Denon.

 

peng

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Excellent marketing hype, spin doctor approach! Not logical though..

It begs the following questions (surely more can be asked):

- Comparing the 8015 to 6700 they can claim 57 % shared parts, but if they compare the 7015 to 4700 and 6015 to 3700, the shared parts % will go way up, the only difference aside from the features related ones is really just the HDAMs, at least that can be seen just by comparing the schematics and BOMs of the 2016/17/18 models, unless they have made major changes to the 2020 models?

- If Marantz used HDAMs so that they can tune the sound, how do we the buy know they tuned it to our liking. So they expect the buyers to just either trust them or must visit a store and insist on a properly setup AB comparison between the 6015 to 3700 and 7015 to the 4700?

- What about the slimline series then, they don't have HDAMs, so do they sound the same as Denon?

- In the video, they talked about sound tuning using the HDAM's discrete components, yet they also claimed lowest possible distortions (not in exact words, but implied..), so why ASR's measurements show they have higher distortions?

- They claimed the use of current feedback improves dynamics, response time etc., yet they also concluded that Denon sounded more "punch". Also, I compared the power amp's schematics and I don't see any difference in feedback for the 2017/18 models, unless they referred again to the discrete HDAMs only. The HDAM sits right at the end of the preamp's audio signal path, whatever they do in terms of response time and dynamic is not going to be an improvement right? Its not like tone control, or eq, you can't gain back what you lost upstream! Not even in terms of gain because the HDAMs gain is "1" (unity gain) right?

As for the toroidal vs E-I core, I would love to hear a rebuttal from the Denon team. Let alone the fact that many expensive amps use E-I core transformers exclusively, such as Luxman's. The fact is, there are pros and cons in both toroidal and E-I, though as a general blanket statement it is fair to say all else being equal, toridal transformers would be more expensive, offers high VA per lb, and less leakage flux. Did they use toridal in all 2020 Marantz models now? I highly doubt that, but if not, then this particular claim would not apply to all other models except the SR8015 right?

Regardless, I'll give them the credit to finally make an attempt to explain what this Marantz musical sound is about, even though I consider the presentation just another marketing tool to help promote their product line that has a much higher profit margin. That is, to try and convince people to pay more for less, without knowing it, obviously..
 

Rubicon

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Excellent marketing hype, spin doctor approach! Not logical though..

It begs the following questions (surely more can be asked):

- Comparing the 8015 to 6700 they can claim 57 % shared parts, but if they compare the 7015 to 4700 and 6015 to 3700, the shared parts % will go way up, the only difference aside from the features related ones is really just the HDAMs, at least that can be seen just by comparing the schematics and BOMs of the 2016/17/18 models, unless they have made major changes to the 2020 models?

- If Marantz used HDAMs so that they can tune the sound, how do we the buy know they tuned it to our liking. So they expect the buyers to just either trust them or must visit a store and insist on a properly setup AB comparison between the 6015 to 3700 and 7015 to the 4700?

- What about the slimline series then, they don't have HDAMs, so do they sound the same as Denon?

- In the video, they talked about sound tuning using the HDAM's discrete components, yet they also claimed lowest possible distortions (not in exact words, but implied..), so why ASR's measurements show they have higher distortions?

- They claimed the use of current feedback improves dynamics, response time etc., yet they also concluded that Denon sounded more "punch". Also, I compared the power amp's schematics and I don't see any difference in feedback for the 2017/18 models, unless they referred again to the discrete HDAMs only. The HDAM sits right at the end of the preamp's audio signal path, whatever they do in terms of response time and dynamic is not going to be an improvement right? Its not like tone control, or eq, you can't gain back what you lost upstream! Not even in terms of gain because the HDAMs gain is "1" (unity gain) right?

As for the toroidal vs E-I core, I would love to hear a rebuttal from the Denon team. Let alone the fact that many expensive amps use E-I core transformers exclusively, such as Luxman's. The fact is, there are pros and cons in both toroidal and E-I, though as a general blanket statement it is fair to say all else being equal, toridal transformers would be more expensive, offers high VA per lb, and less leakage flux. Did they use toridal in all 2020 Marantz models now? I highly doubt that, but if not, then this particular claim would not apply to all other models except the SR8015 right?

Regardless, I'll give them the credit to finally make an attempt to explain what this Marantz musical sound is about, even though I consider the presentation just another marketing tool to help promote their product line that has a much higher profit margin. That is, to try and convince people to pay more for less, without knowing it, obviously..
Yes, this is just a marketing video for dealers to up-sell customers from Denon to Marantz. I hope we get to see the measurements of a 2020 Marantz receiver soon.
 

Sal1950

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Yes, this is just a marketing video for dealers to up-sell customers from Denon to Marantz. I hope we get to see the measurements of a 2020 Marantz receiver soon.
I'm hoping the desire to build good measuring componenets filters it's way into the Marantz components. D&M is gifted with being able to tag some of their products with the grand ole US product name of Saul Marantz. They should give them the top place of honor in their corporate line-up.
 

Anterantz

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hi guys a question if i don't need more power since my room is small and the 8500 in stereo has a lot of power, would you notice any audible improvement when connecting a rotel rb991 power amp? My boxes are gold100 audio monitor
 

Doodski

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hi guys a question if i don't need more power since my room is small and the 8500 in stereo has a lot of power, would you notice any audible improvement when connecting a rotel rb991 power amp? My boxes are gold100 audio monitor
The Rotel RB 991 is a beast of a amp and will drive your speakers better into the low impedance of 2.8 Ohms. You'll have better linearity from the amplifier output.
https://www.stereophile.com/solidpoweramps/899rotel/index.html
https://www.monitoraudio.com/en/product-ranges/gold/gold-100/
 

Anterantz

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The Rotel RB 991 is a beast of a amp and will drive your speakers better into the low impedance of 2.8 Ohms. You'll have better linearity from the amplifier output.
https://www.stereophile.com/solidpoweramps/899rotel/index.html
https://www.monitoraudio.com/en/product-ranges/gold/gold-100/
hello the gold100 are 4g models that work at 8 ohm ... the denon can spare with the gold I was wondering if audibly I will notice an improvement when using the preout front outputs vs internal amplification
 

Doodski

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hello the gold100 are 4g models that work at 8 ohm ... the denon can spare with the gold I was wondering if audibly I will notice an improvement when using the preout front outputs vs internal amplification
The improvement will be subtle although in stereo mode you might hear a improvement. In surround sound mode I doubt you will hear a difference. It's worth a try connecting the Rotel and test driving it if you're not too bothered doing that. :D
 

rccarguy

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hi guys a question if i don't need more power since my room is small and the 8500 in stereo has a lot of power, would you notice any audible improvement when connecting a rotel rb991 power amp? My boxes are gold100 audio monitor


That amp is quite old so make sure it's serviced before you buy it. New capacitors
 

Anterantz

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That amp is quite old so make sure it's serviced before you buy it. New capacitors


It belongs to a friend who leaves it to me at € 300. He has shown me internal photos and the capacitors are in good condition. I will review it anyway! By the way, which brand or two-channel stage do you recommend that I be an audiophile without spending a lot of money? I prefer second hand .. greetings
 

rccarguy

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It belongs to a friend who leaves it to me at € 300. He has shown me internal photos and the capacitors are in good condition. I will review it anyway! By the way, which brand or two-channel stage do you recommend that I be an audiophile without spending a lot of money? I prefer second hand .. greetings

Capacitors may look ok but could be degraded, they have a finite lifespan. Around 20 years max
 

jomark911

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It belongs to a friend who leaves it to me at € 300. He has shown me internal photos and the capacitors are in good condition. I will review it anyway! By the way, which brand or two-channel stage do you recommend that I be an audiophile without spending a lot of money? I prefer second hand .. greetings
Get a SANSUI B2301L , you'll be surprised how well it performs.
Down side, very heavy 39 kilos, a bit expensive , if you get it from Germany , cause most of them were sold there, it's 2500e at least.
 

Anterantz

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Get a SANSUI B2301L , you'll be surprised how well it performs.
Down side, very heavy 39 kilos, a bit expensive , if you get it from Germany , cause most of them were sold there, it's 2500e at least.
hello € 2500? You have to be crazy to spend that god ... with the stereo that the 8500 offers me for my living room and boxes I would say that it is very good, I was just wondering how much I could improve by adding some second-hand external stage! I don't need more power since the 8500h takes my boxes to subhuman spl
 

peng

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hi guys a question if i don't need more power since my room is small and the 8500 in stereo has a lot of power, would you notice any audible improvement when connecting a rotel rb991 power amp? My boxes are gold100 audio monitor

If you don't need more power, then the answer would be "No", based on the measurements of the 8500.
https://www.stereophile.com/content/rotel-rb-991-power-amplifier-measurements

The Rotel is of course more powerful, may be 1.5 to 2 dB more, but seem to be saying power is not the issue.
If you compare the following:

Frequency response: No issues with both.
IMD: Both seem fine
SNR: The 8500 actually looked better
THD+N: You can see from the graphs below that the difference are likely not audible unless you have the so called golden ears.

I wouldn't spend a lot of money on such an old power amplifier for no good reasons but of course that's just my opinion.

1598444696442.png


1598444809926.png
 
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