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Can you sell DIY in your country? Is it legal?

Trell

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See my previous post.

What the hell am I supposed to ask? Hm. I have to think about it a bit.:)

Ask your insurance company you have for home insurance. Ask on Swedish forums for DIY as they are far more likely to give you relevant/good directions than this international forum.
 

tomtoo

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Call them, and then you ask to get his/her answer in writing as in my experience Swedish officials are likely to answer what they think it is as opposed to what it is instead of just saying "I don't know".

A paraphrase from a former colleague of mine: "In Germany they (officials) are unfriendly but competent, but in Sweden they are friendly but incompetent."

Remembers me when i was going to the city main postoffice some 3x years ago for a private datexp connection. I can tell you the german 'officials' where unfriendly and incompetent. :)
 

Trell

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Remembers me when i was going to the city main postoffice some 3x years ago for a private datexp connection. I can tell you the german 'officials' where unfriendly and incompetent. :)

For my colleague the consequences for his family was very bad (lack of health insurance for all of them with a new born baby that needed care) in Sweden even though he was very careful in his dealings with all officials. He was repeatedly given wrong information and wrong forms to fill out.
 
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DanielT

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For my colleague the consequences for his family was very bad (lack of health insurance for all of them with a new born baby that needed care) in Sweden even though he was very careful in his dealings with all officials. He was repeatedly given wrong information and wrong forms to fill out.
For my part, contact with authorities both as a private person and at work has varied from authority to authority and even from administrator to administrator. You can be unlucky and come across administrators who are both incompetent and "paragraph riders" at the same time.

In the Summer Cottage area where we have a small cottage, a few years ago we had to install a common infiltration facility for the BDT water. Two years later, after the installation was done (all cottage owners had to pay out of own wallet ). New administrators in the municipality and they said: No, you do not have to do that in your area. The bedrock itself takes care of it. We've done measurements and ... and so on. So it can go.

BDT water means wastewater from baths, dishes and laundry. This is also called greywater and has normally seen a large volume, but little load if you exclude phosphate from soap and detergent. BDT water can be purified separately with simpler methods, for example by sludge separation and sewage infiltration. For the most part, however, BDT water is mixed with heavily loaded wastewater from toilets (toilet water), which gives so-called mixed wastewater, also called black water.


And yes we performed tests on the BDT water that we submitted to the administrators who forced us to install the BDT infiltration facility. It did not help.It was like a Kafka novel, short story.
 
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Trell

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For my part, contact with authorities both as a private person and at work has varied from authority to authority and even from administrator to administrator. You can be unlucky and come across administrators who are both incompetent and "paragraph riders" at the same time.

In the Summer Cottage area where we have a small cottage, a few years ago we had to install a common infiltration facility for the BDT water. Two years later, after the installation was done (all cottage owners had to pay out of own wallet ). New administrators in the municipality and they said: No, you do not have to do that in your area. The bedrock itself takes care of it. We've done measurements and ... and so on. So it can go.

BDT water means wastewater from baths, dishes and laundry. This is also called greywater and has normally seen a large volume, but little load if you exclude phosphate from soap and detergent. BDT water can be purified separately with simpler methods, for example by sludge separation and sewage infiltration. For the most part, however, BDT water is mixed with heavily loaded wastewater from toilets (toilet water), which gives so-called mixed wastewater, also called black water.


And yes we performed tests on the BDT water that we submitted to the administrators who forced us to install the BDT infiltration facility. It did not help.It was like a Kafka novel, short story.

It's not my intention to disparage all Swedish officials but I do think that in the Swedish society at large (as a foreigner myself) "speaking out of your ass" when you don't know anything is accepted. Sometimes that is mostly harmless, other times very much not so as my colleague's experience shows.

My advice still stands: Get any advice in writing before you act upon it.

Edit: This was not directed at you or your posts.
 
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DanielT

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It's not my intention to disparage all Swedish officials but I do think that in the Swedish society at large (as a foreigner myself) "speaking out of your ass" when you don't know anything is accepted. Sometimes that is mostly harmless, other times very much not so as my colleague's experience shows.

My advice still stands: Get any advice in writing before you act upon it.

Edit: This was not directed at you or your posts.
Wait, I did not take it badly. :D

Mentioned myself how bad it went for us, the bad luck to encounter "wrong" administrators in the municipality. The thing is that one of the summer cottage owners was a recently retired lawyer. Competent and knowledgeable but socially agile as a tank. He drove on as if World War III had broken out. Let me say this, it did not make the administrators in the municipality particularly more cooperative. Clumsy of the lawyer not to take the position of strength, vis-à-vis the administrators in consideration.

Please note I do NOT suggest this was the case with your colleague. More a general comment that there can be many factors that come into play.

My advice still stands: Get any advice in writing before you act upon it. I agree with that.:)
 
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DanielT

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No you didn't at all! My concern if I my post was not interpreted differently from my intent.
Ok, aha so..wait now I can barely remember what this thread is about. Though I started it myself. He he.:)

Hm, uhh post some pictures on a DIY tube amp I bought for $ 40 many years ago..Sold now.

That little one can hardly take the life of a healthy adult? (Edit: Important, I was wrong! Read tomtoo's response to this post below!)

It got hot something so damn in the tin box. I do not understand how the electronics survived when it was both boiled and fried. In which case I drilled a hole in the bottom of it for ventilation. :)
 

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Trell

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Ok, aha so..wait now I can barely remember what this thread is about. Though I started it myself. He he.:)

Hm, uhh post some pictures on a DIY tube amp I bought for $ 40 many years ago..Sold now.

That little one can hardly take the life of a healthy adult? It got hot something so damn in the tin box. I do not understand how the electronics survived when it was both boiled and fried. In which case I drilled a hole in the bottom of it for ventilation. :)

With a hearth condition, typically unknown by most, it can kill or cause serious damage to health. The other is the more prosaic scenario of your house burning down to the ground and you're not covered by any insurance.
 

tomtoo

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Ok, aha so..wait now I can barely remember what this thread is about. Though I started it myself. He he.:)

Hm, uhh post some pictures on a DIY tube amp I bought for $ 40 many years ago..Sold now.

That little one can hardly take the life of a healthy adult? It got hot something so damn in the tin box. I do not understand how the electronics survived when it was both boiled and fried. In which case I drilled a hole in the bottom of it for ventilation. :)


It can easaly take the live of a very healty adult. You can easy build a battery driven hand held device that can take the live of a healty adult, its called tazer. And there goes the attention not to kill. Same device a littel hotter, with less security in mind, could kill most of the time. 9V battery, hand held. Dont underestimate the killingpotenzial of electric devices. ;)
 

Trell

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It can easaly take the live of a very healty adult. You can easy build a battery driven hand held device that can take the live of a healty adult, its called tazer. And there goes the attention not to kill. Same device a littel hotter, with less security in mind, could kill most of the time. 9V battery, hand held. Dont underestimate the killingpotenzial of electric devices. ;)

This is one case where I wish I could mark "agree" than just "like" @amirm
 
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DanielT

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It can easaly take the live of a very healty adult. You can easy build a battery driven hand held device that can take the live of a healty adult, its called tazer. And there goes the attention not to kill. Same device a littel hotter, with less security in mind, could kill most of the time. 9V battery, hand held. Dont underestimate the killingpotenzial of electric devices. ;)
You're right, anything plugged into a wall outlet has the potential to kill a person.

I thought about more that little tube amp can not possibly charge as much as the other one with EL34 tubes, right? Thus greater, more dangerous potential with the EL34, or? Although it depends on a lot of different factors, I can imagine. The small tube amp was a push pull with these power tubes.

 

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gene_stl

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When you work on tube gear you only use one hand. and sit on a stool not touching its frame so your body isn't grounded. That way current flow will be restricted to your hand. And if you get across the terminals it will only take one time to make you be 100% careful. I have gotten lots of 120 volt AC shocks and they aren't too bad, but tube power supplies are a whole nother smoke.

If you look up the potential lethality versus line frequency you fill find that 50 and 60 Hz were the worst possible choices they could have made in that respect.
 

tomtoo

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You're right, anything plugged into a wall outlet has the potential to kill a person.

I thought about more that little tube amp can not possibly charge as much as the other one with EL34 tubes, right? Thus greater, more dangerous potential with the EL34, or? Although it depends on a lot of different factors, I can imagine. The small tube amp was a push pull with these power tubes.


Its not interesting, the tubes need high voltage the power supply delivers it with enough voltage and current to kill you. If the amp is big or small is as interesting as that good old corn bag in china.
But relax, a 4kW power amp can even kill you on the speaker outs. :)
 
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DanielT

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When you work on tube gear you only use one hand. and sit on a stool not touching its frame so your body isn't grounded. That way current flow will be restricted to your hand. And if you get across the terminals it will only take one time to make you be 100% careful. I have gotten lots of 120 volt AC shocks and they aren't too bad, but tube power supplies are a whole nother smoke.

If you look up the potential lethality versus line frequency you fill find that 50 and 60 Hz were the worst possible choices they could have made in that respect.
Thanks for the tip! But I make it easier than that for me. I'm not doing tube amps at all. I tested that one with EL34 tubes but well too much fuss. Did not feel like setting bias on it.DIY tube amp seems to be a lot of people doing and I understand the temptation to DIY with tubes. Maybe not to get the most excellent best sound but because it's fun. However, DIY tube amp is not for me.:)

It shone nicely with tubs though.:)
 
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pma

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Then I do not mean if it is possible to find a buyer but if it is legal.

For example in Sweden, as far as I know, it is forbidden to sell DIY tube amplifiers to private individuals BUT if I owned a DIY tube amplifier, which I did not build, I have the right to sell it. This only applies to those who have built, DIY tube amp which the law covers.

What does it look like in your country? Is it legal to sell DIY?

1) if you sell it as an individual to another individual and it is not a repetitive process with profit as a goal, then yes.

2) there might be a question what is "DIY" and what is a small-lot production. I have been registered as an entrepreneur in electronics design and production for 30 years and there was a period when I was selling my PCB's and kits and paying taxes from the profit. This is of course legal.
 

MarcosCh

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Hi all,
I find this subject (the original one) very relevant and i would even expand the question to "what about all these devices that we love to buy cheap online or from those brands that we like so much but are not, say, apple or yamaha?" I am sure here in ASR there are knowledgeable people that could advice what not to do and what to look at from the point of view of safety, insurances, etc.
Excuse me if there is already a thread on that, buy if not, there should be one (my 2 cents)
 

JSmith

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Is it legal to sell DIY?
It doesn't matter here in AUS if it is mass produced or DIY... one needs to abide by set standards to be able to sell it for consumer use;
The Responsible Supplier (on-shore manufacturer or importer) must meet all the requirements of the EESS, including:


  • That the electrical equipment offered for sale is categorized as risk level Level 1, 2 or 3 and is electrically safe.
  • Ensuring that any in-scope risk level (Level 1, Level 2 or Level 3) electronic equipment offered for sale meets the safety requirements of the EESS (including the Equipment Safety Rules).
  • The Responsible Supplier and any in-scope electrical equipment offered for sale are correspondingly registered.
  • Pay all corresponding registration fees.
  • The product is marked with the Regulatory Compliance Mark (RCM) in accordance with the requirements listed in AS/NZS 4417.1 & AS/NZS 4417.2.
If someone plans on making a small business out of it, then they would be best to consider product & public liability insurance as well.


JSmith
 
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DanielT

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Hi all,
I find this subject (the original one) very relevant and i would even expand the question to "what about all these devices that we love to buy cheap online or from those brands that we like so much but are not, say, apple or yamaha?" I am sure here in ASR there are knowledgeable people that could advice what not to do and what to look at from the point of view of safety, insurances, etc.
Excuse me if there is already a thread on that, buy if not, there should be one (my 2 cents)
I'm just saying unmarked power supply. Amplifiers are happily bought, then something cheap is plugged in. I took these in the crowd. No safety markings on them, what I can see:

20211129_095656060.jpeg
 
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