• Welcome to ASR. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Forum policy on private messages

Status
Not open for further replies.
what should be considered a private conversation
Again, as this is supposed to be a science and evidence-based site: What makes you assume about the nature of such an exchange? Where is proof for such a claim?

Also, the former mods went out in the first place, unveiling their dismissal and creating open questions, maybe rumours by that. Hard to imagine that the accused will hold the other cheek.
 
That paragraph was pretty self-explanatory.
No, it isn’t. The context is missing. Do you know what was said or done -and by whom -before the person chose to write the comment or response from which that snippet was taken? Without that, any judgment is incomplete.
 
A personal attack is not part of a context nor an argument. However exasperated one may be, an insult turns a discussion into a fight.
 
Whatever the context, there was an ad hominem attack in the quoted text. An attack like that, disqualifies the validity of any argument as it moves the discussion away from an rational one to a purely emotional one. I am surprised that some seem not see that point.
They do see it. It is just an attempt to defend the undefendable.

Folks, likely, no matter which forum you use, all messages simply go into a database, unencrypted. Any system admin with password of the database can read anything in there. Again, this is true of everyone using our platform, Xenforo, or Vbulletin, two major systems I know about. So don't use any forum communication for anything you want to stay secure.

Second, my rule that I have explained to the specific moderator is to expect any communication in private to be put front page of a newspaper! Disgruntled members frequently share what was said to them both here and in other forums. As such, we need to at all times remain professional and above board.

Third, as noted, anyone can report a message. This is how we find out about spam for example with members going around wanting to sell stuff, advertise, cheat members. By OP notion these people should be protected which is absurd.

Fourth, "private" texts and emails are routinely used in trial as evidence. Once you send something to another person, it becomes theirs to share, or not share. If you threaten me in email, you think you are entitled to privacy and I am not supposed to go and tell the police about it? Or the local news? Or the owner of the site?

As to my own policy, I go to extreme lengths to keep such messages private. I only violate that when it is absolutely necessary. To wit, I withheld that information for quite a while until I had to share it as to bring clarity to the situation. That an incredible damage was done to the relationship with the words written to me. I felt the membership's need to know was far higher at that moment than any ethical standards I may have in that regard.

I get thousands of messages from people. You don't see me airing them. So please don't spin this as some kind of ethical lapse on my part as to score a point about some other beef you have about me. This is not about technicalities. Very mean spirited and untrue things were said to me which I still kept private until I made the call that you should all know the truth.

Be transparent and honest in such conversations. I know some of you are very unhappy about the loss of our moderators. I am too despite what was said and done. Leave it at that rather than spinning another thread which divides the membership and creates more work for me.
 
"Private" Message says it all. Keep your manners.
It is very bad practice to release a private message to the public.
The least thing you should do is to ask in advance.

If you don't think so, please ask all your colleagues at work to release all your chat messages you sent to them into the wild.
I guess you would not like the result.
 
No, it isn’t. The context is missing. Do you know what was said or done -and by whom -before the person chose to write the comment or response from which that snippet was taken?
There is no justification for what was written in any context. None. What was written was clear and complete.

That said, if James wants me to post the entire post, I will do so. I didn't quote the rest because of wanting to minimize how much I am sharing, not because it changed anything.
 
A personal attack is not part of a context nor an argument. However exasperated one may be, an insult turns a discussion into a fight.
I think that’s an oversimplification. Context absolutely matters -especially when emotions are involved. A frustration might eventually boil over. While that doesn’t excuse personal attacks, it does provide perspective. Ignoring the lead-up strips the conversation of its human dimension and reduces a nuanced situation to something too simplified.
 
If you don't think so, please ask all your colleagues at work to release all your chat messages you sent to them into wild.
I guess you would not like that.
If a colleague said that same thing to you, I imagine most everyone would forward the message to HR/their manager and demand action.

And no, private messages don't mean promise not to share. It simply means it is not open to everyone here to read it by default.

It is amazing to me that you think a moderator is not expected to act professionally as an ethical matter, but someone sharing what they have said, is supposed to.
 
Say what you want soon before I close this thread.

I am starting to think you all don't care about audio anymore. I need to spend my time managing the forum and doing reviews. :(
 
Context absolutely matters -especially when emotions are involved.
Of all people, moderators need to keep their emotions in check or they have no business being a moderator. Heck, you don't walk into your boss's office and rant about him. If you do, you will learn a hard lesson on emotional maturity. And learning how to make a persuasive argument.
 
If a colleague said that same thing to you, I imagine most everyone would forward the message to HR/their manager and demand action.

And no, private messages don't mean promise not to share. It simply means it is not open to everyone here to read it by default.

It is amazing to me that you think a moderator is not expected to act professionally as an ethical matter, but someone sharing what they have said, is supposed to.
Amir, I'm with you. There are cases where it is necessary. But IMO it should not be common practice to simply put everything public without any significant reason.
It also depends on local law. E. g. in Germany "private" is meant quite strictly, even to such an extent that such "evidence" cannot be used in a trial. But I'm not a lawyer...
 
If a colleague said that same thing to you, I imagine most everyone would forward the message to HR/their manager and demand action.
That's doubtful. Some of us still value discretion, which includes keeping the dirty laundry private. BTW, till I thought better of it, I was the head of an HR department.
 
Again, as this is supposed to be a science and evidence-based site: What makes you assume about the nature of such an exchange? Where is proof for such a claim?

Also, the former mods went out in the first place, unveiling their dismissal and creating open questions, maybe rumours by that. Hard to imagine that the accused will hold the other cheek.
Read what I said again in the restorer John thread . Yes I disclosed we 3 were no longer mods . The rough timing of that and gave amir scope to make his announcement . One which I had no issue with until that disclosure (I even liked his first post , it was graceful ) was made near the end . That view was stated by one ex mod and was not claimed to be the view held by the other 2 mods . We were , however , all in agreement with the initial resignation letter . There was one reference to trump in that , simply saying we enforced no politics regardless of whether it was about biden /Harris / trump.

The sentiment was that we couldn't stand by and have the site owner posting on subjects that we have and would continue to sanction members for . A stance amir has recently confirmed .


The rights and wrongs of what was said after that aren't really important to me but obviously of interest to some . . Clearly my ex colleague holds strong views and I'm not defending what was said but I support his right to say it . As I said , our first post said we had resigned effective amir rejecting our demands . He emphatically rejected as is his right (and his right to post what he posted and how ) . At that point we were private citizens talking to an ex employer . . The full text of that one post in question was imho heart breaking when read in full and in context .

My only response in that thread was the last post ...


"Thirded by me . As Brad and Adam pointed out , we can't moderate if the site owner is setting a tone and precedent for threads that we can't allow members to follow . Good luck but I'm also out."

If amir wants to post that thread in full I am authorised to allow him to do so , so long as it is complete.
 
There is no justification for what was written in any context. None. What was written was clear and complete.

That said, if James wants me to post the entire post, I will do so. I didn't quote the rest because of wanting to minimize how much I am sharing, not because it changed anything.
You have the consent of all 3 of us . In think it's better out than in for all concerned

Edit . As long as it's the whole thread , per sbove including your comments
 
Yes I disclosed we 3 were no longer mods . The rough timing of that and gave amir scope to make his announcement .
Indeed you violated my trust in disclosing that and forcing me to immediately post an announcement. We could have discussed how we were going to share this news with the membership. But you had to go and tell everyone. :(
 
Say what you want soon before I close this thread.

I am starting to think you all don't care about audio anymore. I need to spend my time managing the forum and doing reviews. :(
That's a lame excuse to close a thread which opens a valid question on how private messages are handled here, especially since you are the one who left the topic of audio and caused this mess.
 
Indeed you violated my trust in disclosing that and forcing me to immediately post an announcement. We could have discussed how we were going to share this news with the membership. But you had to go and tell everyone. :(
You could have disclosed to us you were going to drop a bomb over the weekend with significant mod impact . We could have discussed how to handle it to achieve your wishes

Post the whole of the resignation thread . Everything else I we have said on the matter is but a search away

Edit And I really didn't want members to run with the impression we had locked your thread which Johns OP could have conveyed . With apologies to him if I got that wrong . And you had removed our badges by that point so it wasn't exactly secret
 
Last edited:
You have the consent of all 3 of us . In think it's better out than in for all concerned

Edit . As long as it's the whole thread , per sbove including your comments
Your lapse in judgement in saying this is stunning to me. What possible good comes out of this for any of you?
 
To me the most important parts of a PM are that it keeps the topics and discussions focused between and among it's participants and stops long repetitive, inane bantering by outsiders. It can also be a way to not break some rules as it not being broadcast but why you would need to is always suspect. And to that last point Amir made it clear that the global impact of tariffs on the industry that is so consuming to him, his work and forum and the industry it deserved public disclosure despite forum policies. This current open discourse in posts above between Jimbob and and Amir is the way things should be handled
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom