BACCH4Mac Pro Edition: a report

[Se7enAtx]

Please take some pictures of the box and foam inside when you get your kit. My only disappointment with Theoretica so far was the way they made the foam insert for the case -- had a very one-off prototype look and feel. Otherwise, I am completely satisfied with my BACCH experience.

Best wishes,
David

I can take and post pics in a bit. Fortunately, the seller packed additional materials in the box, for additional safety.

With that said, I've received other expensive electronics, packed similarly, my Tact Audio and Lyngdorf gear, has always been factory packed, with an almost identical foam suspension, with an air gap, above and below.

If I had any concern, it's that the nice cloth bag that the main unit went into, was not anti-static.

 

[RayDunzl]

https://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose20.html#x43-2000020

"Can BACCH™ 3D Sound be experienced without the the BACCH™ 3D Sound Processor?

Yes. If a stereo signal is filtered through a BACCH™ 3D Sound processor and recorded it becomes a BACCH™ 3D Sound recording and does not require playback through a BACCH™ 3D Sound Processor. It can then be played back on any normal stereo system and can be heard in 3D with no special hardware or processing."

---

Ok, I'll bite.

Where can I find some demos?

Found this - https://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/AudioSamples.html - but, not very satisfying to my curiosity.

 

[Dialectic]

https://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose20.html#x43-2000020

"Can BACCH™ 3D Sound be experienced without the the BACCH™ 3D Sound Processor?

Yes. If a stereo signal is filtered through a BACCH™ 3D Sound processor and recorded it becomes a BACCH™ 3D Sound recording and does not require playback through a BACCH™ 3D Sound Processor. It can then be played back on any normal stereo system and can be heard in 3D with no special hardware or processing."

---

Ok, I'll bite.

Where can I find some demos?

Found this - https://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/AudioSamples.html - but, not very satisfying to my curiosity.

The problem with these sorts of demos is that the effect is much greater if tailored to your speakers and your room. All of the BACCH systems except for u-BACCH account for the speakers and the room in the calibration process.

 

[Eurasian]

I can take and post pics in a bit. Fortunately, the seller packed additional materials in the box, for additional safety.

With that said, I've received other expensive electronics, packed similarly, my Tact Audio and Lyngdorf gear, has always been factory packed, with an almost identical foam suspension, with an air gap, above and below.

If I had any concern, it's that the nice cloth bag that the main unit went into, was not anti-static.

Sorry for any confusion. I own the BACCH4Mac+ and was curious about how the newer units were packaged for transport in their fitted case. A small thing but my only slight peeve with the Theoretica experience.

 

[tyleroz]

You should be excited. If you have reasonably good speakers or headphones, it's the largest improvement you can make to your audio system. It's hard to go back to non-BACCH listening after BACCH.

I am using Dutch 8c and can’t imagine how it can be improved further a lot (it is such a great speaker already!). Your sharing is what inspired me to purchase BACCH4Mac blindly and i trust you mate.

 

[Dialectic]

I am using Dutch 8c and can’t imagine how it can be improved further a lot (it is such a great speaker already!). Your sharing is what inspired me to purchase BACCH4Mac blindly and i trust you mate.

Uh oh, I don't want to be responsible if it doesn't live up to expectations!

But it will...

 

[tyleroz]

Uh oh, I don't want to be responsible if it doesn't live up to expectations!

But it will...

No worries at all as I still don’t really know what to expect. I was pretty calm when making the purchase but now getting more and more excited especially seeing other getting the BACCH-SP.

 

[Dogen]

This is all fascinating! But way out of my price league. I wonder what aspects of this could trickle down to more affordable gear? And the prospect of BACCH-encoded recordings is exciting.

 

[RayDunzl]

No worries at all as I still don’t really know what to expect.

The demo page has some binaural recordings.

"The following are binaural audio clips recorded by Prof. Choueiri using the Neumann Ku100 dummy head microphone. They are used to illustrate the 3D imaging of BACCH™ Filters."

https://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/AudioSamples.html

Then there's this blurb:

"As discussed in Q&A 13 , Binaural audio, which usually refers to recordings made with a dummy head21 is intended to be played back through headphones or earphones in order for the listener to perceive a 3D sound image. However, BACCH™ 3D Sound, allows the audiophile, for the first time, to reproduce the excellent 3D audio image (that is coded in binaural recordings) through a pair of standard loudspeakers"

https://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose16.html

 

[onion]

Reading through one of the papers written by Prof Choueiri, the claim is made that benefits occur not only with pure binaural recordings made with dummy head micro- phones, but also of the vast majority of standard stereo recordings, since they generally contain Interaural level difference and interaural time difference cues, which would be degraded by unintended crosstalk. This does suggest that the filter is more than just a 'special effect'.

OTOH, sound engineers who mastered recordings for most music commercially available will have mixed the sound without the benefit of cross-talk cancellation and the spatial definition it provides. It will be interesting to see how well their sound mixing choices create a soundfield presentation under BACCH4MAC that is coherent with the intention of the recording artists.

 

[Se7enAtx]

I have a question for those who've been playing around with Bacch for a bit.

I've been playing around with the the SP in two systems, and have been observing some interesting behavior, when it comes to the lower frequencies.

The smaller of the two systems, is a pair of Kef LS50 Wireless, no subs, in a basic triangle arrangement.

On certain tracks (Beck Morning Phase album for example), the low frequencies seem to duck out, or cancel. The center correction makes a difference, but not in this behavior. Does the XTC high pass filter on the advanced menu work to resolve this?

On the big system, horns supported by corner loaded subs, the opposite seems to be happening, in that the bass response is significantly increased, almost blown out to the point of rattling windows. I had to pull my mains down almost 4db to compensate.

Has anyone else experienced any of this?

Thx!

 

[Dialectic]

I have a question for those who've been playing around with Bacch for a bit.

I've been playing around with the the SP in two systems, and have been observing some interesting behavior, when it comes to the lower frequencies.

The smaller of the two systems, is a pair of Kef LS50 Wireless, no subs, in a basic triangle arrangement.

On certain tracks (Beck Morning Phase album for example), the low frequencies seem to duck out, or cancel. The center correction makes a difference, but not in this behavior. Does the XTC high pass filter on the advanced menu work to resolve this?

On the big system, horns supported by corner loaded subs, the opposite seems to be happening, in that the bass response is significantly increased, almost blown out to the point of rattling windows. I had to pull my mains down almost 4db to compensate.

Has anyone else experienced any of this?

Thx!

A little bit, yes, but not since the mono correction feature rolled out. Before mono correction was available, I mitigated the bass issues in my system by measuring and eliminating peaks below 200 Hz with DSP parametric EQ before calibrating BACCH. I've experienced no significant bass anomalies since then.

 

[Se7enAtx]

A little bit, yes, but not since the mono correction feature rolled out. Before mono correction was available, I mitigated the bass issues in my system by measuring and eliminating peaks below 200 Hz with DSP parametric EQ before calibrating BACCH. I've experienced no significant bass anomalies since then.

Thanks for the quick reply. At first, on the big system, that maybe the XTC might have removed some other cancelation taking place from the subs, but now it's pretty clear that there's some exaggeration taking place. This system is also sitting on a Lyngdorf Room Correction System, which is serving as the DAC and crossover to the subs. The low end is handled by eight 10" bass drivers, corner loading, so the RCS goes a long way to trim room gain as it is.

The ls50 system is completely different, and it's like all of the bass is getting sucked out (almost a warble effect), as soon as the music starts to pick up in the low frequencies (kick drum, etc), it's almost like the system is pulling power, which it's not.

 

[Dialectic]

Thanks for the quick reply. At first, on the big system, that maybe the XTC might have removed some other cancelation taking place from the subs, but now it's pretty clear that there's some exaggeration taking place. This system is also sitting on a Lyngdorf Room Correction System, which is serving as the DAC and crossover to the subs. The low end is handled by eight 10" bass drivers, corner loading, so the RCS goes a long way to trim room gain as it is.

The ls50 system is completely different, and it's like all of the bass is getting sucked out (almost a warble effect), as soon as the music starts to pick up in the low frequencies (kick drum, etc), it's almost like the system is pulling power, which it's not.

Hmm the LS50Ws could be pulling power if the BACCH cancellation signal is especially strong. I'd contact Theoretica. They're extremely responsive.

 

[tyleroz]

Thanks for the quick reply. At first, on the big system, that maybe the XTC might have removed some other cancelation taking place from the subs, but now it's pretty clear that there's some exaggeration taking place. This system is also sitting on a Lyngdorf Room Correction System, which is serving as the DAC and crossover to the subs. The low end is handled by eight 10" bass drivers, corner loading, so the RCS goes a long way to trim room gain as it is.

The ls50 system is completely different, and it's like all of the bass is getting sucked out (almost a warble effect), as soon as the music starts to pick up in the low frequencies (kick drum, etc), it's almost like the system is pulling power, which it's not.

How is your impression of adding BACCH to your systems so far except from the bass issue?

 

[Se7enAtx]

How is your impression of adding BACCH to your systems so far except from the bass issue?

So far, the effect is pretty remarkable. Beyond the spatial influence, the overall sound becomes much more lush, perhaps it's the way that sound gets layered in space.

I also completely stop thinking about the sweet spot, it's just always in the right place.

I'm very impressed so far.

 

[tyleroz]

So far, the effect is pretty remarkable. Beyond the spatial influence, the overall sound becomes much more lush, perhaps it's the way that sound gets layered in space.

I also completely stop thinking about the sweet spot, it's just always in the right place.

I'm very impressed so far.

Thanks for sharing! Still waiting for the delivery of BACCH4Mac and great to know you are impressed apart from the bass issues

 

[Theoretica Appl. Physics]

I would like to announce on this forum that Theoretica just released BACCH-dSP 8.0 (the application at the heart of the BACCH4Mac product) which has many new features and improvements. Among the improvements that are relevant to people on this forum is the new Bass Correction feature that fully restores the phase information to the low-frequency (LF) part of the audio signal after it goes through a BACCH filter. Previous versions of BACCH-dSP relied on minimum phase filters to handle the LF part of the crossover, which caused the deep bass (below 90 Hz) through the BACCH filter to sometimes have a different level than that when the filter is bypassed. This is no longer the case with the new Bass Correction feature, which provides a bit-perfect match between the LF component of the audio going through a BACCH bin and that going through the Bypass bin.

While the Mono Correction feature (first added in v 7.0) fixed most bass issues, the new Bass Correction feature of 8.0 completely fixes bass reproduction down to the lowest frequencies.

This Bass Correction feature will also be part of the next firmware upgrade for the BACCH-SP processor, which is planned for release in May.

Regards,
Buddy @ Theoretica

 

[Se7enAtx]

Is the 8.0 update accessible to SP hardware users, or only the 4mac units? Will I need to wait for the firmware update?

Thanks!

 

[Theoretica Appl. Physics]

BACCH-dSP is the standalone Mac application at the heart of Theoretica's BACCH4Mac product. The BACCH-SP processor does not run BACCH-dSP. It runs completely different software but uses many of the same algorithms as those in BACCH-dSP. The new Bass Correction feature is presently available only in BACCH-dSP 8.0 but will soon be available in May through a planned firmware update for the BACCH-SP processor. In fact, the feature has already been coded and is presently being thoroughly tested on the BACCH-SP before the release of the firmware upgrade. All BACCH-SP owners will get notification (as usual) when the firmware upgrade is ready.
Regards,
Buddy