Audiolab 6000CDT, bright sounding, burn in time?

[DSJR]

No, I haven't but I just read about it. Thanks.
I still think I don't need emoticon for the absurdity I wrote. Emoticon would strip it of ambiguity.
Besides, I am not sure I support this Poe's Law... it is the enemy of creativity IMHO.

https://www.quora.com/Why-do-some-satirists-strongly-dislike-the-concept-of-Poes-Law-or-the-usage-of-sarcasm-markers-on-internet-posts

Please, I meant no offense to OP. This is just a bit of harmless fun.
But I did want to address the impossible claims, that some high end audio company make so that they can sell the product, with plastic example.
I am genuinly surprised how a lot of intelligent and educated people fall for that.

Now, my text was not meant to be funny, but provoking. How many people, on some classic HiFi forums where they believe various mumbo jumbo, would have followed my recipe?

I'm not complaining here, really I'm not, but your post got my ASD going, hence my response... For peeps like me, without the emoticons, it can be difficult to know how to take some written passages and the thing is, some audiophiles of the audiophool variety will lap it up and believe every word as gospel, not at all seeing the despair (?) behind them.

 

[antcollinet]

I'm not complaining here, really I'm not, but your post got my ASD going, hence my response... For peeps like me, without the emoticons, it can be difficult to know how to take some written passages and the thing is, some audiophiles of the audiophool variety will lap it up and believe every word as gospel, not at all seeing the despair (?) behind them.

Exactly - people come here from other places where they will have been reading stuff like that, written unironically, for decades and will simply think it is a genuine post.

 

[Mnyb]

I have recently decided to buy a new Audiolab 6000CDT based on all the rave review online & YouTube.

Connected it up & disappointed with its bright, slightly artificial, very digital sound signature so I left on playing repeat for over a week to burn in.

Still, not much more improvement so my question is how long (hours, days, months & etc) would a new cd transport need to burn in?

Is a week enough, worth waiting longer to burn in? TBH, I want to return it back to the online retailer (still have aprox 3 weeks left) as I just don’t like the overall sound signature of the Audiolab 6000CDT!

What people here are trying to explain .

There is no actual physical mechanism by with a functioning CD transport can do what you describe , they either work or not , you get dropouts and disturbances not tonal changes ? If its a problem .

Imo return it anyway as there is no point in replacing the transport ? They should all be the same given if they work properly you can basically use any 40$ dvd or blue-ray found in wallmart , but a real CDT is nicer in many ways , for example speed when reading TOC and handling discs , display etc

What was the DAC btw , sorry if I missed that bit of information

 

[Mal]

People will do anything for you if they can convince you to part with more money.

That's maybe a bit cynical, if they provide a burn in service, and do nothing, it might work as a placebo effect.

"This widespread use and acceptance of placebos is consistent with similar studies worldwide. In the UK, the GMC does not explicitly discuss or prohibit the use of placebos in the treatment of patients, other than mentioning placebos in a footnote of their research guidance..."

A quick google shows there are people offering burn in services!

 

[Mal]

... a real CDT is nicer in many ways , for example speed when reading TOC and handling discs , display etc

But what is is a "real CDT"? The following review of "seemingly real CDTs" showed appalling flaws in the simplest of functions. The Schitt has a Schitt open button and Schitty display, and the audiolab has audible whirring (and a horrible display - who needs a picture of the CD revolving!)

 

[sq225917]

A transport doesn't just send a perfect noiseless, perfect eye pattern, there's a load of other stuff travelling along with signal. You also now have another item with gnd currents going through it.

So it's perfectly OK to say that the difference between transports shouldn't be audible with modern competent dacs, that's not the same as saying no difference is possible. ( unlikely, but not impossible).

I'd check his audiolab cdt to make sure it's working. Because technically it'll beat any golden era transport in measured performance.

 

[AdamG]

What is really the function (lie) about “Burn in Time” for electronic devices? Some unscrupulous Manufacturers will use this excuse as a delaying tactic for you returning the product. They will say stuff like. The sound will mello and smooth out after XXX number of “Burn in Hours”. While this is pure nonsense it does make the buyer hesitant to return the product until they can achieve the burn in time. Thus you hold on to the product longer and the 30 day return window closes. It’s a gimmick to reduce the number of returned products with the 30 return period. After that they will only accept returns for valid “Defects” as described in the Warranty.

It’s about raising doubt in your mind that the device needs to break in to sound good/right/relaxed/chill/smooth/mellow. This doubt causes the buyer to hold on to the product longer with the hope by the Manufacturer, that the “30 any reason return policy” return window will expire.

 

[Mnyb]

A transport doesn't just send a perfect noiseless, perfect eye pattern, there's a load of other stuff travelling along with signal. You also now have another item with gnd currents going through it.

So it's perfectly OK to say that the difference between transports shouldn't be audible with modern competent dacs, that's not the same as saying no difference is possible. ( unlikely, but not impossible).

I'd check his audiolab cdt to make sure it's working. Because technically it'll beat any golden era transport in measured performance.

Even then a tonal change is very far fetched ?

 

[Mnyb]

But what is is a "real CDT"? The following review of "seemingly real CDTs" showed appalling flaws in the simplest of functions. The Schitt has a Schitt open button and Schitty display, and the audiolab has audible whirring (and a horrible display - who needs a picture of the CD revolving!)

.. if they exists at all nowadays apparently ? wonder if anyone makes suitable mechanics anymore ? Find a golden era CDP in working or repairable condition then .

My last transport a Meridian G98DH used some kind of computer drive that also could read DVDA discs . The drive in those are not very good they brake all the time and there is no replacement .

 

[sergeauckland]

A transport doesn't just send a perfect noiseless, perfect eye pattern, there's a load of other stuff travelling along with signal. You also now have another item with gnd currents going through it.

So it's perfectly OK to say that the difference between transports shouldn't be audible with modern competent dacs, that's not the same as saying no difference is possible. ( unlikely, but not impossible).

I'd check his audiolab cdt to make sure it's working. Because technically it'll beat any golden era transport in measured performance.

It is when referring to tonal or other subjective differences. Whatever the 'load of other stuff travelling along with the signal', if severe enough it will stop the DAC from locking and decoding the stream, in which case the audio will be broken. It will mute, click or make rude noises. It won't affect the tonal quality, distortion or frequency response.

It should be remembered that what the transport outputs is a data stream, not audio. Just numbers, which represent the two channels of 24 bits (only 16 of those are used with CD) plus status bits. If those numbers get corrupted such that the DAC won't lock, then the audio fails, doesn't just sound different.

S.

 

[PyramidElectric]

I-1I

It is when referring to tonal or other subjective differences. Whatever the 'load of other stuff travelling along with the signal', if severe enough it will stop the DAC from locking and decoding the stream, in which case the audio will be broken. It will mute, click or make rude noises. It won't affect the tonal quality, distortion or frequency response.

It should be remembered that what the transport outputs is a data stream, not audio. Just numbers, which represent the two channels of 24 bits (only 16 of those are used with CD) plus status bits. If those numbers get corrupted such that the DAC won't lock, then the audio fails, doesn't just sound different.

S.

You're right about the digital stuff, but it's also possible that a coax connection could introduce ground noise (or create a ground loop) into the analogue section of the DAC, where this noise *could* then interact with the analogue signal, and cause cause some sort change in the frequency response (or at least change the SNR). I'd imagine it'd take someting to be very broken for this to be an audible problem, but not impossible.

 

[antcollinet]

You're right about the digital stuff, but it's also possible that a coax connection could introduce ground noise (or create a ground loop) into the analogue section of the DAC, where this noise *could* then interact with the analogue signal, and cause cause some sort change in the frequency response (or at least change the SNR). I'd imagine it'd take someting to be very broken for this to be an audible problem, but not impossible.

Ground loops specifically don't "get into the analogue section of a DAC" Instead, they result in a voltage difference between the analogue source (normally DAC, but can be any analogue source) and analogue destination (normally Amp, but can be any analogue destination) that results in the noise being added to the signal at the input to the destination.

This is why balanced connections can reject the noise. If it was on the signal on the output of the DAC, balanced interconnect wouldn't help.

But yes the shield/ground of an RCA SPDIF connection can conduct ground currents that then go on to disrupt analogue connections downstream of the DAC. However, ground loops are a system issue - and not a fault with any one device in the chain - such as a transport.

 

[Johnboy1964]

First of all, that is not a proper burn in technique for transports. You can't just leave the player playing random music because there could be serious consequences.
Let's just hope your player isn't ruined.
You need to prepare music material in advance and you have to do it in order. Before you even start playing some music, you need to play 10 minutes of pink noise so that you try to negate the damage of random music playing.

You said that the sound is clinical? Then you need to start with mid bass, so play some 50s Jazz and use only Impulse and Bluenote releases. Think Miles, Coltrane... 60hours
After that you need only 30 to 40 hours of 2000s minimal techno for sub bass.
Now the hard part is to open up those kicks and to solidify the bass and for that you need some 80 hours of drum n bass.
All this is good for the bass, but it will close up some mids, and to reopen them, you must play 40 hours of male crooners from 40s to 60s like Sinatra, Dean Martin, Early Bennet... But please, no Michael Buble or you will mess up the imaging.
Now finally for silky smooth upper mids and highs you can play modern jazz female vocals like Nicki Parrott, Emilie-Claire Barlow and similar. 40 hours will do it.

The important note is that you can't just let the player play without you listening or you will develop something which is called the Cold Burn and that will mean that your player would be unburninable anymore.
Also, you should own original CDs of the material, but play only the burned copies because it will burn in the player without wearing out the motor. And please, use only 8x burn speed for CDs, not the 16X or you will cause overburn.

Good luck!

Looks like something from a British 90s hi fi magazine.

 

[DSJR]

Looks like something from a British 90s hi fi magazine.

Oh, I think the US and other audiophile places were as bad, not just 'us.'

 

[Punter]

Even though a CD transport operates largely in the domain of ones and zeroes it would appear that resonance and vibration can play havoc with the sound quality.

The gentleman who owns this example has found the answer to the horrific and destructive power of these unwanted physical assaults.

By simply sticking "Silent Coat" 4mm aluminum backed Butyl constrained layer damping sheet strategically inside the case and on susceptible parts of the mechanism he has achieved the following:

"Immediately sounding better already from power up in terms of solidity, soundstage depth, separation and detail.
The sound is bigger, clearer and projects better. Speaking of detail, the player sounds more relaxed, but more detail is coming through?
It's like it has more time to play music, things sounding more 'right' in terms of timbre and timing."

Link

You can thank me later.

 

[jsrtheta]

I have recently decided to buy a new Audiolab 6000CDT based on all the rave review online & YouTube.

Connected it up & disappointed with its bright, slightly artificial, very digital sound signature so I left on playing repeat for over a week to burn in.

Still, not much more improvement so my question is how long (hours, days, months & etc) would a new cd transport need to burn in?

Is a week enough, worth waiting longer to burn in? TBH, I want to return it back to the online retailer (still have aprox 3 weeks left) as I just don’t like the overall sound signature of the Audiolab 6000CDT!

To paraphrase Peter Aczel, a transport can't make the 1s more 1-ish, or the 0s more 0-ish. It works or it doesn't.

 

[Old_School_Brad]

Even though a CD transport operates largely in the domain of ones and zeroes it would appear that resonance and vibration can play havoc with the sound quality.

The gentleman who owns this example has found the answer to the horrific and destructive power of these unwanted physical assaults.

View attachment 410236

By simply sticking "Silent Coat" 4mm aluminum backed Butyl constrained layer damping sheet strategically inside the case and on susceptible parts of the mechanism he has achieved the following:

"Immediately sounding better already from power up in terms of solidity, soundstage depth, separation and detail.
The sound is bigger, clearer and projects better. Speaking of detail, the player sounds more relaxed, but more detail is coming through?
It's like it has more time to play music, things sounding more 'right' in terms of timbre and timing."

Link

You can thank me later.

You shouldn’t be doing this. Some people reading your post will believe it to be true.

 

[voodooless]

Besides, I am not sure I support this Poe's Law... it is the enemy of creativity IMHO.

https://www.quora.com/Why-do-some-satirists-strongly-dislike-the-concept-of-Poes-Law-or-the-usage-of-sarcasm-markers-on-internet-posts
Please, I meant no offense to OP. This is just a bit of harmless fun.

The first sentence of that post explains it just fine:

Because any joke you have to explain is a bad joke.

Clearly the OP didn’t understand, nor did plenty of other members. This is Exactly what Poe’s law is about.

This doesn’t mean your joke was bad per say. The problem here is context. If I go to a satirical show, I know what to expect. Out of the blue on an Internet forum where this kind of nonsense is spouted regularly, you will need a tiny bit more to make the joke work. Satire isn’t good satire if it only perfectly imitates the subject it is trying to criticize. You’ll have to go beyond. I feel your response was just still a tiny bit on the conservative side, making it just a tiny bit too ambiguous On the other hand, some of these audiophiles are so bat-shit-crazy that there is almost no beyond… which is again exactly what Poe’s law is about.

 

[polmuaddib]

I think we are beating a dead horse now. Enough with my joke. Who gets it, gets it, who doesn't, doesn't and all is ok.
Main thing is that OP has learned one of two things:
Either that burn in of audio equipment is not real and he goes exploring ASR and finding ways to enhance his music enjoyment without braking the bank, or that we, here at the ASR, are no fun at all.

 

[voodooless]

Either that burn in of audio equipment is not real and he goes exploring ASR and finding ways to enhance his music enjoyment without braking the bank, or that we, here at the ASR, are no fun at all.

Of course, we're not fun! We're a bunch of super hardcore science geeks staring at an AP with our lab coats on all day.