Audiogon thread critical of ASR

[Astoneroad]

The really hilarious part was the Greek chorus of AGers impugning my morality. But no takers….

Pervert. Miscreant. Wastrel. What's the over/under on how long before your posts are removed?... where was I... oh yeah... deviant...

 

[Killingbeans]

The fact that many people can hear a change but not tell you which cable it is doesn't change the fact the guy brings the cable back and want's the other
cable, weather biased or not. IT HAPPENS. LOL The guy that bought the BS still has to be satisfied even if it's pacified.

You can't just erase bias like that. The idea of the magical cable stays in your head. And then you get hit by FOMO. "What if... what if it actually sounds better!"

And then you get the cable back in your hands. You feel the weight, you look at the lovely sleeve and you remember the great music you heard while owning the cable. It's like an old friend has come back to you. All of these things make short work of any rationality.

Is that normal? Yes. Does it imply sub-par intelligence? Absolutely not!

Does it mean that the cable does anything to an electrical signal that any other cable doesn't do? Nope.

It took 10 years for me to figure out a pair of pure silver # 12 USAF surplus cables needed time to sound right.

It's relatively easy to build a null-tester. It shows you whether a cable does anything audible whatsoever. It's not really necessary when you know the math, but it makes a good point to see the "sound" of cables in real life action.

I predict that if you build one and do some experimentation, you'll be be disappointed and/or confused by the result you get from those silver cables. You'd might even start grasping at baseless excuses as to why a null-tester should be considered an unreliable tool for the job.

I do however personally belive in burn-in. The difference being that I see it as something caused 100% by the plasticity of our brains.

 

[ahofer]

I do however personally belive in burn-in. The difference being that I see it as something caused 100% by the plasticity of our brains.

Kinda cool, actually, that we grow to like the system we already have. Why is it that the most fanatical “burn-in” believers tend to be more restless with upgrades, then?

 

[mhardy6647]

Yet but not when a member goes into a series of posts at a level of psychotic abuse against someone… me for my crime of using first-order crossovers.

If it makes you feel any better -- I'm OK with your first order XOs.

 

[spiral scratch]

"There is only one thing in life worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." - Oscar Wilde

 

[Killingbeans]

Why is it that the most fanatical “burn-in” believers tend to be more restless with upgrades, then?

Good question. My bet would be that the FOMO is so strong that it overpowers everything.

 

[fpitas]

If it makes you feel any better -- I'm OK with your first order XOs.

I like the industrial motif going on there.

 

[teched58]

Break-in not burn-in. There is a point where wear is considered negligible and BREAK-IN has stopped. For the lack of a better term normal wear is
is considered normal wear until it isn't. The time varies on all thing. Cable and wire not so much, but the BREAK-IN or how it will eventually sound
for the majority of it's life happens. I'm not here to debate the change and how long it can take if it changes at all. I'm here to say things change.
I know most OFC .99999 copper with PVC is going to take about 2 hours to sound the way it's going to. Copper with Silver clad/teflon on the other hand
changes for hundreds of hours and THEN stops at a point and stabilizes to a point of no more change. Is it still changing?
Until eternity future or the cows come home. Take your pick.

The fact that many people can hear a change but not tell you which cable it is doesn't change the fact the guy brings the cable back and want's the other
cable, weather biased or not. IT HAPPENS. LOL The guy that bought the BS still has to be satisfied even if it's pacified.

It took 10 years for me to figure out a pair of pure silver # 12 USAF surplus cables needed time to sound right. The guy in Elk Grove
laughed at me for not knowing that in the early 80s. I was using Klipsch Horns and Jensen Imperials and J/Subs. I spent 50 dollars on that GD cable and
it was the worst cable I ever heard. About 5-800 hours and 10 years later, they not only changed, a guy paid 2000.00 for the remainder of the cable on
the spool. I guess silver went up from the 70s. I got my 50.00 dollars worth. Still have them here somewhere.

They sounded wonderful UNTILL, that's a different story.

These may wind up being the most constructive threads ever posted on fellas. YOU could be making history. We might just stop a war and wind up
on the moon listening to music like they should have 40 years ago.

I'm listening to Kenny Rogers. "Ruby"

Come on dog time to dance.

Are you sure you're going to be happy on this forum? I don't think so.

There is indeed a forum where people are power supply and cable ̶n̶u̶t̶t̶e̶r̶s̶ believers and they are also polite about it. Many of us here on ASR used to be posters there, but we were essentially asked to leave (nicely though; Chris is a nice guy). That might be the place for you -- they would absolutely get all excited about your idea that it's not burn in but break in.

 

[classay amplifier]

Audiogone

(I'll see myself out)

 

[Ken1951]

I read most of that thread on AG. IMNSHO @amirm is wasting his precious time posting anything there. Loads of butthurt and parroting the same old audio tropes. Everything is thrown back at him and none of them believe there's not money involved somewhere and that nobody on this forum ever listens to music. Same old, same old. We know better, you and your minions know nothing.

 

[DonR]

I know most OFC .99999 copper with PVC is going to take about 2 hours to sound the way it's going to. Copper with Silver clad/teflon on the other hand
changes for hundreds of hours and THEN stops at a point and stabilizes to a point of no more change.

What is the theory behind this? What precisely is changing that alters the field in the cable? Can you point me to a peer-reviewed reputable journal paper that explains this?

 

[Vacceo]

I read most of that thread on AG. IMNSHO @amirm is wasting his precious time posting anything there. Loads of butthurt and parroting the same old audio tropes. Everything is thrown back at him and none of them believe there's not money involved somewhere and that nobody on this forum ever listens to music. Same old, same old. We know better, you and your minions know nothing.

My recent interest in the music of people like Mikko Aspa may confirm this suspicion, but on the other hand I'm just one among thousands, so I hope you guys do better than me

 

[amirm]

Let's leave cable/breaknin discussions to other threads please.

 

[ahofer]

I’d be happy to renew my charity challenge for cable…aging. However, my original thought for cables was that they would have to null test to some agreed-upon below audibility threshold first (to avoid cables-designed-as-EQ). Maybe we could start with examining null-tester differences with some samples, then move to blind tests if they prove sufficiently small.

oh - sorry Amir. We crossed each other.

 

[amirm]

I read most of that thread on AG. IMNSHO @amirm is wasting his precious time posting anything there. Loads of butthurt and parroting the same old audio tropes. Everything is thrown back at him and none of them believe there's not money involved somewhere and that nobody on this forum ever listens to music. Same old, same old. We know better, you and your minions know nothing.

I am not writing for the few that are posing there but the many that read them.

 

[fpitas]

I read most of that thread on AG. IMNSHO @amirm is wasting his precious time posting anything there. Loads of butthurt and parroting the same old audio tropes. Everything is thrown back at him and none of them believe there's not money involved somewhere and that nobody on this forum ever listens to music. Same old, same old. We know better, you and your minions know nothing.

It's frustrating, but you have to remember that for every angry crank posting, there are 10 lurkers just reading. Somebody may get a clue.

 

[DonH56]

I am not writing for the few that are posing there but the many that read them.

I was going to suggest correcting "posing" to "posting" then realized your way is most likely correct...

 

[Frgirard]

Let's leave cable/breaknin discussions to other threads please.

this is the essence of audiophilia. hunte the difference on everything entering the reproduction chain. the cable or the break-in are audiophilia. you get the wrong fight by going to AG and denying the existence of their hobby.

 

[fpitas]

this is the essence of audiophilia. hunte the difference on everything entering the reproduction chain. the cable or the break-in are audiophilia. you get the wrong fight by going to AG and denying the existence of their hobby.

Maybe, but it is kind of fun nonetheless.

 

[JustJones]

I am not writing for the few that are posing there but the many that read them.

I found this site a few years ago from reading denigrating posts about ASR on audiogon. I never bought into cable, fuse, rocks, green pens or other magic. Audiogon was a constant battle to even get some of them to apply common sense. This place is a breath of fresh air.