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ASR Directiva Open Source Speaker Review

Rick Sykora

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I would not consider the Klippel NFS to be in the category of "minimal resources".
Agree, but the Klippel was a bonus. Design work could have been done with much less expensive test rig and sometimes was.

The Klippel was most useful to validate the bass tuning, but no design mods resulted from the low bass measurements.
 
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JRS

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It feels like the DEQX Pre-8 was designed for this sort of project - although more than the miniDSP, it's also a bit classier and of course raises the price by another 2 or 3K, so might as well go whole hog and use Benchmark AHB2 as your amplifiers :) With this budget, we're talking about the Dutch & Dutch as competition!
I wish; I so hope I am wrong but I suspect the pre8 will be around $5500-7000. The original was around 4k and only had six channels, no screen, etc. I got a demo of one of the PDP's, that 3K was the best money I have spent in audio, besides maybe a Topping DX3 Pro Plus for 200.
 
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respice finem

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I would not consider the Klippel NFS to be in the category of "minimal resources".
The "big boys" in the industry probably spend more on promotion of a single series ;) think of B&W as an example.
And, it's a park of their commercial hardware park = tax deduction mitigates the cost.
So it's all a question of comparison - if you compare with a home DIYer, it looks differently of course.
 
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JRS

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It’s all hard to tell and I get your point, I don’t have experience in speaker designs, but I do in electronics. In general, and yes there are exceptions, but, in General, the real price of a commercial product is more like 6 times BOM cost, anything less you are losing money, but direct sales can remediate a bit of that. Like Schiit for exemple. Hi volume can also shave some of that factor, but again, ultra Hi end don’t do volume.. That was my only point. In this case BOM cost is not 1400. because with this cost you don’t have a finished product, at the very least it’s missing a crossover, and as designed, you are missing amplification, ADC, DSP, and DAC for 4 channels of audio. In my opinion, and again I absolutely have nothing against that and I value this kind of performance, but I stick to it, translated as a sellable products, we are looking at 10k$+ active bookshelves, In other words, very Hi end territory, and as for DIY, you save some, but not as much as one would think, we´ll have to know how much the Kits come at, but from what I get, the kit will still be only drivers, encolure, and connectors, so something that needs electronics in order to be consider full active speakers. Again, not a critic of this design, I’m all for it.
Just reading the thread now, so very late reply: I would beg to differ re the costs of DYI. There are any number of kits available that are strong designs, having been around in some cases for years that would cost three or more times as much to match sonically, partly because of the six X rule mentioned above. Meniscus Audio is a great source for such. I have either designed or put together something like 8 kits for friends and myself, and not one of them could be equaled w/o spending three times as much. Some kits are very easy to assemble with pre-cut flat packs--like the subwoofers at Parts express where the savings might not be quite as large, and yes there is a fair amount of labor and expenses like buying a saw, router, drill sanders and the like if you don't have them already, but for me and most I know who do it it truly is a labor of love. The other thing to bear in mind is that once you have done one active, the DSP and amps are free, which eliminates that cost and those of passive crossover which can be considerable.
 

Spocko

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I wish; I so hope I am wrong but I suspect the pre8 will be around $5500-7000. The original was around 4k and only had six channels, no screen, etc. I got a demo of one of the PDP's, that 3K was the best money I have spent in audio, besides maybe a Topping DX3 Pro Plus for 200.
Actually, this is pretty fair considering it has room correction and an active crossover system for 8 channels whereas the Trinnov ST4-HiFi offers similar functionality for only 4 channels and costs $5,500 (with 3D microphone) and no OLED screen
 
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JRS

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Actually, this is pretty fair considering it has room correction and an active crossover system for 8 channels whereas the Trinnov ST4-HiFi offers similar functionality for only 4 channels and costs $5,500 (with 3D microphone) and no OLED screen
I completely agree. To the uninitiated the DEQX may seem like a Sanskrit crossword puzzle, but if you have used REW or DIRAC, likely have something up and singing in 30 minutes. I'm dreading the crossover into having to integrate source, DAC's, software and streamer vs streaming on my laptop with a USB connection to the DEQX.

.
 

Spocko

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I completely agree. To the uninitiated the DEQX may seem like a Sanskrit crossword puzzle, but if you have used REW or DIRAC, likely have something up and singing in 30 minutes. I'm dreading the crossover into having to integrate source, DAC's, software and streamer vs streaming on my laptop with a USB connection to the DEQX.

.
Still sounds like a good match for the Directiva to replace the miniDSP for those willing to throw in another $6000 for convenience and packaging.
 

JRS

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Still sounds like a good match for the Directiva to replace the miniDSP for those willing to throw in another $6000 for convenience and packaging.
No doubt, and still under what Wilson is selling those crap Scan Speak mini-monitors for. I suspect if one worked a bit, you could export/hack the correction filters and use them in an inexpensive system elsewhere in the house. Granted one could do the same with REW, but DEQX really takes the tedium out of the msmts and does so at 1 to 2 meters using swept and averaged log sine sweeps so the data are robust. I like that protocol of fix the speakers first, then tackle room effects vs an all at once take that can't be taken to another room or different house. A huge part of the improvement is simply getting transducers to behave properly.
 
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JRS

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Hello Folks,

there is a new „reference Speaker“ from Troels.

what do you think about this construction?
The Purifi website must be getting a bit of traffic, I can't find much about it except what TRoel says: it is more efficient:), at close to 89dB depeding on the volts vs watt spec (that's for 2.83V), and has greater extension in the mids being flat as a board out to 4K. In exchange, you give up half the Xmax. So Troel's solution is, bless his heart, to double up on them in a WWT with his usual ambitious cabinetry. Seems perfect for that or an MTM. I only wish Purifi would clean up the model designations--we have this one, the normal long throw, the aluminum version of the long throw, and somethig I have been giving some thought to, the midrange version--tho version obscures the fact it is essentially a new driver with a different basket and lower mass, along with the reduced Xmax.
 
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hvbias

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Looking at the measurements, just throw on some beautiful high gloss wood veneer (I like Macassar ebony) and looks like you have something like the equivalent of a Corvette that is a supercar killer!

Just thinking out loud - since @Rick Sykora has already mentioned flatpacks in the thread and they are going to need to be on stands, what about extending this concept to a different model as tower speakers? Same narrow profile would occupy the same space as these bookshelf speakers on stands, allow the use of multiple lower cost bass drivers (still high quality ones) to reduce excursion further? I personally prefer the looks of narrow towers as well, one of the best looking speakers I heard at a dealer in Toronto was the Living Voice OBX.
 

tktran303

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Still sounds like a good match for the Directiva to replace the miniDSP for those willing to throw in another $6000 for convenience and packaging.

No it’s not.

The miniDSP Flex 2x4 is much more appropriate.

Yes DEQX is an Australian company and I should root for them, but the price is out of touch with reality.
 
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Rick Sykora

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Looking at the measurements, just throw on some beautiful high gloss wood veneer (I like Macassar ebony) and looks like you have something like the equivalent of a Corvette that is a supercar killer!

Just thinking out loud - since @Rick Sykora has already mentioned flatpacks in the thread and they are going to need to be on stands, what about extending this concept to a different model as tower speakers? Same narrow profile would occupy the same space as these bookshelf speakers on stands, allow the use of multiple lower cost bass drivers (still high quality ones) to reduce excursion further? I personally prefer the looks of narrow towers as well, one of the best looking speakers I heard at a dealer in Toronto was the Living Voice OBX.

While Directiva r1 could be done as a small tower, it would not improve it.

R2 is more optimized along those lines. The initial r2 prototype is being built right now and may have some test results in the new week or two. R2 will have a bass tower module that is extensible and a slim tower is one of the primary design targets.

Hope this helps!

Rick
 

hvbias

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with 1/3 octave smoothing any speaker can have 8.5 score lmfao.

Yes, I think that is interesting that this person has addressed every post aimed at them except this, which is very disingenuous. And the 1/3 octave smoothing isn't even mentioned anywhere in the Google Docs file, it's left up to the reader to make that conclusion, something that is can very easily be missable.

That 8.5 preference score is utterly meaningless. The preference scores derived from Amir's measurements are much more unforgiving higher resolution.

The added irony of the jab about measurements and religion in their signature when 1/3 octave smoothing is used is the cherry on top of it all.
 
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hvbias

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While Directiva r1 could be done as a small tower, it would not improve it.

R2 is more optimized along those lines. The initial r2 prototype is being built right now and may have some test results in the new week or two. R2 will have a bass tower module that is extensible and a slim tower is one of the primary design targets.

Hope this helps!

Rick

Incredibly helpful. How wonderful to miss this thread and the design thread (due to me only checked my three or four subscribed threads regularly) and see them on Christmas Eve, like the world's best Christmas present... well other than the NES I got in 1990 :D
 

muad

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While Directiva r1 could be done as a small tower, it would not improve it.

R2 is more optimized along those lines. The initial r2 prototype is being built right now and may have some test results in the new week or two. R2 will have a bass tower module that is extensible and a slim tower is one of the primary design targets.

Hope this helps!

Rick
I might steal your bass module to make my ls50 metas a 3 way ;)
 

Rick Sykora

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Hello Folks,

there is a new „reference Speaker“ from Troels.

what do you think about this construction?

While a bit hard to comment on the results without a full spin, as you would expect, Troels does a top notch job of most every aspect of speaker design...

What is more difficult to judge is value. As many have stated here, the Purifi drivers are pricey. This design uses 3 per speaker. So, once you add the Satori tweeter, around $1400 in drivers. Likely the crossover is another $200-$300 each. So, call it $3400 per pair before cabinets. For $3700, could have a pair of finished BMR towers. Directiva r1 has comparable value challenges, so Troels speaker is not alone in regard to value.

However, if you are looking for a "price is no object" DIY build, this one should be considered. :cool:
 

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