What It has little to do is with true perfectionism. It is obvious that they are using this sticker to get a public approval in terms of likes, stars, pink panthers, o whatever might help boost their business. I am absolutely convinced that they invested those 100k on Klippel's gear more for marketing reasons than for purely technical ones.
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Ascend Sierra-1 V2 Speaker Review
- Thread starter amirm
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What makes you 'absolutely convinced'? This presents more like an NFS certification on a blender than a statement of ideology. Wouldn't you agree that the paid/organic marketing alone is many times more influential than a sticker on the product? What about the stickers on your typical AVR? Does including Atmos put off a certain subset of 2 channel extremists?
Wonder if there are differences in Ascend speakers pre vs post Klippel? Would be interesting to review v1 pre Klippel and v2 post Klippel and see if there are both objective and subjective differences and any relationship between those such that they are likely to be attributable to the Klippel.
Know what? I hate stickers, stigmas, tatoos and the like...
If the pre Klippel versions were not too bad, I am sure the post Klippel (with only minor changes at the xover) will sound pretty similar, nothing like night and day. Loudspeakers are not like amps or dacs, and the idea of a transparent sounding loudspeaker is purely utopic, whatever the drivers, cabinets, etc... Whatever the stickers too...
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Not to be terse...but so what? A business exists to make profits and if advertising your product was optimized using a state-of-the-art speaker measurement system to help boost your business...what is wrong with that? Should a business owner try to decrease their potential sales then to appease those who think like this? It would be one thing if a company was using snake oil/deceit to boost their business - obviously everyone would be against that - but the measurements/objective improvements are there for anyone to see. You seem to think giving the consumer 'less' information about the potential product they're buying is a good thing.
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So you despise a company for investing in itself because you believe it's purely marketing? Not that they have developed other speakers from the ground up using that investment?
You just come off bitter, why, I have no idea.
thewas
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It should be differentiated that while the Klippel NFS is a great tool for loudspeaker development it is not really the suitable tool for quality control as a spin takes much too long, so most companies who do such just do it an small (sometimes pseudioanechoic) chamber as you don't need absolute correct anechoic values but just the comparison of a single axis to the one of "golden sample" to detect most problems or defects.
Also it should be repeated while its a great tool for loudspeaker development it is not necessarily a must as it can be seen from many of the best measuring loudspeaker manufacturers who don't have such but some anechoic chambers instead, it makes just measurement easier especially for the many angles and bass region compared to stitching the upper part of limited size anechoic chambers gated measurements to nearfield of free field bass measurements. @napilopez has even shown a nice method for us hobbyists to do such. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ents-spinoramas-with-rew-and-vituixcad.21860/
Also it should be repeated while its a great tool for loudspeaker development it is not necessarily a must as it can be seen from many of the best measuring loudspeaker manufacturers who don't have such but some anechoic chambers instead, it makes just measurement easier especially for the many angles and bass region compared to stitching the upper part of limited size anechoic chambers gated measurements to nearfield of free field bass measurements. @napilopez has even shown a nice method for us hobbyists to do such. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ents-spinoramas-with-rew-and-vituixcad.21860/
Nice to see a relatively inexpensive speaker measure so well. Their entire line-up looks intriguing.
Martin
Martin
I prefered the old days when you could go to the next door hifi shop and have a listen to some models to make your own idea, and make a decision not purely based on reviews made by others, being those reviewers objectivists, subjectivists, golden ears or almost untrained listenners. Sadly we know have to make our livings on line and this is also how creds and reps are built, by all kind of more or less toxical influencers...
I dispise the use they make of Klippel's name. It seems that's what they paid for.
Call me puritan...
Audio Science Pal
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You might like to read post #1 at the beginning of this thread.
GM3
Active Member
How dare DaveF use advanced measuring equipment to create technologically advanced speakers...! Speaker design is an art. He should just use his ears and go by what his gut tells him, just pick a tweeter and a woofer at random (or by coolest looking), then just download xsim to design a crossover, then wait until Danny gets a hold of the speaker and fixes it by creating a new crossover and kit with binding tubes™, then get Amir to remeasure and introduce a great towel mod to fix Danny's design, and woila, then you have a speaker that you can truly enjoy, that can introduce you to a world of nuances and audio bliss. That's how it should be.NFS optimized!
Why not directly Klippel/ASR approved?
If you just NFS optimize speakers, what's the point?! Are you going to measure the speakers or listen to them? Microphones can't feel the emotion of the music. Like so what if they measure great and it shows great design? Doesn't mean you'll like them, maybe you like worse speakers. People shouldn't be allowed to measure speakers, people should just buy audio magazines and read poetic reviews. Is there any poetry in measurements? Ok maybe there is, kinda creates art too, but that's not the point. The point is enjoying music, and NFS optimized, it's not fair, what are companies like Audio Note, Totem, Zu, etc., supposed to do?! Buy NFS too?! It's just an arms race towards best performing speakers, and we all know we can't have that. Music is subjective, this objective performance thing is going to kill the industry.
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As i said, improvement cannot be night and day, if and only if V1 is a competent enough design... Not the disaster we see above. Most diyers achieve better results with humble equipment and public domain software. No need to pay for Klippel, not even for Clio...
Yes i have read this and all that buzz...
Penelinfi
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I'd question your claim of "most". Plenty of not so great measuring "DIY kits" that have been put to market.
Plenty of drivers jammed into boxes with generic crossovers that you don't see.
As for night and day. So we should only buy better equipment if it does "night and day" differences?
Yep there's no point using newer drivers or for anyone to make new speakers as they won't bring night and day differences.
Robbo99999
Master Contributor
You're reading too much into it and making it something it's not. Frankly ridiculous. We want good engineered speakers, and Klippel is a tool that help achieves that, if you want to read some kind of imaginary stigma into it then that's really just your problem. For those that don't know about measurements & don't know what Klippel even is then they still get a good designed speaker because of it, so everyone wins (except your imaginary problems).
No i said diy, designed and built by yourself. Never would buy a loudspeaker kit.
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