Elac Debut Reference DBR-62 Speaker Review

[muad]

https://www.buchardtaudio.com/s400-detailed-description-1

This is a spin for the Buchardt S300, there are few noticable similarities in the measurments and I would go as far to guess that they have a very similar sound, except for maybe a little less energy in the 3khz region compared to the Elacs. The thing I don't understand is how a box speaker without any real waveguide could measure this well? There doesn't appear to be any bunching at the low end of the tweeters range (as seen in the above link), which is usually so common with flat baffle speakers. I've had a bunch of "hifi" speakers and many sound clear as a bell in the upper mids, and tend to be grating and maintain too much energy in that region throughout the off axis.

 

[BYRTT]

...The thing I don't understand is how a box speaker without any real waveguide could measure this well? There doesn't appear to be any bunching at the low end of the tweeters range (as seen in the above link), which is usually so common with flat baffle speakers. I've had a bunch of "hifi" speakers and many sound clear as a bell in the upper mids, and tend to be grating and maintain too much energy in that region throughout the off axis.

Lets see what Amir get out of it but think notice dome is listed as textile for S300 and cloth for DRB-62 and also each have more or less a small or few milimeters deep wave guidance, for comparison purpose so far your S300 curves is overlaid in below DRB-62 spinorama.

 

[ROOSKIE]

Well, I might call it "normal".

So is this model identical to what sells as the Debut 2.0 B6.2 around here? Those seem to be selling at around 300€ a pair. That, in fact, is inexpensive.

No, different speakers but that model has received excellent reviews in the press and on various audio sites. Be really interested in seeing the measured here. If I find a sweet price I will send one in. They often go on sale in the states for $200usd.
I had a pair of the Debut 2.0 B5.2 (smaller box and woofer) that I tried for fun as I picked them up new for $145usd. Very good speaker for the money. Especially adept at moderate to moderately low playback levels, just truly excellent there. Not quite so great played loudly. In any case very decent for such small cash.

 

[Haint]

Yes, $600 is considered inexpensive.

On this forum maybe, but not the market at large. You're talking about a $1600+ 2.1 system with equivalent bang for buck components (Debut's + ~$500 AVR + ~$500 Sub). This is mid range to most people, budget territory is Sony Core's, BS22's, Micca MB42's, or R-41s with a $200 AVR and $100-$150 Sub (i.e. Dayton 1200, Monoprice 9723). Bargain basement is a $100-$200 soundbar or HTiB with plastic speakers. No money is your TV, phone, or tablet speakers.

 

[muad]

Wow, thanks for doing the overlay. Makes it much easier to spot the differences. Looks like the S300 would have a couple extra decibles of zing up top, and a tiny bit deeper bass, but they're probably more alike than different? The DBR definitely has a far deeper larger waveguide. The SB Acoustics tweeter flange has very small roundover (I have the beryllium version of the tweeter, or at least it has the same flange), it might help a little, but the results are better than I would have expected.

Now I have to ask... how did you do that? Is the S300 data publically available?

Lets see what Amir get out of it but think notice dome is listed as textile for S300 and cloth for DRB-62 and also each have more or less a small or few milimeters deep wave guidance, for comparison purpose so far your S300 curves is overlaid in below DRB-62 spinorama.
View attachment 56629

 

[wje]

No, different speakers but that model has received excellent reviews in the press and on various audio sites. Be really interested in seeing the measured here. If I find a sweet price I will send one in. They often go on sale in the states for $200usd.
I had a pair of the Debut 2.0 B5.2 (smaller box and woofer) that I tried for fun as I picked them up new for $145usd. Very good speaker for the money. Especially adept at moderate to moderately low playback levels, just truly excellent there. Not quite so great played loudly. In any case very decent for such small cash.

I think that used to be the case in the past. Now, that the B6.2 is $349 (normal price), they've just been going down to $279 (on Amazon, etc.).

 

[BYRTT]

Wow, thanks for doing the overlay. Makes it much easier to spot the differences. Looks like the S300 would have a couple extra decibles of zing up top, and a tiny bit deeper bass, but they're probably more alike than different? The DBR definitely has a far deeper larger waveguide. The SB Acoustics tweeter flange has very small roundover (I have the beryllium version of the tweeter, or at least it has the same flange), it might help a little, but the results are better than I would have expected.

Now I have to ask... how did you do that? Is the S300 data publically available?

Welcome and agree its easier to spot comparison tendencies when curves overlaid into whatever but the exactly same ratio use for X/Y scales.

No those 3 times overlaid S300 curves was traced from your shared plot using "Tools/SPL trace" in free VituixCAD software and Amir cheerful share a zip-folder per acoustic review where one can extract those DBR-62 spin data, if you like to use VituixCAD yourself for ASR reviews i can share below hanged on zip-folder that includes a how to guide and two MS Excell 2010 spreadsheets with automated macro that can extract spin data into multiple txt-files so as it works for use into VituixCAD.

 

[thewas]

I really liked how Buchardt voiced their S300, it even surprised me positively more than the S400, so I guess I would also like the DBR-62 voicing.

Lets see what Amir get out of it but think notice dome is listed as textile for S300 and cloth for DRB-62 and also each have more or less a small or few milimeters deep wave guidance, for comparison purpose so far your S300 curves is overlaid in below DRB-62 spinorama.

@BYRTT: Could you maybe also overlay the LW of both S300 and DBR-62 as imho it corresponds more to the perceived tonaliy than the on-axis curve.
Thank you

 

[deniall83]

I'm pretty pumped about these as I'm in the market for a good budget speaker. I wonder how the floorstanders would compare to these. They are more than twice the price in Australia but I much prefer not having to use stands. They would be in a smallish apartment though so maybe overkill?

 

[wje]

I'm pretty pumped about these as I'm in the market for a good budget speaker. I wonder how the floorstanders would compare to these. They are more than twice the price in Australia but I much prefer not having to use stands. They would be in a smallish apartment though so maybe overkill?

I remember reading up on the Focal Kanta speakers when they were released. For Focal, their recommendations were (approximate), as follows:

Kanta 1 - 250 s.f.
Kanta 2 - 500 s.f.
Kanta 3 - 750 s.f.

I think unless you are sitting 12' back from the speakers, the stand mounts might be the better option. I know in my condominium, I had the Focal 1027BE and then then 1038BE, but they were a bit much for my smaller place. The 1008BE, was optimal when I owned them, too.

 

[BYRTT]

I really liked how Buchardt voiced their S300, it even surprised me positively more than the S400, so I guess I would also like the DBR-62 voicing...

Thanks interesting info myself heard one or two tracks on S400 few years ago picking up some raw SBA transducer at their head quater and remember it as probably being nice sounding but its unfair say more because i was really too much in a hurry that day, but if we talk hardware then think the PP cone on S300 is nice and clean in i have that driver and its little brother as trial transducers for my amateur guitar system.

...@BYRTT: Could you maybe also overlay the LW of both S300 and DBR-62 as imho it corresponds more to the perceived tonaliy than the on-axis curve.
Thank you

Sure you welcome but i had to make it animated so it can toggle between S300 on axis and listening window because else the standard or watermark light colours that is used for overlay feature will clutter together each other.

 

[Jinjuku]

On this forum maybe, but not the market at large. You're talking about a $1600+ 2.1 system with equivalent bang for buck components (Debut's + ~$500 AVR + ~$500 Sub). This is mid range to most people, budget territory is Sony Core's, BS22's, Micca MB42's, or R-41s with a $200 AVR and $100-$150 Sub (i.e. Dayton 1200, Monoprice 9723). Bargain basement is a $100-$200 soundbar or HTiB with plastic speakers. No money is your TV, phone, or tablet speakers.

Where a market hosts speakers easily into the 6 figures, comparatively $600 is inexpensive. My cell phone has a $0.02 speaker. Not sure what your point is.

I get it that some class of people want 100% of the features at 0% of the price.

 

[Piotr]

Where a market hosts speakers easily into the 6 figures, comparatively $600 is inexpensive. My cell phone has a $0.02 speaker. Not sure what your point is.

I get it that some class of people want 100% of the features at 0% of the price.

Lamborghini Veneno costs ~$4.5M and it does not make BMW 3 $42k a budget car. If you go budget you pick, Dacia, Tata or Daihatsu. Imo $600 for speakers it already mid range.

 

[Thomas savage]

Value is subjective so let's skip this topic lol

 

[FrantzM]

Where a market hosts speakers easily into the 6 figures, comparatively $600 is inexpensive. My cell phone has a $0.02 speaker. Not sure what your point is.

I get it that some class of people want 100% of the features at 0% of the price.

That's all that there is to it! All things must be almost free 'cause they cost almost nothing to make..

 

[renaudrenaud]

That's all that there is to it! All things must be almost free 'cause they cost almost nothing to make..

Ha but the price is not only for the components but also for the design.
If you want to pay only for the components, you have to go for your own design and buy components fitting your design.

 

[Jinjuku]

If you think $600 is getting up there time to pick a new hobby.

 

[Iluzun]

I'm pretty pumped about these as I'm in the market for a good budget speaker. I wonder how the floorstanders would compare to these. They are more than twice the price in Australia but I much prefer not having to use stands. They would be in a smallish apartment though so maybe overkill?

The floorstanders would be an excellent choice as they would not excite unnecessary room nodes in the lower regions as easily tends to happen. I own both and wouldn’t hesitate as the tonal balance and presentation seems so well controlled with the smaller drivers.

 

[FrantzM]

The floorstanders would be an excellent choice as they would not excite unnecessary room nodes in the lower regions as easily tends to happen. I own both and wouldn’t hesitate as the tonal balance and presentation seems so well controlled with the smaller drivers.

Well .. this is a bit more complicated.. Exciting room modes is not a matter of floorstanders or bookshelves, it is a matter of how low ( in frequency) and forcefully (SPL) the speaker plays in the low bass ...
The lowly JBL LSR308 are quite capable of "exciting" a room in the bass for exemple. The smaller the room the more likely to have an extremely uneven response in the bass without EQ or DSP.
Thing is, bass is needed. If one cannot afford or doesn't want multiple subs in one's room, one must EQ and perhaps DSP. No other way around it.

 

[Iluzun]

Well .. this is a bit more complicated.. Exciting room modes is not a matter of floorstanders or bookshelves, it is a matter of how low ( in frequency) and forcefully (SPL) the speaker plays in the low bass ...
The lowly JBL LSR308 are quite capable of "exciting" a room in the bass for exemple. The smaller the room the more likely to have an extremely uneven response in the bass without EQ or DSP.
Thing is, bass is needed. If one cannot afford or doesn't want multiple subs in one's room, one must EQ and perhaps DSP. No other way around it.

I guess I’m trying to say that the overall tonal balance of the floorstanders is such, there is no boom, that some have. They can go low quickly but overall they won’t overpower a smaller room like a speaker with a pair of 8“ or really a couple 6” drivers. The 5” have a lighter touch...