Amazon Basics 80W Review (Bookshelf Speaker)

[Steve Dallas]

I am not sure I like this new kinder, gentler @amirm . Two objectively poor speakers in a row receive a recommendation with caveats. Yet better speakers (looking at you LS50) received no such accommodation. I know we are veering toward consistency with headphone reviews here, but I am not convinced that is a good direction.

The vast majority of buyers of these (and the Tune Tots) will have no idea how to EQ a speaker, therefore they will be heard as they come out of the box. Both are terrible in that context, yet both are recommended. I am so disillusioned now...

 

[SmackDaddies]

I have an issue giving a recommendation to any speaker/headphone that "requires" EQ. Now for $50...ok, that is not terrible as long as you have the capacity and knowledge to EQ. But most people buying this will not have either capacity and knowledge to do so. Has to be at best a "not terrible" rating, IMHO

 

[More Dynamics Please]

The vast majority of buyers should be able to grasp the rather basic principle that a speaker recommendation with equalization means that speaker is not recommended without equalization.

 

[eardiggler]

Just out of curiosity, what are you guys using to EQ small speakers like this where you don't want to dedicate a computer? I'm thinking about getting these for my garage.

 

[Madjalapeno]

Just out of curiosity, what are you guys using to EQ small speakers like this where you don't want to dedicate a computer? I'm think about getting these for my garage.

I use Roon (same as @amirm). Lets me use simple Raspberry Pi's as streamers, and I can EQ as needed in Roon.

Most Raspberry Pi software will also let you use Airplay too.

 

[Clive of Sweden]

This speaker has been reviewed by cheap audio man and he didn't like it and I'm not surprised. I like this site but I would never buy or not buy a product purely on how it measures. I have a dragonfly red and a khadas tone board and I think that the tone board is lifeless even though it measures better than the dragonfly red. I personally don't use Amazon due to their work ethics so I wouldn't buy this anyway.

 

[Steve Dallas]

The vast majority of buyers should be able to grasp the rather basic principle that a speaker recommendation with equalization means that speaker is not recommended without equalization.

The sarcasm is not warranted.

The issue is that nearly all prior speaker reviews do not accommodate for EQ. If you read an older review, such as for the aforementioned LS50, the conclusion is simply "not recommended". The chain of consistency is now broken.

What goes in the "Recommended" column in the Review Index for this and the Tune Tot? An asterisk in a binary field?

 

[Fafnar]

LS50 were one of the first to be reviewed. Perhaps things were judged more harshly back then but clearly we're all learning as we go. Even the LS50 Meta review some 8 months later didn't have an EQ applied but they were recommended.

I suppose one could go back almost 2 years now and re-review, but I would prefer more and different reviews like the last two instead of re-hashing old reviews. The discerning buyer, hopefully most that visit ASR, can see all the data and judge what fits their needs and budget. This isn't a 'top X speakers (sponsors) of 2021' kind of website.

 

[Slayer]

Hmmm, wait for the $50 sale again.
200 pairs of these or one pair of the Wilson TuneTot.
Now that would be a fun demo to see. 200 pairs of these going against a single pair of the wilsons.

 

[testp]

so... is this speaker reebok or nike???

Merry Christmas!

 

[Dj7675]

LS50 were one of the first to be reviewed. Perhaps things were judged more harshly back then but clearly we're all learning as we go. Even the LS50 Meta review some 8 months later didn't have an EQ applied but they were recommended.

I suppose one could go back almost 2 years now and re-review, but I would prefer more and different reviews like the last two instead of re-hashing old reviews. The discerning buyer, hopefully most that visit ASR, can see all the data and judge what fits their needs and budget. This isn't a 'top X speakers (sponsors) of 2021' kind of website.

Or, you view it as an evolving process where the reviewer is exploring and learning things as well. Some may view listening tests with EQ with little value and that is OK I suppose. But you need EQ to properly EQ the bass regions anyway, so it isn’t unreasonable to assume those interested in Hifi will have EQ tools at their disposal. I find the listening tests with EQ as a last attempt to see to what extent a speaker can still sound good with EQ. Some speaks do many things right (play loud, low distortion, wide directivity etc) and if some EQ makes a speaker that is worth while, then why not explore and make it part of the review? And just because all reviews don’t have listening tests with EQ, shouldn’t preclude Amir from doing them on newer reviews IMO. It could mean that some of the earlier reviews could have been different, but that’s just how it goes as things evolve and improve it seems to me.

 

[Pattern]

I am not sure I like this new kinder, gentler @amirm . Two objectively poor speakers in a row receive a recommendation with caveats. Yet better speakers (looking at you LS50) received no such accommodation. I know we are veering toward consistency with headphone reviews here, but I am not convinced that is a good direction.

The vast majority of buyers of these (and the Tune Tots) will have no idea how to EQ a speaker, therefore they will be heard as they come out of the box. Both are terrible in that context, yet both are recommended. I am so disillusioned now...

I agree. I don't find the recommendations particularly useful given their variability, the detailed measurements should be the primary takeaway. Of course no ill will towards Amirm what so ever the man is doing good and important work for the benefit of the consumer. But listening impressions, no matter how trained the ear and how unaffiliated the listener, remain immutably subjective.

 

[eardiggler]

I use Roon (same as @amirm). Lets me use simple Raspberry Pi's as streamers, and I can EQ as needed in Roon.

Most Raspberry Pi software will also let you use Airplay too.

Thanks! I wish more streaming services offered EQ's built into the phone app's for simple quick adjustment. I like Roon a lot, with a streamer, as a main or 2nd system, but it's a bit expensive to implement in a garage system or in a place you occasional play music. The Radson ES100 portable DAC has an a REALLY nice customizable EQ built into the phone app that works with the DAC. I've used it for some of Amir's EQ suggestions. But, I dream about a brand like Toppings offering something like this at some point: DAC w/DSP or EQ built in with a phone app interface to do some basic EQ/room correction.

 

[Madjalapeno]

Thanks! I wish more streaming services offered EQ's built into the phone app's for simple quick tweaking. I like Roon a lot, with a streamer, as a main or 2nd system, but it's a bit expensive for the service just to implement in a garage system or in a place you occasional play music. The Radson E100 portable DAC has an a REALLY nice customizable EQ built into the phone app that works with the DAC which I use occasionally. But, I dream about a brand like Toppings offering something like this at some point: DAC w/DSP or EQ built in with a phone app interface to do some basic EQ/room correction tweaking.

Roon is expensive, but I've yet to find anything that comes close. I think the secret is to use it a lot

I have it in our den, our movie room, the home office, my woodshop, the bathroom, the garage, my headphones and can even connect via VPN from my work office. Having all my playlists in one place, and Roon Radio is worth the money for me.

Having displays to control it makes it even better.

 

[More Dynamics Please]

The sarcasm is not warranted.

The issue is that nearly all prior speaker reviews do not accommodate for EQ. If you read an older review, such as for the aforementioned LS50, the conclusion is simply "not recommended". The chain of consistency is now broken.

What goes in the "Recommended" column in the Review Index for this and the Tune Tot? An asterisk in a binary field?

No sarcasm directed at you or anyone else. Just an honest observation after reading multiple posts in this and other threads. The LS50 review you cite is two years old. Much has changed since then including the fact that all recent ASR speaker reviews now include whether or not the speaker requires EQ to earn a recommendation. It's one of many changes in the speaker review format that broke the chain of consistency from earlier reviews for the purpose of continuous improvement which I believe most ASR forum members support.

 

[Dj7675]

I agree. I don't find the recommendations particularly useful given their variability, the detailed measurements should be the primary takeaway. Of course no ill will towards Amirm what so ever the man is doing good and important work for the benefit of the consumer. But listening impressions, no matter how trained the ear and how unaffiliated the listener, remain immutably subjective.

I guess I find the Klippel measurements not the end of the story. Like headphones, if a speaker exhibits very good directivity, low distortion, excellent SPL/Power handling using EQ to fall in line with flat on axis an/or even PIR it becomes a good speaker. As such, recommending it with DSP is very much worth while and appreciated to know.
I think Amir has been pretty clear when he recommends a headphone or a speaker in stock form, or with DSP. And yes, Amir is human of course, but is a trained listener and has posted quite a lot of blind tests showing very good listening skills. In this regard he has provided much more evidence that other reviewers that show no credentials and/or tests of why we should have any faith in their conclusions. I guess what I’m getting at is all subjective tests aren’t equal and some more reliable than others.
One can dismiss the subjective listening tests and/or EQ but I think that is one of the more interesting and useful portions of the review IMO.

 

[JW001]

Just out of curiosity, what are you guys using to EQ small speakers like this where you don't want to dedicate a computer? I'm thinking about getting these for my garage.

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[Pattern]

I guess I find the Klippel measurements not the end of the story. Like headphones, if a speaker exhibits very good directivity, low distortion, excellent SPL/Power handling using EQ to fall in line with flat on axis an/or even PIR it becomes a good speaker. As such, recommending it with DSP is very much worth while and appreciated to know.
I think Amir has been pretty clear when he recommends a headphone or a speaker in stock form, or with DSP. And yes, Amir is human of course, but is a trained listener and has posted quite a lot of blind tests showing very good listening skills. In this regard he has provided much more evidence that other reviewers that show no credentials and/or tests of why we should have any faith in their conclusions. I guess what I’m getting at is all subjective tests aren’t equal and some more reliable than others.
One can dismiss the subjective listening tests and/or EQ but I think that is one of the more interesting and useful portions of the review IMO.

You won't find any argument against EQ from me. Dirac and a mic was the best money I've spent on this hobby. The issue with "this speaker was recommended and this speaker was not" is that these reviews have been an actively evolving process as they have gone on. Part of that evolution has been the inclusion of EQ and thus a direct comparison between the subjective impressions of a speaker which was EQed and another which was not is a flawed comparison. Simultaneously, taste and biology dictate more of our impressions than we might like as an objective leaning community and for these reasons the recommendation or non recommendation of any given speaker feels to me like a rather unimportant feature of any given review. With the exception of course of the non recommendation of a piece of hardware due to clear design and engineering flaws. One thing I would very much like to see is the inclusion of some kind of standardized assessment of "EQ-ability" or "dirac-ability" meaning how well a speaker will take to correction. It's oft discussed but it feels like more of an important factor than we currently treat it to me. That could be my infatuation with my DDRC-24 speaking though.

Of course all said in good spirit.

 

[amirm]

The vast majority of buyers of these (and the Tune Tots) will have no idea how to EQ a speaker, therefore they will be heard as they come out of the box.

If someone is not using EQ, then they can clearly see if that setup is recommended or not. I don't see how someone can run with "recommended with EQ" and assume the same is true of not equalizing especially when flaws of the speaker response are clearly documented.

As I have repeatedly explained, equalization is my tool to evaluate the data we get out of measurements. To the extent a flaw is removed with EQ, I see no reason to not recommend the speaker based on that flaw existing.

Also, if someone is not using EQ in their room, then they are at odds with everything I am about anyway. No system without EQ has correct bass response so one way or the other, you need to have EQ. If you don't, then you are playing your own fiddle so not something I am concerned about.

 

[amirm]

This speaker has been reviewed by cheap audio man and he didn't like it and I'm not surprised.

Cheap audio man is witty and charming. I would watch his videos for purely entertainment value. I see no validity to any audio assessment he puts forward. There simply is no foundation to support any of it. So my reaction to him liking or not liking this speaker is, "so what?"