TOPPING D90 III Sabre DAC Review

[CleanSound]

Amir's measurements have done a great favor for consumers and for the manufacturers who make well engineered DACs. This site provides invaluable education. It has literally changed the industry for the better.

However, having consumers and manufactures who now chase SINAD is also largely due to this website. IMO, the SINAD rankings should be retired and the measurements should now simply say that the SINAD passes (ie is transparent) or fails. A lot of consumers seem to either not understand or not fully believe that these DACs are transparent. As a result, we see more products like the this one, which chases SINAD* rather than providing meaningful upgrades.

* See Topping's product page. They tout the SNR/SINAD/THD+N many times. They also make claims about the DAC chip. Almost no one should care about the chip, but they do because they don't fully believe that these DACs are transparent.

Or have Amir come up with some sort of average index score based on SINAD of different power, impedance and frequency for transparency. Then a reliability score based on a short period of usage.

 

[Toni Mas]

It is about time that Topping and other manufacturers include PEQ, Crossfeed and other useful options in their Dac's, only superb sinad measurements doesn't impress me enough today to open my wallet today.

Yes this is industry will not survive insisting in the minimalist bit perfect obsession of the last century... It needs inspiring new FEATURES!

 

[Toni Mas]

Then a reliability score based on a short period of usage.

In the past brand building was largely based on reliability. Failures were simply not accepted. Sadly, these days returns and refunds have become an easy way of closing angry mouths, and rmas have practically no longer any impact on brand reputations. Even funny to see that sinad pickyness has become more rewarding...

 

[mags65]

Then a reliability score based on a short period of usage.

How on earth do you expect amirm to create any sort of reliability score on equipment with lifetime expectancy measured in several years? Any failures/issues within the short period during which he reviews (mostly member sourced) equipment do not in any way provide anything but anecdotal information on technical «soundness» of the item under review.

 

[anphex]

MANUFACTURERS, STOP. I'VE SEEN THIS DAC 50 TIMES NOW.

I've seen it when it was called SMSL, GUSTARD, AIYAMA, SABAJ, TOPPING...
When it was called EX30, SU-9, X16, BANANA43 and PINEAPPLEONPIZZA420...

IT'S TIME TO MAKE A NEW DAC NOW.

 

[CleanSound]

How on earth do you expect amirm to create any sort of reliability score on equipment with lifetime expectancy measured in several years? Any failures/issues within the short period during which he reviews (mostly member sourced) equipment do not in any way provide anything but anecdotal information on technical «soundness» of the item under review.

I 100% with you that it is difficult to do. And possibly impossible to do. It was just an idea on a goal, not the implementation.

 

[Ajax]

Thanks Ajax! I know this but It seems to be discontinued.

Amazon states there is one in stock

https://www.amazon.com/Topping-DM7-CH-USB-DAC/dp/B0B6BLF91P?th=1

Also another positive review by Kal Rubinson in stereophile.

Topping DM7 8-channel D/A processor

www.stereophile.com

It really does seem to tick all the boxes for a moderate price ($599).

 

[shuppatsu]

MANUFACTURERS, STOP. I'VE SEEN THIS DAC 50 TIMES NOW.

I've seen it when it was called SMSL, GUSTARD, AIYAMA, SABAJ, TOPPING...
When it was called EX30, SU-9, X16, BANANA43 and PINEAPPLEONPIZZA420...

To be fair the PINEAPPLEONPIZZA420 was legendary and in a class of its own IMO. Giving the customer the TOPPING we always wanted...at least for certain states of mind.

 

[Ajax]

Something like a minidsp Flex with one analogue input (ADC) would be great.

Btw, not another usb audio interface for home studios as we have already plenty of choice by Motu, Focusrite, etc...

My next purchase will be a minidsp flex 8 ($600), which incorporates DSP. The flex 8 is a similar price to the Topping DM7 but with all the features the contributors to this thread having been asking for.

miniDSP Flex Eight

miniDSP Flex Eight, 400MHz Sharc DSP audio processor, toolbox for subwoofer or multiway speaker tuning, Optional Dirac Live license for room correction, Bluetooth LDAC/APTX/AAC streaming.

www.minidsp.com

I'll be using it to feed a Buckey 4 channel Hypex amp (US$1,000) combining 2 x 252 (tweeters) and 2 x 502 (woofers) hypex modules so I can drive a pair of LINKWITZ LX MINI speakers together with a pair of active SVS SB 2000 subs.

Buckeye Amps

Buckeye Amps utilizes the most advanced audio amplifier technologies available. Authorized seller for Hypex and Purifi Class D amplifiers. Based in the US. Free shipping and worldwide service!

www.buckeyeamp.com

Very close to SOTA sound for about $3.5k for the whole system ... I've just got to stop renovating houses and focus on getting the LX Mini's built.

 

[kemmler3D]

I 100% with you that it is difficult to do. And possibly impossible to do. It was just an idea on a goal, not the implementation.

Orgs like Consumer Reports generate reliability scores for products, but I think they collect broad-based data over the course of years for this.

Collecting real reliability data is very difficult, since you need to know:

1. Total units sold
2. Total number of returns / repairs

Or good partial / proportional estimates of those numbers.

Neither of which are public information or easy to get from those that have it.

 

[dogmamann]

Not sure why someone would buy this DAC while the D70 pro Sabre offers exact same performance, bigger display, Aurora UI and a lower price tag...

not sure why someone would by the D70 Sabre when E30 offers the same audible level of performance.

 

[CleanSound]

so I can drive a pair of LINKWITZ LX MINI speakers together with a pair of active SVS SB 2000 subs.

Erin reviewed the LX mini, he said it was bad.

 

[Deleted member 21114]

Erin reviewed the LX mini, he said it was bad.

Really?

"Overall, really fun speaker. Not perfect tonality but what it does in the soundstage is enough to keep me pushing ahead with further EQ options which this speaker will take well to given its good directivity index. If you are interested I definitely recommend giving it a shot."

Linkwitz LXmini Speaker Review

Linkwitz LXmini Review

www.erinsaudiocorner.com

 

[Sokel]

"No resale value" is absolutely not correct, I regularly see used Topping, SMSL and similar brands sell quickly for about 60%-70% of the - admitably somewhat inflated - brand new prices.
Check HiFi Shark sales stats.
Just buy these used and have them for "free" as you will be able to flip them for no to minimum loss after the initial price drop.

The last year's or two,maybe.
Older than them with unreadable displays due to burn-in,faded "gold" contacts,out of firmware updates (as is the case with older ones),etc,not so much.

Asked prices are WAY different than the final ones,if it succeeds.

 

[Rhamnetin]

not sure why someone would by the D70 Sabre when E30 offers the same audible level of performance.

The most sound reasons I can think of are connectivity options in case more are needed, e.g. balanced outputs going directly to active speakers or maybe you need AES input (which I do). Though there are of course less costly DACs with identical audible performance (nearly identical measured performance even) for less money from both Topping and SMSL.

 

[shuppatsu]

The last year's or two,maybe.
Older than them with unreadable displays due to burn-in,faded "gold" contacts,out of firmware updates (as is the case with older ones),etc,not so much.

Asked prices are WAY different than the final ones,if it succeeds.

Granted it's super-basic but my D10S looks like it could have been taken out of the box yesterday. Is there a particular model you are referring to? Got any links with pics?

 

[Sokel]

Granted it's super-basic but my D10S looks like it could have been taken out of the box yesterday. Is there a particular model you are referring to? Got any links with pics?

SOLD: Topping D50 DAC $100

Topping D50 DAC. Comes in original box with USB data cable, USB power cable and at my asking price I'll include a Jameco 120V 60Hz power supply. Works perfectly but the OLED suffers from burn-in (see photo). Rated 6/10 for age and burn-in. $100 with free insured shipping the contiguous US...

www.audiosciencereview.com

SHD Studio Screen Burn Issues?

Hi - I've seen a couple of other threads about screen burn on the miniDSP SHD Studio. I just went to have a look at mine and the screen is a mess (see attached)...

www.minidsp.com

You can find more if you search,just a couple I found in half a minute.

 

[DLS79]

not sure why someone would by the D70 Sabre when E30 offers the same audible level of performance.

different inputs and outputs.

https://nwzimg.wezhan.net/contents/sitefiles3604/18020413/images/6236593.jpg

https://nwzimg.wezhan.net/contents/sitefiles3604/18020413/images/7686180.jpg

Edit: power brick vs internal psu can also be important to some people.

 

[Rhamnetin]

SOLD: Topping D50 DAC $100

Topping D50 DAC. Comes in original box with USB data cable, USB power cable and at my asking price I'll include a Jameco 120V 60Hz power supply. Works perfectly but the OLED suffers from burn-in (see photo). Rated 6/10 for age and burn-in. $100 with free insured shipping the contiguous US...

www.audiosciencereview.com

SHD Studio Screen Burn Issues?

Hi - I've seen a couple of other threads about screen burn on the miniDSP SHD Studio. I just went to have a look at mine and the screen is a mess (see attached)...

www.minidsp.com

You can find more if you search,just a couple I found in half a minute.

This must be why SMSL sometimes chooses an LCD screen instead of cheap OLEDs susceptible to burn-in. Their D90 III competitor went that route.

 

[Sokel]

This must be why SMSL sometimes chooses an LCD screen instead of cheap OLEDs susceptible to burn-in. Their D90 III competitor went that route.

Does not apply only in the very cheap ones thought,(older?) Okto for example had the same issue after a year or so.
There's a reason the old seasoned ones don't choose these crappy displays.