Topping D90 Balanced USB DAC Review

[hmscott]

Thank you all for recommending these cables to me, I bought them in the end...
HOWEVER - future buyers be warned, these connectors (both RCA and XLR) are rather large . If you struggle with desk space, I would recommend something else. Maybe used Audioquest cables - that way we do not feed the beast any further . You will need at least 12 cm from the "wall" for the DAC. Also, if you have speakers like mine Dynaudio XEO 2, it will be a very tight fit.

View attachment 80890

On a separate note, I really struggle to notice difference between this DAC, one on my Asus ROG Maximus IX Formula motherboard, or the one integrated into this speakers . I expected much, much more.

The WBC cables come built with different wire and ends, the ends you bought are very nice but as you found they are big. These are the cables I use on the A90 / D90 MQA - inside the "Spoiler" brackets you can find the links to the cables I use, the ends are a bit smaller but aren't the locking type:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...d90-balanced-usb-dac-review.10519/post-475832

An earlier post I made when I was researching what cables to get:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...d90-balanced-usb-dac-review.10519/post-448019

One of the things people overlook when doing comparisons of equipment is whether their headphones or speakers are good enough to resolve any differences. I've discovered over time as I search for better resolving IEM's and headphones I can hear differences between my equipment much easier now than when I started long ago.

Also, the longer you spend getting to know the characteristics of your own personal listening equipment and getting to know your own resolving capabilities on many sources and recorded material, you'll have a larger data set between your ears to help identify differences quicker and more reliably.

An hour or two, days, or even weeks sometimes aren't enough if you don't have the trained ear experienced through years of gathering listening data. Give yourself the time to relax and discover.

Don't give up so easily. Or, save yourself a lot of time and expense and be happy with what you have, both work fine in the end, as long as you remember to have fun while doing it.

 

[THAndy]

I really struggle to notice difference between this DAC, one on my Asus ROG Maximus IX Formula motherboard, or the one integrated into this speakers . I expected much, much more.

The differences between competent modern DACs are very minor. There are differences, but any claims of massive sonic benefits of one over the other are hype. My Topping D90 MQA is only slightly different from my 8-year-old ODAC. Even the DAC/headphone amp in my 18-year-old Jolida JD100 CD player doesn't sound obviously worse than my current stack. To read the reviews you'd expect something revolutionary, but what you get is a very small incremental improvement, and that's over many years of tech. To be honest, I think I overspent by getting the D90 when putting together this current setup - I could have bought a competent DAC for a lot less - but I'm keeping it because it sounds good and it has a whole lot of useful inputs and outputs.

 

[Scintilla]

That is a perspective. It isn't the only one, however. So many variables: how resolving is your system? (like really, not just in your opinion), what are you listening to? do you actually know how to listen? (because a lot of people that think they do, actually don't).

I heard almost immediate improvements in my system with a swap of the D90 and NAD M51. Not subtle either for me. But I am also a trained listener, a musician and I have unusually sensitive hearing. Your experience with DACs is dictated by a lot of things, but none of them are absolute.

 

[THAndy]

That is a perspective. It isn't the only one, however. So many variables: how resolving is your system? (like really, not just in your opinion), what are you listening to? do you actually know how to listen? (because a lot of people that think they do, actually don't).

I heard almost immediate improvements in my system with a swap of the D90 and NAD M51. Not subtle either for me. But I am also a trained listener, a musician and I have unusually sensitive hearing. Your experience with DACs is dictated by a lot of things, but none of them are absolute.

For me it's more of a subconscious thing. I am enjoying the music better with the D90 and overall there's more of a sense of space and separation, which I attribute to the DAC. I do enjoy this and I'm not claiming there are no differences, but just trying to set the expectation appropriately. And yes, to be fair I haven't done a rigorous test of this system against others on the highest quality music files. (The other components, for what it's worth, are a Lake People RS-02 amp and ZMF Vérité Closed headphones.) I should spend more time with really high quality source files, and even try other amps, before I pronounce on this DAC's capabilities (most of my daily listening is Spotify Premium, which is still lossy).

 

[hmscott]

For me it's more of a subconscious thing. I am enjoying the music better with the D90 and overall there's more of a sense of space and separation, which I attribute to the DAC. I do enjoy this and I'm not claiming there are no differences, but just trying to set the expectation appropriately. And yes, to be fair I haven't done a rigorous test of this system against others on the highest quality music files. (The other components, for what it's worth, are a Lake People RS-02 amp and ZMF Vérité Closed headphones.) I should spend more time with really high quality source files, and even try other amps, before I pronounce on this DAC's capabilities (most of my daily listening is Spotify Premium, which is still lossy).

That's actually the first sign of noticing the differences, your emotional state while listening is improved, your nerves settle and aren't on edge - as opposed to being too irritating to listen to for long periods. Then will come noticing sounds previously unheard - missing sounds - sound placement, stage width and depth, and eventually your mind unwinds all of the complex things it is being inundated with when listening to and through a great source and system - it takes our minds time to work through all of the initially overwhelming information.

You might also try subscribing to Tidal Hi-Fi and listen to the Master recordings (up to 192khz) with your D90 MQA. You can subscribe through BestBuy annually for only $99 (discounted right now from BB $119), a nice savings from the $19.99/mo = $239.88 per year, and an excellent opportunity to stretch the legs of the D90 MQA with a streaming service instead of purchasing expensive recordings, MQA or otherwise.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/the-deals-discussion-thread-read-the-first-post.692119/post-15775213
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/bestbuy-and-tidal-deal.938905/page-2#post-15785806

And, you can subscribe through BestBuy from outside of the US:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/bestbuy-and-tidal-deal.938905/page-2#post-15787189

In Windows set as shown to Exclusive Mode and in Tidal Settings as shown - here for FiiO M15, same for D90 MQA:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...d90-balanced-usb-dac-review.10519/post-420673
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...d90-balanced-usb-dac-review.10519/post-432411

Another source to enjoy listening for differences to stretch your listening skills and for headphone / IEM differentiation.

 

[ClicketEKlack]

Curious if anyone has had a chance to compare the D90 to any multi-thousand-dollar DAC's, like those from Chord or Denafrips.

 

[GeorgeWalk]

Curious if anyone has had a chance to compare the D90 to any multi-thousand-dollar DAC's, like those from Chord or Denafrips.

Do you mean like here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?pages/Audio_DAC_Performance_Index/

Just select the DACs you want to compare.

 

[ClicketEKlack]

Do you mean like here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?pages/Audio_DAC_Performance_Index/

Just select the DACs you want to compare.

Thanks, I had seen that -- I was curious more about firsthand listening impressions in the home. I ask because I'd watched a Steve Guttenberg video where he pooh-poohed the use of numbers as the sole basis to judge audiophile equipment. I'm not saying he's right; I'm a complete neophyte, so I have no hard opinions. I'm actually very happy with my D90; I'm just trying to learn as much as possible about the gear and how it stacks up.

 

[Ssnafu]

Hi all!

Recently I have acquired the D90 DAC and the SMSL DA-8S amp. After using for a few days, I have noticed that the D90 unit gets warm after a few hours of use. The DA-8S amp remains cool, but because I stacked it on top of the D90, it got warm too.

Should I not stack the amp on top of the D90? Or is it ok for me to continue to stack the amp on top?

Thank you!

 

[Doodski]

Hi all!

Recently I have acquired the D90 DAC and the SMSL DA-8S amp. After using for a few days, I have noticed that the D90 unit gets warm after a few hours of use. The DA-8S amp remains cool, but because I stacked it on top of the D90, it got warm too.

Should I not stack the amp on top of the D90? Or is it ok for me to continue to stack the amp on top?

Thank you!

Myself I would put the hotter component on the top.

 

[eduardw]

I've never noticed that my D90 gets hot. I use in dac mode.

 

[JohnYang1997]

It's normal that when you stack components, they both got warmer. And the one on the bottom should get more warmer. As long as you don't feel it being too hot too hold your hand onto it, it's usually fine.

 

[Ssnafu]

Hi, thanks for the replies!

Even after separating the two for more than 2 hours, the D90 still feels warm(although not as warm as when stacked), while the amp remains cool.

Not sure if it affects anything, for the D90, I am primarily using usb input and the Bluetooth is turned on(even when not in use).

 

[hmscott]

Hi all!

Recently I have acquired the D90 DAC and the SMSL DA-8S amp. After using for a few days, I have noticed that the D90 unit gets warm after a few hours of use. The DA-8S amp remains cool, but because I stacked it on top of the D90, it got warm too.

Should I not stack the amp on top of the D90? Or is it ok for me to continue to stack the amp on top?

Thank you!

It's normal that when you stack components, they both got warmer. And the one on the bottom should get more warmer. As long as you don't feel it being too hot too hold your hand onto it, it's usually fine.

Hi, thanks for the replies!

Even after separating the two for more than 2 hours, the D90 still feels warm(although not as warm as when stacked), while the amp remains cool.

Not sure if it affects anything, for the D90, I am primarily using usb input and the Bluetooth is turned on(even when not in use).

That's why I try to not stack equipment on top of one another - especially without a large air gap between them, which still can trap or exchange heat due to convective currents.

Sitting side by side the A90 and D90 MQA both get noticeably warm, with the D90 MQA edging out the A90 as the warmest while running - they are warmer than warm, but not quite hot - which they might be if stacked one on top of the other.

Using an Infrared Thermometer (in object mode, not body mode) the A90 top case measures 91.1F and the D90 MQA case measures 92.1F after running for many hours.

If I had to stack them I'd put the D90 MQA on top of the A90, but stacking like that would still make both run hotter.

Sitting side by side I had to use 1 foot interconnects instead of the 0.5 foot I was planning to get. I may try stacking them so I can use 0.5 foot interconnects some day, but more likely I'll find a nice rack like the one Topping made for it's A30 / D30 DAC / AMP:
https://www.amazon.com/Topping-14x14x4-5cm-A30-D30-Transparency/dp/B01NCZQ0ZZ

I asked Topping and they said they have no plans to make an A90 / D90 sized desktop rack, and it looks like the A30 / D30 rack is gone from their web site.

BTW, it is recommended to turn off Bluetooth on the D90 if you aren't using it. Less power draw, less heat generated, and possibly less RF noise induced in the D90.

 

[Harmonie]

It's normal that when you stack components, they both got warmer. And the one on the bottom should get more warmer. As long as you don't feel it being too hot too hold your hand onto it, it's usually fine.

@JohnYang1997

I read so many posts in so many threads nowadays about the heat of the L30 and now the D90.
Is it such an issue even if gets warm ?
By "warm" it's rather in the 30~40°c level , far beyond 60°c .
What negative effect would it have ?
I have old amps and DAC that run "warmer" since several decades - but didn't notice any negative effect.

 

[JohnYang1997]

@JohnYang1997

I read so many posts in so many threads nowadays about the heat of the L30 and now the D90.
Is it such an issue even if gets warm ?
By "warm" it's rather in the 30~40°c level , far beyond 60°c .
What negative effect would it have ?
I have old amps and DAC that run "warmer" since several decades - but didn't notice any negative effect.

If it's too hot to touch then it's abnormal hence should be avoided. 40c is nothing to worry about.

 

[Ssnafu]

Thank for the replies again!

hmscott:
For now, I have decided not to stack them in case I inadvertently deal damage to both equipment over the long term.

The rack is indeed nice but too small for the both the D90 and the DA-8S. Maybe I could do create an air gap by using stacked rubber feet to prop the amp on top of the D90

Good tip! I have turned off the BT, since I have only occasional use for it because of my constant usage of the usb input.

JohnYang1997:
Thanks for advice, will keep that in mind

 

[Jerry Bruckheimer Fan]

My dream would be to connect this to 1,000 watt monoblocks from McIntosh, or Bryston, or another hi-fi amp and full range towers with a gigantic bass section. I would never be able to get this kind of SINAD with an AVR or even a pre-pro with XLRs.

 

[Yviena]

@JohnYang1997 interesting I just tried out some 48khz based DSD tracks from nativeDSD the DAC seems capable of actually playing it back correctly (many don't) if you workaround the firmware/software glitches by first starting a 44khz based DSD track, then switching to the 48khz based one, the display will still display a 44khz based DSD samplerate but the music will sound correct, without the usual slowdown of using a wrong clock.

 

[blu_in_green]

I'm interested in upgrading my Chord Mojo to one of either the D90 or Benchmark DAC3.

Benchmark was able to give me details confirming conformance to Canadian electrical safety standards (and exemptions for certain class 2 power supplies).

I was wondering if anyone here could confirm if the D90 has CSA/ULc/comparable 3rd party certified cables and hardware, or an exemption? I did reach out to Topping, but haven't heard back yet.

It is annoying to have to check on this stuff, but frustratingly many hifi companies don't work in compliance with regional laws.