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Speakers suggestion for 35m^2 living room

Sprint

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#21
I use a Genelec sub with my DBR62 passives run through a Hypex NC400. Signal path is DAC >> Genelec Sub >> NC400 >> DBR62 ... this obviously isn't quite what was intended, since these are passive speakers and off brand, but the REW measurements show it to be without compromise. I didn't have to resort to MiniDSP here, the sub crossover does a great job.
Which Genelec sub are you using? If I may ask, what is your room size and listening distance?
 
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Thread Starter #22
Let's say about 1.500-1.800€, but less is better!

if you buy an amp, you just need a decent one with enough power to drive the speakers at their lowest impedance
I guess I need a 6,5" woofer speaker, maybe 5,25 is too small.
For example, I'm looking at Elac DBR62 as per Syzygetic's solution; I saw that it has the following technical specification:
  • Nominal impedance : 6 Ohm
  • Maximum power input : 120 W.
Please, can you suggest to me an adequate/decent/good amplifier?
Maybe one from this list (I'm writing from Italy)? https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/power-amplifier-c-6306.html/s-29/input-xlr?orderby=price&orderway=asc
Or a Schiit Vidar or an Hattor?

I'm trying to have everything balanced from DAC to the speaker (through a passive preamplifier), but, honestly speaking, I don't know whether this worth, considering that I don't need too much long cables to reach the speakers (about 2,5m).

Thanks!
 
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Thread Starter #23
I use a Genelec sub with my DBR62 passives run through a Hypex NC400. Signal path is DAC >> Genelec Sub >> NC400 >> DBR62 ... this obviously isn't quite what was intended, since these are passive speakers and off brand, but the REW measurements show it to be without compromise. I didn't have to resort to MiniDSP here, the sub crossover does a great job.
May I also ask which amplifier are you using?

Thanks!
 

Sprint

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#26
Genelec 7060B. Room is 12x14ft, ceilings are 12ft, and I’m listening at about 1m.
@syzygetic Thanks a lot! How do you run the cables? If I am correct, you must be take LR channels from DAC pre-out and feeding in Front LEFT IN and Front LEFT In into Genelecs. Do you split your RCA/XLR and also feed the LFE IN/SUM IN channel in Genelec? Then you must be taking the XLR Front left and Front right out to feed the Hypex correct?

Did you also have any non-genelec sub and if yes, how does the 7060 compare in performance with non-genelec. The reason I am asking is that I have Genelec 8340/8330 surround set up with 2 SVS subs. I am thinking if I should replace the SVS with a Genelec GLM or a non-GLM sub.

1610073516009.png
 
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#27
@syzygetic Thanks a lot! How do you run the cables? If I am correct, you must be take LR channels from DAC pre-out and feeding in Front LEFT IN and Front LEFT In into Genelecs. Do you split your RCA/XLR and also feed the LFE IN/SUM IN channel in Genelec? Then you must be taking the XLR Front left and Front right out to feed the Hypex correct?

Did you also have any non-genelec sub and if yes, how does the 7060 compare in performance with non-genelec. The reason I am asking is that I have Genelec 8340/8330 surround set up with 2 SVS subs. I am thinking if I should replace the SVS with a Genelec GLM or a non-GLM sub.

View attachment 104434
Left channel into left, right into right, then left to left monitor (amp, for me) and right to right monitor (amp, for me). the sum LFE is a different thing, not recommended. It’s really for adding subs to the chain, if I remember correctly. You’re meant to use the actual left/right connections.

Performance wise, it’s phenomenal. I’m certain the SVS has more power, this doesn’t look like much on a spec sheet, but it sounds the real deal. Extension to like 19Hz, which is more than enough, and I’m using it in a 12x14 room which is my office, so it doesn’t have any issues with excessive space.

The cabinet is extremely rigid, there is no port noise. I did have to DSP the nasty desk resonance out, but that was easy in Roon (convolution filter). If you can pick one of these up for a song, as I did, I would recommend it. If not, I was very close to getting the SB-2000, which looks good too, and is probably more powerful, but doesn’t have the XLR, and all my stuff is balanced.
 
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#28
@syzygetic Did you also have any non-genelec sub and if yes, how does the 7060 compare in performance with non-genelec. The reason I am asking is that I have Genelec 8340/8330 surround set up with 2 SVS subs. I am thinking if I should replace the SVS with a Genelec GLM or a non-GLM sub.
Missed the second part, sorry. I wouldn’t consider this sub an alternative to a home theater sub in a large room. It’s definitely purpose built for a studio or office system, but it’s very good at that.

The inbuilt crossover is handy, the dip switches make it pretty flexible, and you can EQ the rest of the way in software. I personally wouldn’t overthink this. It’s a competent sub, and you don’t need GLM.

Not saying GLM doesn’t work, just that there are free/cheap software equivalents which make it unnecessary to pay for fancy hardware. Genelec is, from my experience, best described as “honest”. They don’t wow with specs or marketing or even design, they just make very solid performing gear at a high but not-problematic price point.

One day, when the electronics fry or the cone dies or whatever, I look forward to doing some calculations and building this awesome solid cabinet with a cool spiral port into a diy monster sub.
 

richard12511

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#29
@syzygetic Thanks a lot! How do you run the cables? If I am correct, you must be take LR channels from DAC pre-out and feeding in Front LEFT IN and Front LEFT In into Genelecs. Do you split your RCA/XLR and also feed the LFE IN/SUM IN channel in Genelec? Then you must be taking the XLR Front left and Front right out to feed the Hypex correct?

Did you also have any non-genelec sub and if yes, how does the 7060 compare in performance with non-genelec. The reason I am asking is that I have Genelec 8340/8330 surround set up with 2 SVS subs. I am thinking if I should replace the SVS with a Genelec GLM or a non-GLM sub.

View attachment 104434
I would only sell your SVS subs for the purposes of going with GLM, if you need the extra/better(balanced) connectivity, or functionality, or you need the smaller form factor . In terms of sound quality
/performance, I think SVS beats Genelec pretty comfortably. At least in terms of objective
price/performance. Also we have more measurement data available for SVS, which I’m a fan of.

Where I think Genelec has SVS beat is in connectivity, functionality, and size/performance. What do you care about more? For example, I have a tiny office, and in that space, the smaller form factor of the Genelecs is more important to me. Plus the 7370s easily drive that room to levels that are louder than I’ll ever listen. In my main room though, I’m just going for the best sound possible, size be damned(perk of living alone:D), so the JTR subs work better in there.
 

noobie1

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#30
May I also ask which amplifier are you using?

Thanks!
I mentioned this on another thread but check out Cambridge Audio amps. If you don't mind used gear, you can pick up heavily discounted refurbished gear from the manufacturer. I believe there are good measurements online for the 651 amps. Plenty of power and modestly priced.
 

Sprint

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#31
Left channel into left, right into right, then left to left monitor (amp, for me) and right to right monitor (amp, for me). the sum LFE is a different thing, not recommended. It’s really for adding subs to the chain, if I remember correctly. You’re meant to use the actual left/right connections.

Performance wise, it’s phenomenal. I’m certain the SVS has more power, this doesn’t look like much on a spec sheet, but it sounds the real deal. Extension to like 19Hz, which is more than enough, and I’m using it in a 12x14 room which is my office, so it doesn’t have any issues with excessive space.

The cabinet is extremely rigid, there is no port noise. I did have to DSP the nasty desk resonance out, but that was easy in Roon (convolution filter). If you can pick one of these up for a song, as I did, I would recommend it. If not, I was very close to getting the SB-2000, which looks good too, and is probably more powerful, but doesn’t have the XLR, and all my stuff is balanced.
Thanks again! If I guess correct you must be setting the crossover to subs and main using the dip switches at 85hz, correct? Do you also use LFE + 10?

My SVS SB-12nsd also does not have XLR inputs. My wife wants a white subs to match the Genelecs white. In the future, I may go for Arendal white subs as I am in EU.

In addition, how are your Elac speakers? Are you happy with the sq? Will they also be good at 3.5 meters. I am looking for a second set of not expensive speakers but for only 2 channel music listening.
 
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#32
Thanks again! If I guess correct you must be setting the crossover to subs and main using the dip switches at 85hz, correct? Do you also use LFE + 10?

My SVS SB-12nsd also does not have XLR inputs. My wife wants a white subs to match the Genelecs white. In the future, I may go for Arendal white subs as I am in EU.

In addition, how are your Elac speakers? Are you happy with the sq? Will they also be good at 3.5 meters. I am looking for a second set of not expensive speakers but for only 2 channel music listening.
I do cross over to the ELACs at 85hz, and I don’t use the LFE +10 in operation, though I did toggle that one to calibrate the phase when I first set it up. There’s a good guide on this in the Genelec “previous models” section of their website. The reason I haven’t messed much with the level controls on the dip switches is simply because I’m doing bass management and room correction in software. The dip switches get things close enough for me to take it from there in convolution, and I’m only attenuating, in my case, since my biggest issue with the response curve in-room is a desk (an old dining room table) which causes a massive bass bump at a couple frequencies, notable around 50hz.

I would expect the SVS s12 to be more suited to a larger space than this Genelec 8060B, but only because of the wattage, which probably does limit the 8060B eventually. in a room 12x14ft, with 12ft ceilings, the 8060B is more than capable of playing pipe organ at painful levels, and it doesn’t distort audibly in the slightest!

The DBR62 speakers have been great, I am very happy with the SQ. I bought them for my desk, because I’m spending way more time in my office at home now than I used to, and I wanted good music. My main system in the living room is a trifield of Meridian DSP5200.2 speakers without subs, so that’s what I have to compare these ELACs to readily. Yes, the 5200.2 system sounds better, but it is clearly a diminishing return. I love the ELAC speakers, and I cannot imagine they are bested by anything in their price range. They’ll definitely perform at greater distance just fine. They do audibly benefit from powerful amplification, however. I ran them on a low power NAIM amp for a bit, and the nCore was quite a transformation when I hooked it up (this would be more true for you at a greater distance).

Also I should share that I believe the ELAC should have a subwoofer, any subwoofer. What I noticed most about getting the 8060B into the system with them wasn’t the bass boost, the ELAC have decent bass for music. It was the improvement in midrange clarity on the ELACs. Rumor has it this is intermodulation distortion going down because the sub is taking the LFE load. I don’t know, maybe it’s psychoacoustic, but it’s profound. Get a subwoofer of some kind with these!
 

Willem

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#33
I am not sure if you are in the US or Europe, so I will answer as if you are in Europe. At this kind of budget, and with passive speakers (I don't know enough about actives) I would suggest Elac DBR62 speakers and a 2x85 watt Yamaha AS501 amplifier (it has an inbuilt DAC). At current prices this will cost you 860 euro, leaving you a fair budget for either an amplifier upgrade to the 2x100 watt AS701, or, perhaps preferably, one or two small subwoofers at 380 euros each. I am currently experimenting with a Yamaha 501, (very inefficient) Harbeth P3ESR speakers, and a Kef Kube 8b in a far larger (75 sqm) room, and this works very well although the system does not quite fill that room. The amplifier seems powerful enough, although more power is always better.
 

LTig

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#34
Also I should share that I believe the ELAC should have a subwoofer, any subwoofer. What I noticed most about getting the 8060B into the system with them wasn’t the bass boost, the ELAC have decent bass for music. It was the improvement in midrange clarity on the ELACs. Rumor has it this is intermodulation distortion going down because the sub is taking the LFE load. I don’t know, maybe it’s psychoacoustic, but it’s profound. Get a subwoofer of some kind with these!
It's not a rumour. I had exactly the same experience when I added the 7060B to my K&H O300D despite them being 3-ways.
 
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Thread Starter #35
Dear all,
first of all, I would like to thank everyone that gave me precious suggestions to understand which is the best hi-fi system for me!
For many reasons (covid, unavailability of all the various components at the same shop, and so on) I could not hear and compare the various alternatives.
However, thanks to your advice, I finally arrived to a couple of possibility for my hi-fi system!!
So the two alternatives are the followings:
  • NUC > Topping D90 > Focal Alpha 65
  • NUC > Topping D90 > Power amp based on Hypex NC252 > Elac Debut rev 2 6.2
  • I would like to test this system in my living room for some weeks, then, I would probably buy a subwoofer as you recommended to me

Here the speakers prices:
  • Focal Alpha 65 : about €520 for two speakers
  • Power amp based on Hypex NC252 + Elac Debut rev 2 6.2 : about €800 (€500 for the amp + €300 for the speakers)
Which of these two possibilities do you suggest to me?
There will be an audible difference between them?

p.s.: I choose the Topping D90 instead of the SMSL SU-9 to use it also as pre-amplifier. Alternatively, I can take SMSL SU-9+Palmer Monicon L.

Thanks again!
 
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