Sony DVP-NS905V DVD Player - CD player measurements

[audio_tony]

Measurements of my Sony DVD player. I have always liked the cosmetics of this player - it has a nice display and always did a fine job of playing DVDs.
It plays DVDs better than my BluRay player actually.

I feel that it performs quite well for a DVD player, although it does also have SACD playback capability (not tested as I have no means to do so).

My test setup: Asus Xonar STX sound card with a self built buffer / gain box in front of that. Host PC is an Intel i7 running Windows 10 with 32G RAM and SSD - no mechanical disks or CDROM drive present.
I also use an Altor Audio Olivine-2 ADC which was used these measurements.
Sound card input was set to 24bit/96kHz
REW was configured as per the recommendations in the post from @NTTY

Stock image: (mine is finished in black although I think it looks better in silver).

 

[Kr2d2]

Hi audio_tony, thanks for all the measurements of all the various players!

Unfortunatelly I am not able to interpret the measurements, what is the conclusion?
Is it a decent player for CD playback? Is it a sufficient CD-transport?

Thanks for any feedback/advice from anyone!

 

[Mart68]

Hi audio_tony, thanks for all the measurements of all the various players!

Unfortunatelly I am not able to interpret the measurements, what is the conclusion?
Is it a decent player for CD playback? Is it a suffiecient CD-transport?

Thanks for any feedback/advice from anyone!

Yes to both.

 

[NTTY]

Hi audio_tony, thanks for all the measurements of all the various players!

Unfortunatelly I am not able to interpret the measurements, what is the conclusion?
Is it a decent player for CD playback? Is it a sufficient CD-transport?

Thanks for any feedback/advice from anyone!

As a transport

It's not been tested here, so we don't know if it outputs an unmodified digital signal. DVD Players which were HDCP compatible had the obligation to output CD Audio quality only on non-HDCP protected outputs. For that, all digital signals were processed by a sample rate converter, even when coming from CD audio, and that was presumably for the sake of simplicity. And so, even it that is unity "gain" (44.1kHz -> 44.kHz), it's likely to modify the digital data stream, and could suffer from inter-samples over distortion as a consequence, for example.

Not sure this one is HDCP though, if it has an HDMI out, it should be the case.


As a CD Player

It seems to be decent. Distortion remains always low. I see mains (50Hz) leakage, but not all the time, so I suspect an interaction with the input interface for some of the measurements made here.

The noise floor is a bit elevated, but if the test files had dither into them, it could partially explain. I think we lose roughly 4dB of CD Audio resolution because of the low level random noise.

The jitter is absent, which is good, but the test signal disappears into noise floor beyond 15kHz, I guess because there's more low level random noise than usual.

There seems to be a significant roll-off of the bandwidth at 20kHz (-5dB?), but the trace would need to be taken from more averages (like 300+) and smoothed (REW option: smoothing 1/48) to know better. The multitone shows the 20kHz frequency at -5dB relative to others, so it seems to be it.

Multitone is good (only that glitch at 50Hz which does not seem to be caused by the player) and clears CD Audio content (provided the spikes we see are related to the measurement interface).

Crosstalk is high for a digital device (-73dB at 10kHz) but not an issue.

Overall this is decent to listen to CD Audio, but many CD players will do better. Will you hear a difference with music? That's another debate

 

[audio_tony]

As a transport

<snip>

Not sure this one is HDCP though, if it has an HDMI out, it should be the case.


As a CD Player

It seems to be decent. Distortion remains always low. I see mains (50Hz) leakage, but not all the time, so I suspect an interaction with the input interface for some of the measurements made here.

The noise floor is a bit elevated, but if the test files had dither into them, it could partially explain. I think we lose roughly 4dB of CD Audio resolution because of the low level random noise.

The jitter is absent, which is good, but the test signal disappears into noise floor beyond 15kHz, I guess because there's more low level random noise than usual.

There seems to be a significant roll-off of the bandwidth at 20kHz (-5dB?), but the trace would need to be taken from more averages (like 300+) and smoothed (REW option: smoothing 1/48) to know better. The multitone shows the 20kHz frequency at -5dB relative to others, so it seems to be it.

Multitone is good (only that glitch at 50Hz which does not seem to be caused by the player) and clears CD Audio content (provided the spikes we see are related to the measurement interface).

Crosstalk is high for a digital device (-73dB at 10kHz) but not an issue.

Overall this is decent to listen to CD Audio, but many CD players will do better. Will you hear a difference with music? That's another debate

This doesn't have HDMI, it's scart only. I can test the digital output into a DAC if there's any interest.

I'm fairly certain that the 50Hz spike is from the player - I noticed during testing that I was also getting a slight tingle off the front panel.

I'll test my loopback to see if the 50Hz spike remains - I didn't have this issue previously, although my test rig has changed recently.

Here's an example from a measurement I took a couple of years ago - you'll note there's no mains spike.

 

[NTTY]

Ok, I suspect something weird because it’s not present on all measurements, especially the ones at -0.2dBFS and -1.1dBFS and also -30dBFS.

It could be something else interacting with the player or the interface during measurement.

 

[audio_tony]

Ok, I suspect something weird because it’s not present on all measurements, especially the ones at -0.2dBFS and -1.1dBFS and also -30dBFS.

It could be something else interacting with the player or the interface during measurement.

I've found an issue with my new measuring PC. I'm going to rebuild my original one.

It's been a frustrating afternoon!!!

 

[NTTY]

That happened to me too, and it is indeed frustrating!

 

[Kr2d2]

This doesn't have HDMI, it's scart only. I can test the digital output into a DAC if there's any interest.

I would be interested, because I would like to know its quality as a CD transport.

As a transport

It's not been tested here, so we don't know if it outputs an unmodified digital signal. DVD Players which were HDCP compatible had the obligation to output CD Audio quality only on non-HDCP protected outputs. For that, all digital signals were processed by a sample rate converter, even when coming from CD audio, and that was presumably for the sake of simplicity. And so, even it that is unity "gain" (44.1kHz -> 44.kHz), it's likely to modify the digital data stream, and could suffer from inter-samples over distortion as a consequence, for example.

Uhhh, seems to be complicated! Is it because it is a SACD player as well or is that a possible issue for all DVD players? I mean, I would like to understand if I can assume that a DVD player is bit-perfect as a CD transport ... sounds like it depends.

I am interested in this Sony as a relatively cheap to find SACD player, to be able to listen to my very few SACDs for the first time in a 'proper' way - just out of curiosity. If it is a perfect CD transport as well would be the cherry on top.

Secondly I am looking for a used DVD player of a decent mechanical and electrical quality that was produced a lot so that it can easily be found for very little money and that is bit-perfect as a CD transport. Or as an alternative a new, very cheap one ... the Sony DVP-SR760H was mentioned somewhere else here ..

Sorry if I am mixing up too much
& hope your measuring PCs are well again!
& thanks for the feedback!

 

[audio_tony]

I am interested in this Sony as a relatively cheap to find SACD player, to be able to listen to my very few SACDs for the first time in a 'proper' way - just out of curiosity. If it is a perfect CD transport as well would be the cherry on top.

One thing I can tell you for certain - it doesn't output the SACD stream via the coax output.

I've owned a few DVD players, and they've all worked absolutely fine as a CD transport (I've not measured the others - just going by my ears - so my own subjective opinion).

I especially liked the older Pioneer DVD players (DV-636D +others) although with some of these you need to be aware that the digital output is limited to 48k (not a problem if you will only listen to CDs).

 

[NTTY]

I would be interested, because I would like to know its quality as a CD transport.


Uhhh, seems to be complicated! Is it because it is a SACD player as well or is that a possible issue for all DVD players? I mean, I would like to understand if I can assume that a DVD player is bit-perfect as a CD transport ... sounds like it depends.

It's not SACD specific, it's about encryption of digital Audio (HDCP). That said SACD players generally do not output digital data when playing the SACD layer. It's kind of the same idea, not to be able to create a perfect digital copy. But there are(were) special links on high end players that allow(ed) it.

I am interested in this Sony as a relatively cheap to find SACD player, to be able to listen to my very few SACDs for the first time in a 'proper' way - just out of curiosity. If it is a perfect CD transport as well would be the cherry on top.

What you see here is a decent CD player. It will not get benefits from SACD. The low level noise and distorsion prevent better resolution than CD Audio. But the main difference with SACD records is in their mastering which was often performed with greater care, and that you will be able to hear, even if the player is CD Audio-Class only.

Secondly I am looking for a used DVD player of a decent mechanical and electrical quality that was produced a lot so that it can easily be found for very little money and that is bit-perfect as a CD transport. Or as an alternative a new, very cheap one ... the Sony DVP-SR760H was mentioned somewhere else here ..

By default, you need to assume a DVD player does not output a "bit perfect" signal, especially if it has an HDMI output. But that might be very difficult to hear when playing music.

Look at the two examples below. It's the digital output of two CD Players feeding the same DAC. One of the CD Player does not output bit-perfect signal, but which one is it?

 

[Joe Smith]

I use a Sony DVP-NS300 as a transport, it works well for this purpose IMO.

 

[NTTY]

I feel that it performs quite well for a DVD player, although it does also have SACD playback capability (not tested as I have no means to do so).

Without having a Test SACD like the Denon Audio Check SACD, you can use a shaped dither file from 16bits/44.1kHz. Restrict the distortion and noise measurement to 6'000Hz instead of standard 20'000Hz, and see if the ENOB improves. if yes, then the DAC has more resolution to process SACD. This is an exemple:

 

[Scytales]

Secondly I am looking for a used DVD player of a decent mechanical and electrical quality that was produced a lot so that it can easily be found for very little money and that is bit-perfect as a CD transport. Or as an alternative a new, very cheap one ... the Sony DVP-SR760H was mentioned somewhere else here ..

I studied this question some months ago in search for a multichannel DVD-V/DVD-A/CD-DTS/SA-CD player.

If I have not mistakenly read services manuals of numerous old Pioneer universal players, most of these devices did use known reliable laser optical pick-ups and they do not require electrical adjustments to be made after renewing them, only mechanical adjustment that a properly tooled skilled technicians should be able to do easily. More-over, spare lasers are still abundant for a bunch of this Pioneer universal players.

Then, I think these Pioneer universal multichannel players and some other brands who used to use Pioneer platforms to manufacture their own players are probably the best option to buy an used multichannel DVD-V/DVD-A/CD-DTS/SA-CD player.

The Pioneer players I think of are :

- Pioneer DV-565A
- Pioneer DV-575A
- Pioneer DV-656A (Elite DV-45A in the US)
- Pioneer DV-747A (Elite DV-47A in the US)*
- Pioneer DV-757Ai
- Pioneer DV-668AV
- Pioneer DV-868AVi (Elite DV-59AVi in the US and DV-S969 in Japan)
- Pioneer DV-989AVi (Elite DV-79AVi in the US)

Some players of other brands that used to use identical Pioneer traverse mechanics and processors :
- Marantz DV-12S2*
- Marantz DV-8300*
- Marantz DV-8400*
- Primare DVD30
- Onkyo DV-SP502
- Onkyo DV-SP503
- Onkyo DV-SP800
- Esoteric DV-50

The players marked with an "*" uses an optical pick-up that are still easy to find and affordable last time I check: the Pioneer OWX8003. Some other above mentioned players uses perhaps the same laser, but I have no time to check at this moment.

I have personally bought a Pioneer DV-868AVi and a Marantz DV-12S2. They are good performers with all types of disc (providing, as far as the DV-868AVi is concerned, that the channel level trim feature is left unused because it seems to introduce obvious listenable distortion; I have not try the level trim feature of the Marantz).

 

[Mart68]

Then, I think these Pioneer universal multichannel players and some other brands who used to use Pioneer platforms to manufacture their own players are probably the best option to buy an used multichannel DVD-V/DVD-A/CD-DTS/SA-CD play player.

The Pioneer players I think of are :

- Pioneer DV-565A
- Pioneer DV-575A
- Pioneer DV-656A (Elite DV-45A in the US)
- Pioneer DV-747A (Elite DV-47A in the US)*
- Pioneer DV-757Ai
- Pioneer DV-668AV
- Pioneer DV-868AVi (Elite DV-59AVi in the US and DV-S969 in Japan)
- Pioneer DV-989AVi (Elite DV-79AVi in the US)

I have a Pioneer DV-565A still working after about 20 years of service but I replaced it with an Oppo a few years ago.

I'm not sure the 565A will play 2 channel non-hybrid SACDs though?

 

[audio_tony]

Ok, I suspect something weird because it’s not present on all measurements, especially the ones at -0.2dBFS and -1.1dBFS and also -30dBFS.

It could be something else interacting with the player or the interface during measurement.

Some revised measurements, specifically the ones you mentioned. The noise floor is ever so slightly higher as I'm using an isolated ADC with a slightly higher noise floor than my usual Asus Xonar Essence sound card.

 

[EJ3]

I studied this question some months ago in search for a multichannel DVD-V/DVD-A/CD-DTS/SA-CD player.

If I have not mistakenly read services manuals of numerous old Pioneer universal players, most of these devices did use known reliable laser optical pick-ups and they do not require electrical adjustments to be made after renewing them, only mechanical adjustment that a properly tooled skilled technicians should be able to do easily. More-over, spare lasers are still abundant for a bunch of this Pioneer universal players.

Then, I think these Pioneer universal multichannel players and some other brands who used to use Pioneer platforms to manufacture their own players are probably the best option to buy an used multichannel DVD-V/DVD-A/CD-DTS/SA-CD player.

The Pioneer players I think of are :

- Pioneer DV-565A
- Pioneer DV-575A
- Pioneer DV-656A (Elite DV-45A in the US)
- Pioneer DV-747A (Elite DV-47A in the US)*
- Pioneer DV-757Ai
- Pioneer DV-668AV
- Pioneer DV-868AVi (Elite DV-59AVi in the US and DV-S969 in Japan)
- Pioneer DV-989AVi (Elite DV-79AVi in the US)

Some players of other brands that used to use identical Pioneer traverse mechanics and processors :
- Marantz DV-12S2*
- Marantz DV-8300*
- Marantz DV-8400*
- Primare DVD30
- Onkyo DV-SP502
- Onkyo DV-SP503
- Onkyo DV-SP800
- Esoteric DV-50

The players marked with an "*" uses an optical pick-up that are still easy to find and affordable last time I check: the Pioneer OWX8003. Some other above mentioned players uses perhaps the same laser, but I have no time to check at this moment.

I have personally bought a Pioneer DV-868AVi and a Marantz DV-12S2. They are good performers with all types of disc (providing, as far as the DV-868AVi is concerned, that the channel level trim feature is left unused because it seems to introduce obvious listenable distortion; I have not try the level trim feature of the Marantz).

Thank you for this great information!

 

[EJ3]

I studied this question some months ago in search for a multichannel DVD-V/DVD-A/CD-DTS/SA-CD player.

If I have not mistakenly read services manuals of numerous old Pioneer universal players, most of these devices did use known reliable laser optical pick-ups and they do not require electrical adjustments to be made after renewing them, only mechanical adjustment that a properly tooled skilled technicians should be able to do easily. More-over, spare lasers are still abundant for a bunch of this Pioneer universal players.

Then, I think these Pioneer universal multichannel players and some other brands who used to use Pioneer platforms to manufacture their own players are probably the best option to buy an used multichannel DVD-V/DVD-A/CD-DTS/SA-CD player.

The Pioneer players I think of are :

- Pioneer DV-565A
- Pioneer DV-575A
- Pioneer DV-656A (Elite DV-45A in the US)
- Pioneer DV-747A (Elite DV-47A in the US)*
- Pioneer DV-757Ai
- Pioneer DV-668AV
- Pioneer DV-868AVi (Elite DV-59AVi in the US and DV-S969 in Japan)
- Pioneer DV-989AVi (Elite DV-79AVi in the US)

Some players of other brands that used to use identical Pioneer traverse mechanics and processors :
- Marantz DV-12S2*
- Marantz DV-8300*
- Marantz DV-8400*
- Primare DVD30
- Onkyo DV-SP502
- Onkyo DV-SP503
- Onkyo DV-SP800
- Esoteric DV-50

The players marked with an "*" uses an optical pick-up that are still easy to find and affordable last time I check: the Pioneer OWX8003. Some other above mentioned players uses perhaps the same laser, but I have no time to check at this moment.

I have personally bought a Pioneer DV-868AVi and a Marantz DV-12S2. They are good performers with all types of disc (providing, as far as the DV-868AVi is concerned, that the channel level trim feature is left unused because it seems to introduce obvious listenable distortion; I have not try the level trim feature of the Marantz).

I actualy printed it out & added the information to my manual files (in my in desk filing cabinet) in the section on stereo gear.