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Review: Apple vs Google USB-C Headphone Adapters

Jimbob54

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I haven't read through the entire thread so apologies in advance if this was already addressed. The dongles being referenced seem to be USB-C to 3.5. What if there is someone (hint: me) whose windoz computers have old fashioned USB ports. Is the solution to get a USB adapter or are there suitable dongles in this config?
Lots of them ship with a little USB A(think the letterbox is A) to C adapter. Or these can be had for pennies from amazon etc.
 

stanroz

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The consensus seems to be that apple usb-c and lightning adapter are very similar. Well I didn't measure, but I listened using my akg k371 headphones. USB-C dongle was attached to Ipad Pro 2021, while lightning dongle was attached to iphone xr.

First I found that the volume levels are different. For same loudness the lightning dongle had to be set at around 10% higher volume setting. This is not surprising considering that reading this entire thread the volume levels seem to be all over the place based on what the dongle is attached to.

But I also found sound quality differences, and they were obvious. I then blind tested my non-audiophile son, and each and every time he decisively chose ipad pro/usb-c combo over iphone xr/lightning dongle.

To satisfy my curiosity further, I attached the usb-c "dongle to my iphone xr by way of Apple's own lightning to USB3 adapter. It wouldn't play. The message came back saying "not enough power". I then attached the power to the lightning to usb3 adapter. It played and sounded good, but still the output from ipad pro seemed cleaner.

What this all means I have no clue, but it does sour me on the whole dongle concept. It doesn't help that with its flimsy construction, every time I am checking out headphones and hear unexplained drop off in volume, I get suspicious that the dongle has gone bad.

I can now see the advantage of self powered portable units. If I could find a battery powered unit(s) that have as good measurements as usb-c dongle dac, a clean amp with more power, and not have to pay $800 or whatever it would cost, I would definitely go for it and dispense with any dongles.
 

celloh

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Is it okay to pair the apple dongle with powered monitors (jbl lsr305)?

Edit: I just tried it out and the output volume was way too quiet (possibly the result of 1v output level) and I experienced the same audible clicking sounds that others have experienced. Going back to my e10k line-out.
 
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fuzzy_logic

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Is it okay to pair the apple dongle with powered monitors (jbl lsr305)?

Edit: I just tried it out and the output volume was way too quiet (possibly the result of 1v output level) and I experienced the same audible clicking sounds that others have experienced. Going back to my e10k line-out.
Yeah, I purchased the Apple dongle from Amazon UK, and tried it with both my phone and PC connected to my speaker amp, and it was far too quiet to actually be usable. Sent it straight back. Not sure if it's an issue with the EU version.
 

staticV3

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Yeah, I purchased the Apple dongle from Amazon UK, and tried it with both my phone and PC connected to my speaker amp, and it was far too quiet to actually be usable. Sent it straight back. Not sure if it's an issue with the EU version.
UK and EU get the same version with a .5Vrms limiter.
Here's a map showing the different Lightning versions, haven't done Type-C yet.
Apple Lightning to 3,5mm Headphone Adapter.png
 

stanroz

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I just ordered Topping's NX7 portable amp to drive the Aeon 2 headphones. I will use the the dongle as a DAC for now, but since we can't bypass the dongle amp, is there any way to make those two amps play nice? Any suggestions?
 

threni

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If you'd like to stick to the same form factor, then there are only four dongles worth considering imo:
-the US version of the Apple dongle (A2049)
-Meizu HiFi (also sold as Meizu Master HiFi)
-Meizu HiFi Pro (production has ended, only available used)
-Ugreen HiFi Audio Pro (basically identical to Meizu HiFi Pro)

If you don't mind something with a larger, thumb drive style form factor, then there are many more option available, as Jimbob laid out.
Well, I got the US one from a seller over there (£5 for the dongle, £16 for post/customs/credit card foreign money handling fee).

(I'd previously phoned Apple and they told me the UK/US ones were the same; that they wouldn't sell me a US one, but that I could maybe get the US website to deliver to a US address and have someone forward it to me. That was their offical advice - work around their nonsense.)

And surprise surprise, it's louder. It amuses me that there are sites out there explaining how to make the EU one louder (rooting phones, playing with alsa tools on linux etc). Tried all that - it simply doesn't work - not unless some devices are further limiting its output beyond the EU limit. Probably "audiophiles" hearing what they want to hear again.
 
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BlueTunes

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I can't tell you how much it really annoys me that Apple in its continued pathetic closed garden approach, hobble the UBC-3.5mm dongle with android.

It is everything Apple is and perfectly encapsulates everything i hate about that horrendous company.
 

celloh

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Well, I got the US one from a seller over there (£5 for the dongle, £16 for post/customs/credit card foreign money handling fee).

(I'd previously Phoned Apple and they told me the UK/US ones were the same; that they wouldn't sell me a US one, but that I could maybe get the US website to deliver to a US address and have someone forward it to me. That was their offical advice - work around their nonsense.)

And surprise surprise, it's louder. It amuses me that there are sites out there explaining how to make the EU one louder (rooting phones, playing with alsa tools on linux etc). Tried all that - it simply doesn't work - not unless some devices are further limiting its output beyond the EU limit. Probably "audiophiles" hearing what they want to hear again.
From what I know the EU one has an internal limiter, meaning you can't bypass it but android has another limiter on top of the already existing EU limit. So rooting your phone or using the UAPP trick does work in android (I couldn't get my 560S to a good level on android before using the UAPP trick for an example.)
 

threni

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I can't tell you how much it really annoys me that Apple in its continued pathetic closed garden approach, hobble the UBC-3.5mm dongle with android.

It is everything Apple is and perfectly encapsulates everything i hate about that horrendous company.
I've only used my Apple dongle with Linux stuff. Other than plugging it in briefly into my phone which promptly rebooted it. Google not so promptly fixed that bug. But what Apple behaviour are you talking about?
 

BlueTunes

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I've only used my Apple dongle with Linux stuff. Other than plugging it in briefly into my phone which promptly rebooted it. Google not so promptly fixed that bug. But what Apple behaviour are you talking about?
Lock -in, or lock-out, depending.
 

Haz3

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the apple dongle is the truth. I use it with oppo pm3. recently got into this.
I used to be in denial of dacs and I thought my motherboard was enough. I have an alc1220 on it.
feels bad man, for 9 bucks. I was missing out lol.
It just sounds louder and better in every way then my motherboard. even when i set the headphone smart amp to level 3.
youtube videos dont sound so low anymore.
I was testing out Realtek drivers like a maniac(modded and generic) to see what sounds better . I settled with a one that i liked, but it pales in comparison with the dongle.

so yeah. i feel like i'll definitely be able to the difference in a blind test. no question.
Now, when it comes to the dangle and other dacs that i probbaly wont ever buy (so long as i have this headphone), I'm still a denialist. I wont be able to tell the difference :p
 

ground

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I have bought my dongle in taiwan, and it is also the 1V A2049, just like the US version.

About the android volume limitation: On android by default you have around -40db max volume on the dongle. There is however a way to unlock it to full volume systemwide at no cost. I could do it with android 11 and 12. You must have root and Magisk installed on your device.
I compiled the information on this Head-Fi post
 

WillBrink

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Thread bump. :cool:

I ordered the lightening adapter to use with my mac book pro and new HIFIMAN SUNDARA headphones to up my headphone listening experience, which is currently B&W P5s via the 3.5mm jack.

I'm assuming that's the 2mv version and the Sundara's should be efficient enough to be driven well by the dongle, and sound better than the 3.5mm jack route.

Sound about right? If not, would one go lightening (or USB-C) -> headphone amp (how to connect?) -> headphones?
 

staticV3

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I ordered the lightening adapter to use with my mac book pro
MacBooks don't have Lightning ports last time I've checked. How do you plan to plug the dongle in?

I'm assuming that's the 2mv version
There are two versions of Apple dongles. One with 0.5Vrms max output and one with 1.0Vrms max output.
A 2mVrms (0.002Vrms) version does not exist.

and sound better than the 3.5mm jack route
You mean better than your MacBook's 3.5mm jack? Not necessarily.

Sound about right? If not, would one go lightening (or USB-C) -> headphone amp (how to connect?) -> headphones?
Yes, you can do that.
MacBook -> Apple dongle -> 3.5mm to 2x RCA adapter -> external headphone Amp -> Sundara
 

staticV3

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the Sundara's should be efficient enough to be driven well by the dongle
They aren't. Sundara 2020 has 104dB SPL/Vrms. Even with the more powerful 1Vrms version of the Apple dongle, they won't get very loud.
 

WillBrink

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MacBooks don't have Lightning ports last time I've checked. How do you plan to plug the dongle in?
I meant Thunderbolt. Glad you caught that. Ordered I USB-C dongle.

There are two versions of Apple dongles. One with 0.5Vrms max output and one with 1.0Vrms max output.
A 2mVrms (0.002Vrms) version does not exist.
Hopefully, using the model # I had read here, I ordered the 1.0Vrms version.

You mean better than your MacBook's 3.5mm jack? Not necessarily.
I'd gathered the S/N ratio was better via the USB-C port using the apple dongle. What would lead to the Not necessarily conclusion? I'm happy to continue using the 3.5mm port, seemed to my pleb self from reading, the dongle was the way to go.

Yes, you can do that.
MacBook -> Apple dongle -> 3.5mm to 2x RCA adapter -> external headphone Amp -> Sundara

If I don't get satisfactory volume and dynamics from the dongle -> headphones, the amp would be next.

Now I need to see the EQ exists/recommend for Mac, as the Sundara appear to benefit bigly from EQ.

Any recs there?
 

WillBrink

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They aren't. Sundara 2020 has 104dB SPL/Vrms. Even with the more powerful 1Vrms version of the Apple dongle, they won't get very loud.

Good to know! It sounds like an amp is in my future then, likely a Schiit Magni Heresy.
 

staticV3

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What would lead to the Not necessarily conclusion?
Your MacBook will most likely output 1Vrms as well, just like the dongle.
Higher SNR is only useful if you can hear the noise floor of your current setup. That will definitely not be the case with the Sundara.

the Sundara appear to benefit bigly from EQ.
Doesn't look like it to me tbh:
Screenshot_20220312-215053_Chrome.jpg
One could fill in the 1-6KHz area a bit and bring bass up to Harman 2018 (or 2013), but all in all the frequency response is pretty nice already. Note though that this is the 2020 version. A pre 2020 version exists as well and that one's a bit rougher.

Any recs there?
Soundsource or eqMac. Note though that you'll have to pay if you want proper PEQ.
Here'a a better overview of EQ on macOS: https://github.com/jaakkopasanen/AutoEq#osx--macos

Edit: there's also this comprehensive list on ASR:
 
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WillBrink

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Your MacBook will most likely output 1Vrms as well, just like the dongle.
Higher SNR is only useful if you can hear the noise floor of your current setup. That will definitely not be the case with the Sundara.


Doesn't look like it to me tbh:
View attachment 191895
One could fill in the 1-6KHz area a bit and bring bass up to Harman 2018 (or 2013), but all in all the frequency response is pretty nice already. Note though that this is the 2020 version. A pre 2020 version exists as well and that one's a bit rougher.


Soundsource or eqMac. Note though that you'll have to pay if you want proper PEQ.
Here'a a better overview of EQ on macOS: https://github.com/jaakkopasanen/AutoEq#osx--macos

Edit: there's also this comprehensive list on ASR:
Thanx, will look into all that. Power wise, appears slightly more juice than the dongle, not a lot:

"When you connect headphones with an impedance of less than 150 ohms, the headphone jack provides up to 1.25 volts RMS."

The Sundara's are mid 30s, with 96Db efficiency.
 
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