Reducing Noise in Ethernet Cable

[Jerry Sobel]

Yes, we all have been at one or more times. Live and learn. This is a good place to do that.

Thank you. I appreciate your comment.

 

[rebbiputzmaker]

Wow for one how difficult is it to be nice to a new member who is opening up about some poor purchases and is trying to get some help with it. Secondly, either I did not explain it well or you did not process my information correctly about my set up and the changes that I made. Why would I attach one DAC to another DAC? Come on dude.... oh and thanks for commenting on the MSRP of the unit I own. BTW, I paid considerably less than that.
You can write all you want on my posts but I will not respond beyond these comments.

If you cannot understand before you waste more $$$$, get what you have setup properly, sorry! So much for trying to help you. smh

 

[Jinjuku]

I did some testing of a 315 foot generic CAT5e cable that was $0.30/foot and a 3 foot Nordost Heimdall II CAT8 that was $233 a foot. I posted two tracks where I swapped out the cabling during playback. No one could tell when the change was made or how many changes were made.

 

[Thomas savage]

If you cannot understand before you waste more $$$$, get what you have setup properly, sorry! So much for trying to help you. smh

When someone comes here asking for help we do not treat them this way.

Recommend reading for you...,

 

[rebbiputzmaker]

When someone comes here asking for help we do not treat them this way.

Recommend reading for you...,

View attachment 10752

Read it many times! He was offended when I explained how he can utilize what he already owns. Obviously he has been taken advantage of by audio charlatans. It is called constructive criticism. Translation. He has computer, dacs, more stuff than he needs several times over, so all the issues would not be there, with proper setup! He is looking to purchase more stuff and some sales person will gladly sell it to him. Respectfully Thomas computer audio can be challenging for many people. Do you understand what he was saying? "Mac software sucks?" "Can't use Windows?" He spent a grand on a SoTM streamer. Still have zero clue from what he has posted piecemeal where he is actually storing / streaming music from. Breaking down the components and simplifying, creating a proper working system is first priority.

 

[DonH56]

One can ask questions like in your OP and get blunt answers (@DonH56) and then explanations too (@amirm).

Sorry, I often post when I am doing something else (usually working -- last night I was trying to finish a review and taking a short break, and yes it was Sunday night ) so am more of a "fly-by" poster. Especially when the question is a "yes/no" type and the explanation behind the answer would take me some time to articulate. Amir answered it well so when I had time to loop back there was no need to go further. It is sometimes hard to remember how many times the same questions get asked and answered so at times I do tend to be "concise" (thanks @Wombat!) and may not remember it is all new to all of us in the beginning.

Anytime you want more explanation, please ask, and I or one of the many other folk (many of whom with much more expertise than I) will undoubtedly be happy to answer.

Onwards - Don

 

[RayDunzl]

If I am streaming music from my server over an Ethernet cable to my SoTM SMS Ultra do I have to worry about noise? If so, how do I reduce it?

I invent a test:

Turn your volume up to maximum, nothing playing. Listen to speaker. Is there noise?

Yes - you have noise
No - you may have noise. Go to next step.

Using Audacity, create a triangle dithered silence test file. This puts +/-1 bit of noise onto the silence. Play the file.

Why? Some DACs may mute during total silence (all zero audio data). Audacity thinks it is -90.039dBfs. Looks like this up close:

5 minute file attached. Download. Un-zip. Play. Turn volume to highest setting. You might hear a slight hissy noise. Anything else is system noise.

Is there noise?
No - you probably don't have noise
Yes - if it is a very very faint hissy noise, that's the file, and you probably don't have noise. Anything else is system noise.

While playing the file, turn the volume control back to a normal level. The hissy noise (if you could hear it) will likely disappear.

Is there noise?
No - you probably don't have noise.
Yes - is it the same as the first Yes above?

Turn the volume all the way down.

Is there noise?
No - stop imagining you have noise
Yes - something is making noise. Bummer. Suicide is painless (and cheap).

Adjust mental state of noise-worry according to results obtained.

My Results here:

Didn't hear anything, but I'm not Golden Eared, or even Silver Eared. Maybe Stone Eared. Sort of hear a "sea-shell" noise when ear is close to speaker (maybe).

---

What does the file sound like?

Amplified the 1-bit dither until I could just hear it across the room at the PC (remember, the volume control is maxed out). Audacity calls it to be -60dBfs.

Visual compare of -90dB and -60dB files (zoomed in, like 1000x magnification):

Edit: I see a procedural mistake, more dithering of the dithered file upon amplification. (Not worried about it)

Play the -60dB file, you should hear a little hiss.

Files attached...

Have fun. Or don't.

UPLOAD FAILED, will try again. Was too big.

Try here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/h9b65m3cn28vow4/5min -60db.zip?dl=0

 

[Jerry Sobel]

So if there is little to no noise carried over an ethernet cable then wouldn't that be a better connection for my Ayon S-5 (network player/DAC) than a S/PDIF or AES?

 

[RayDunzl]

So...

Do you have noise?

 

[Jerry Sobel]

Do you have noise?

I have not yet run the test. Just got home.

 

[RayDunzl]

Oops...

PS: Some speaker/amplifier setups will have a little hiss regardless. High efficiency speakers/horns may hiss a little.

My active LBL LSR 308s hiss a little.

My MartinLogans are silent.

 

[amirm]

So if there is little to no noise carried over an ethernet cable then wouldn't that be a better connection for my Ayon S-5 (network player/DAC) than a S/PDIF or AES?

Unfortunately you can't draw such conclusions without measurements. Noise here is changed and reduced by different system components and cannot be predicted until we see what comes out of the DAC.

 

[March Audio]

Wow for one how difficult is it to be nice to a new member who is opening up about some poor purchases and is trying to get some help with it. Secondly, either I did not explain it well or you did not process my information correctly about my set up and the changes that I made. Why would I attach one DAC to another DAC? Come on dude.... oh and thanks for commenting on the MSRP of the unit I own. BTW, I paid considerably less than that.
You can write all you want on my posts but I will not respond beyond these comments.

Do as I have done, put the dummkopf on ignore.

 

[Jerry Sobel]

Do as I have done, put the plonker on ignore.

Cool. Did not know I could do that!

 

[March Audio]

Cool. Did not know I could do that!

Click on the persons name and click ignore

 

[Vincent Kars]

Hey Jerry

Maybe I’m misreading your posts but my feeling is that you are happy with the sound quality of the Ayon but not with the interface (UPnP).
You like Roon and want to use that as the interface.
If this is correct:

- Roon doesn’t support UPnP/DLNA so it can’t be used to control the Ayon
- Ayon can’t be used as a USB DAC hence you can’t connect it to a Roon endpoint like SOtM

Maybe a product like this the solution: https://support.auralic.com/hc/en-us/articles/206602717-Product-Specification
It is a Roon end point
It has AES/EBU, Coaxial, TOSLINK output so it can drive the Ayon

 

[Jerry Sobel]

Hey Jerry

Maybe I’m misreading your posts but my feeling is that you are happy with the sound quality of the Ayon but not with the interface (UPnP).
You like Roon and want to use that as the interface.
If this is correct:

- Roon doesn’t support UPnP/DLNA so it can’t be used to control the Ayon
- Ayon can’t be used as a USB DAC hence you can’t connect it to a Roon endpoint like SOtM

Maybe a product like this the solution: https://support.auralic.com/hc/en-us/articles/206602717-Product-Specification
It is a Roon end point
It has AES/EBU, Coaxial, TOSLINK output so it can drive the Ayon

You got it 100% correct!
I will look into the product. Thank you.

 

[Jerry Sobel]

Hey Jerry

Maybe I’m misreading your posts but my feeling is that you are happy with the sound quality of the Ayon but not with the interface (UPnP).
You like Roon and want to use that as the interface.
If this is correct:

- Roon doesn’t support UPnP/DLNA so it can’t be used to control the Ayon
- Ayon can’t be used as a USB DAC hence you can’t connect it to a Roon endpoint like SOtM

Maybe a product like this the solution: https://support.auralic.com/hc/en-us/articles/206602717-Product-Specification
It is a Roon end point
It has AES/EBU, Coaxial, TOSLINK output so it can drive the Ayon

They look like interesting products. I would want to look at some measurements before purchasing. I don't want anymore "Schiit"

 

[Soniclife]

There a loads of products that roon will talk to that will convert ethernet to what you need, probably best to check out the roon forum for suggestions.

 

[rebbiputzmaker]

There a loads of products that roon will talk to that will convert ethernet to what you need, probably best to check out the roon forum for suggestions.

They must all be schiit because they are not measured. Please see above.