Reducing Noise in Ethernet Cable

[Jerry Sobel]

I'm not sure exactly what it is you are trying to achieve, so I'll try to deconstruct one of your posts to see if we can clear that up...

> My issue is I have a very expensive network player- Ayon S-5 and they recommend connecting by RJ45. It does not have a USB input. I have had it for 3 years and got tired of it.

What aspect did you get tired of?

> So I bought the Schitt and in a side by side comparison the Ayon is light years ahead in sound.

This suggests you still like the sound of the Ayon, yes?

> Anyway, the Ayon music playing sucks in a gigantic way
> I love Roon

Was it the Ayon user interface that you think sucks, and got tired of?
Did you got Roon as a replacement UI for the Ayon?
But, since Roon does not, and will not support DLNA, you can't use it to drive your Ayon via the network?

I am going to assume you are happy with the sound of the Ayon (unless you tell us otherwise), but want to replace means by which you interact with it.

You have a choice, then:

i) continue to use Roon, but look for an alternative means to deliver a stream to the Ayon
ii) continue to use Roon, but replace the Ayon with a device that supports Roon's RAAT protocol
iii) continue to use the Ayon, driven via network port, using an alternative UI.

Looking at the Roon website, I see that it does look very pretty, and the 'flow of consciousness' demo does look beguiling. But I cannot see much in the features that cannot be provided by other music player apps. Roon are obviously being a bit bold with their statement that 'Roon plays with your gear'. I guess they didn't include the magic word 'all' in that...

They provide somewhat unfair comparisons of the 'Roon turns this...into this'; I have never used a media player that simply has a bald track listing. All the media players I have (except tiny little portable MP3 players) have album art views, and some offer lyrics, band profiles, their other albums, similar artists, shopping links, etc. Some of these players also look very pretty. And the players I use are free, or cost a few pounds to buy, not $120pa.

For me, music is an audio experience; I set my player running, and listen to music. I don't really look at the pretty pictures, or read the lyrics, etc, unless something specific crops up that I want to have a look at.

If you want to continue to use your Ayon, and you want to continue streaming to it via the network port (using DLNA), then I'd suggest you look at other media players. Here are some I'd suggest:

MediaMonkey https://www.mediamonkey.com/download/ free, with minor limitations on function, Windows
MusicBee https://getmusicbee.com/ free, closed source, single man developer, Windows
Kodi https://kodi.tv/ free, fully open source, with very active development team, multi-platform, Tidal add-on available
Plex https://www.plex.tv/ free, multi-platform

I've listed them in increasing order of 'prettiness'... They will pretty much all do the same thing. MM, MB and Kodi will all access an SMB file server, as well as a DLNA media server. This can give a better user experience (e.g. the ability to run an auto-DJ function, which is tricky with DLNA). I can't speak for Plex, as I've not used it. The look-and-feel of MB & Kodi can be set up, using configuration of the various panels, and by the use of skins. Kodi has a huge user base, and has many skins available, and accesses rich metadata databases for artist information, cover art, fan art, etc.

Of course, I may have misunderstood what you are trying to achieve...

OMG! Perfectly understood. I do like pretty though. You missed JRiver but alas you have to pay for that software and it's buggy.

I have used Kodi and plex but I do not get the same deep level of pure satisfaction that I get with Roon.

I am working on getting my signal to the Ayon and have a plan. I do like the sound of the Ayon just not the user interface.

 

[March Audio]

I'm not sure exactly what it is you are trying to achieve, so I'll try to deconstruct one of your posts to see if we can clear that up...

> My issue is I have a very expensive network player- Ayon S-5 and they recommend connecting by RJ45. It does not have a USB input. I have had it for 3 years and got tired of it.

What aspect did you get tired of?

> So I bought the Schitt and in a side by side comparison the Ayon is light years ahead in sound.

This suggests you still like the sound of the Ayon, yes?

> Anyway, the Ayon music playing sucks in a gigantic way
> I love Roon

Was it the Ayon user interface that you think sucks, and got tired of?
Did you got Roon as a replacement UI for the Ayon?
But, since Roon does not, and will not support DLNA, you can't use it to drive your Ayon via the network?

I am going to assume you are happy with the sound of the Ayon (unless you tell us otherwise), but want to replace means by which you interact with it.

You have a choice, then:

i) continue to use Roon, but look for an alternative means to deliver a stream to the Ayon
ii) continue to use Roon, but replace the Ayon with a device that supports Roon's RAAT protocol
iii) continue to use the Ayon, driven via network port, using an alternative UI.

Looking at the Roon website, I see that it does look very pretty, and the 'flow of consciousness' demo does look beguiling. But I cannot see much in the features that cannot be provided by other music player apps. Roon are obviously being a bit bold with their statement that 'Roon plays with your gear'. I guess they didn't include the magic word 'all' in that...

They provide somewhat unfair comparisons of the 'Roon turns this...into this'; I have never used a media player that simply has a bald track listing. All the media players I have (except tiny little portable MP3 players) have album art views, and some offer lyrics, band profiles, their other albums, similar artists, shopping links, etc. Some of these players also look very pretty. And the players I use are free, or cost a few pounds to buy, not $120pa.

For me, music is an audio experience; I set my player running, and listen to music. I don't really look at the pretty pictures, or read the lyrics, etc, unless something specific crops up that I want to have a look at.

If you want to continue to use your Ayon, and you want to continue streaming to it via the network port (using DLNA), then I'd suggest you look at other media players. Here are some I'd suggest:

MediaMonkey https://www.mediamonkey.com/download/ free, with minor limitations on function, Windows
MusicBee https://getmusicbee.com/ free, closed source, single man developer, Windows
Kodi https://kodi.tv/ free, fully open source, with very active development team, multi-platform, Tidal add-on available
Plex https://www.plex.tv/ free, multi-platform

I've listed them in increasing order of 'prettiness'... They will pretty much all do the same thing. MM, MB and Kodi will all access an SMB file server, as well as a DLNA media server. This can give a better user experience (e.g. the ability to run an auto-DJ function, which is tricky with DLNA). I can't speak for Plex, as I've not used it. The look-and-feel of MB & Kodi can be set up, using configuration of the various panels, and by the use of skins. Kodi has a huge user base, and has many skins available, and accesses rich metadata databases for artist information, cover art, fan art, etc.

Of course, I may have misunderstood what you are trying to achieve...

Roon is different from most media players. It is way better than anything else I have used. Unless you try it out you may not understand why, as on the face of it there may not seem as if there is anything groundbreaking there. Fundamentally from my perspective it is the integration of Tidal (and the way it does so) which creates a great environment for exploring new music.

Personally I would definitely ditch the awkward hardware to keep Roon

So to me its options 1 or 2

i) continue to use Roon, but look for an alternative means to deliver a stream to the Ayon
ii) continue to use Roon, but replace the Ayon with a device that supports Roon's RAAT protocol

 

[Kal Rubinson]

OMG! Perfectly understood. I do like pretty though. You missed JRiver but alas you have to pay for that software and it's buggy.

Buggy? Nope. I have used it for years and, yes, there are many updates which either introduce more features or fix things (bugs?). However, I have never had a bug problem. It always works.

 

[March Audio]

Are these set ups DIY? My massive two piece streamer has RJ45 input or BNC or optical. I guess I would go for the USB to S/PDIF one. Currently I have a SoTM as my Roon endpoint but just sold my Yggdrasil so need that go between piece. The Pi seems like a great cheap solution. I must read more about these. Thank you for help.

I dont consider the product a DIY effort, its quite professional, but yes they are essentially DIY in the sense that you need to assemble it, but that is dead simple as shown in this video:

A review is here. Personally I would ignore the sighted uncontrolled subjective comments and comparisons here. If it delivers a good SPDIF signal then its fine. The rest is imagination. You can always use a linear PSU if suffering a bit of audiophile nervosa.

Darko likes it

https://darko.audio/2017/08/allos-digione-pulls-five-star-sound-quality-from-the-raspberry-pi/

My observation (without having personally tested it) about the board is it does everything technically right to get a good spdif output. Nothing to be gained from expensive "HiFi" streamers.

 

[captain paranoia]

Unless you try it out you may not understand why, a

I did get a feel for how different it is from the 'flow of consciousness' demo, which, as I said, looked beguiling. I might give it a try, but I can't see me ever paying $120pa for it.

 

[March Audio]

I did get a feel for how different it is from the 'flow of consciousness' demo, which, as I said, looked beguiling. I might give it a try, but I can't see me ever paying $120pa for it.

I agree the cost is a shocker. You can buy the lifetime sub for $500. I have saved this money easily over a few years because as a result I have dramatically reduced my purchases of music. The tidal hifi stream is excellent.

 

[Soniclife]

I did get a feel for how different it is from the 'flow of consciousness' demo, which, as I said, looked beguiling. I might give it a try, but I can't see me ever paying $120pa for it.

My default programming agrees with your view, 'how much?', it took a 3 month trial to convince me, when it was coming to an end I paid the money without really thinking about it, I was way past the point of wanting to go back to other choices. However not everyone likes it, these choices are personal, but I would say the way you interact with your music is more important than them minor SQ changes that might be forced on you from choosing one over the other. BE718 is making the same point above.

If I was Jerry I would buy the allo, or if audiophile nervosa is telling me it's too cheap then something from mutec. Or replace the DAC with something roon ready, or a DAC with USB input. Those last 2 options being the way to get the one clock that matters in charge.

 

[March Audio]

If I was Jerry I would buy the allo. Or replace the DAC with something roon ready, or a DAC with USB input. Those last option being the way to get the one clock that matters in charge.

This

 

[Fitzcaraldo215]

Or replace the DAC with something roon ready, or a DAC with USB input. Those last 2 options being the way to get the one clock that matters in charge.

Anti-USB paranoia is not a total mystery, since some DACS just do a schitty job of properly isolating from USB. It is not just a question of cost, since some cheap DACs have no major issues with it. But, many audiophiles blame USB, not the DAC, as they should. Some go through questionable hoops trying to get coax or I2S to work via reclockers and converters to alleviate the alleged horrors of USB.

Yup, single clock in the DAC is the way to go, and asynch USB makes that work flawlessly with countless DACs, though unfortunately not all.

 

[Soniclife]

But, many audiophiles blame USB, not the DAC, as they should. Some go through questionable hoops trying to get coax or I2S to work via reclockers and converters to alleviate the alleged horrors of USB.

I'm personally convinced it's rarely the DAC actually at fault, and is just FUD repeated so often on forums from faulty (sighted) listening tests that lots of people think it's true. It seems like people want to believe it is not a solved problem, because of 'won't someone think of the bits' style hand wringing.