Neumann KH 150 Monitor Review

[dfuller]

It will be interesting to see. I have a pair of KH310's as well as several other Neumann monitors in my studio - including KH 150's and KH 120 II's). It will be particularly interesting to see how the new KH 310's compare to the KH 150's.

Chances are the 310 II will be substantially better than a 150, considering the current 310 is already IMO audibly superior.

 

[SlothRock]

Chances are the 310 II will be substantially better than a 150, considering the current 310 is already IMO audibly superior.

If they make it vertical this time, I'd freak out. I doubt it though - probably similar horizontal format and ~$1k more/speaker than the current gen

 

[dfuller]

If they make it vertical this time, I'd freak out. I doubt it though - probably similar horizontal format and ~$1k more/speaker than the current gen

Considering these are professional monitors primarily, the sideways thing is so they're fairly compact when placed on or near a console's meter bridge to not block sight lines.

 

[SlothRock]

Considering these are professional monitors primarily, the sideways thing is so they're fairly compact when placed on or near a console's meter bridge to not block sight lines.

For sure, I know. It's just a bummer size for crazy regular folks that just want the best sound quality on their personal computer lol the KH150's are pretty much the max size my desk is gonna be able to fit but they're more than enough anyways so I'm good with it.

 

[Pearljam5000]

Anyone compared KH150 with Genelec Ones?

 

[tifune]

Anyone compared KH150 with Genelec Ones?

I have - you'd be much better off learning to interpret the measurements over my opinion, but since you asked... The KH150 is exceptional; in the end I prefer the 8341. Most likely it's the Genelec top end which causes most people to refer to genelec as "brighter" than Neumann. Overall, though, the Kh II's are a much better value. Ultimately I prefer D&D to both, but I might change my mind if I can ever work up the courage to order W371s

 

[Pearljam5000]

I have - you'd be much better off learning to interpret the measurements over my opinion, but since you asked... The KH150 is exceptional; in the end I prefer the 8341. Most likely it's the Genelec top end which causes most people to refer to genelec as "brighter" than Neumann. Overall, though, the Kh II's are a much better value. Ultimately I prefer D&D to both, but I might change my mind if I can ever work up the courage to order W371s

I like the brighter sound of the Genelecs
I'm afraid KH150 would sound dark to me like the KH120(older model)that I owned

 

[Count Arthur]

I like the brighter sound of the Genelecs
I'm afraid KH150 would sound dark to me like the KH120(older model)that I owned

You could probably tweak that, either using the switches on the back, or with PEQ.

Having taken my measurements with REW and then plumbed them into JRiver, I will go through them, check and uncheck them individually to make sure I like what they are doing:

I might then either disable a specific filter, or adjust it. On my previous monitors, there was a filter around 3KHz, with a -7dB cut, but I adjusted it to just -2.5dB as I felt that with the full -7dB, it made vocals, particularly female vocals, sound a little dull and recessed. For professional mixing and monitoring, you might not want to do this because because it might throw off your mix, but for just listening enjoyment, I see no reason why you can't use the filters suggested by your measurements as a start point and then adjust to taste.

 

[teashea]

Chances are the 310 II will be substantially better than a 150, considering the current 310 is already IMO audibly superior.

Better - yes. But substantially? - probably not. Except for bass extension the KH150 is so good that there is almost no room for improvement. Read the results of Amir's tests. What is to improve?

 

[teashea]

I like the brighter sound of the Genelecs
I'm afraid KH150 would sound dark to me like the KH120(older model)that I owned

That is exactly the point. The Genelecs are brighter - and that is not a good thing for studio monitors. Studio monitors are not supposed to make the music sound better. They are supposed to tell the truth of what the music actually sounds like.

 

[holdingpants01]

That is exactly the point. The Genelecs are brighter - and that is not a good thing for studio monitors. Studio monitors are not supposed to make the music sound better. They are supposed to tell the truth of what the music actually sounds like.

Not true, they are not making the music sound better, Neumanns on the other hand are more forgiving and too soft sounding for me. I worked on KH310 and KH120 for years, switched to Genelecs and would never go back. Mixes I did on Neumanns sometimes were surprisingly harsh when I checked them in my car as they hid the problems, no longer an issue with Genelecs. For recreational listening I would go with Neumanns as they are cheaper, for critical work no contest really and I went with The Ones.
BTW you never shared any measurements from your listening position in your room, you always claim you prefer flat frequency response, yet I'm not sure you have that in your room with the placement you use and reflective surfaces near monitors, especially with non-dsp models

 

[SlothRock]

I like the brighter sound of the Genelecs
I'm afraid KH150 would sound dark to me like the KH120(older model)that I owned

FWIW the KH150 does not sound as dark as my KH120A's. This is anecdotal and not blind-tested and level matched, etc. but there is a significant difference imo

 

[teashea]

Not true, they are not making the music sound better, Neumanns on the other hand are more forgiving and too soft sounding for me. I worked on KH310 and KH120 for years, switched to Genelecs and would never go back. Mixes I did on Neumanns sometimes were surprisingly harsh when I checked them in my car as they hid the problems, no longer an issue with Genelecs. For recreational listening I would go with Neumanns as they are cheaper, for critical work no contest really and I went with The Ones.
BTW you never shared any measurements from your listening position in your room, you always claim you prefer flat frequency response, yet I'm not sure you have that in your room with the placement you use and reflective surfaces near monitors, especially with non-dsp models

Look at the measurements - not unreliable subjectivity. The Neumann KH150's are flat. The whole theme of this group is ---- cleverly enough - Audio Science Review - not the Audio Psychological Preferences Review.

 

[unpluggged]

FWIW the KH150 does not sound as dark as my KH120A's

Do we have to go all over this topic again? The KH 120 is not dark by any measure. And even if you'd like it brighter, there are several ways to adjust them.

 

[Moonhead]

Do we have to go all over this topic again? The KH 120 is not dark by any measure. And even if you'd like it brighter, there are several ways to adjust them.

We surely do as Long as people tolerate EddieVedder aka. Broken Radio!

 

[teashea]

Do we have to go all over this topic again? The KH 120 is not dark by any measure. And even if you'd like it brighter, there are several ways to adjust them.

So true. One main problem is that most people psychologically have a blanket preference for brighter sounding music. Just like there is a preference for louder, there is a preference for brighter. That is why the objective measurements are so important - and why ASR is so important. Unfortunately many people do not understand this. It is curious why these people .......

 

[SlothRock]

Do we have to go all over this topic again? The KH 120 is not dark by any measure. And even if you'd like it brighter, there are several ways to adjust them.

Like I said - it was my subjective opinion that was not blind tested, level matched or anything. Totally fine being wrong here and probably am

 

[unpluggged]

Like I said - it was my subjective opinion that was not blind tested, level matched or anything. Totally fine being wrong here and probably am

I wasn't meaning to offend you or your personal preferences. I understand that the KH 150 can be perceived as being brighter than the KH 120 in direct comparison in specific listening conditions. It's the other member who is known for regularly invoking the dubious claim that Neumanns are inherently "dark", after having only briefly listened to them (while not stating under which conditions did they come to such conclusion).

As for my personal experience, I am using the KH 120 daily for a year and a half now, and at first the treble even felt a bit too harsh for me (after having used the HEDD Type 07 MK2), but it looks like I got used to it. What is true, is that these speakers benefit from EQ that helps to get rid of some low-mid messiness due to desktop reflections. Then you can hear what they are really capable of. So perhaps this perceived "darkness" has more to do with suboptimal listening conditions rather than the tonality of the speakers themselves (as backed by their free-field measurements).

 

[teashea]

Like I said - it was my subjective opinion that was not blind tested, level matched or anything. Totally fine being wrong here and probably

It is not that you are wrong in the sense that you are absolutely entitled to your preferences. However, it is important for all of us to understand the difference between objective reality and personal perception/preference. The point is that the un-brightness is not in the KH monitors --- It is in your perception and preferences.

 

[dfuller]

Better - yes. But substantially? - probably not. Except for bass extension the KH150 is so good that there is almost no room for improvement. Read the results of Amir's tests. What is to improve?

First, don't tell me to read Amir's reviews. I have already.

Second, the V1s already have lower IMD, they have way more dynamics in the bass (the 150s are pretty hard limited at 96dB), they have smoother DI (driver size changes are less dramatic)... So yeah. The V2s will be better.