• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are daily reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

MOTU UltraLite-mk5 in fully active setup

OP
manisandher

manisandher

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Nov 6, 2016
Messages
643
Likes
598
Location
Royal Leamington Spa, UK

jtwrace

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
May 31, 2017
Messages
1,215
Likes
1,399
Location
Orlando, FL
Yep... sort of. See post #3 above.
Got it. I wonder if they be able to get it to play 192 content at some point. If it could do that and play nice with Roon Rock I'd be very happy. I might have to get one to try. I had one years ago. lol
 

spalmgre

Member
Joined
May 22, 2019
Messages
48
Likes
14
Location
Helsinki
I have recently compared the headphone output of the MOTU to that of the RME ADI-2 (Pro fs BE AKM, etc.) however, and the RME is significantly better. I'm putting this down to a better/beefier headphone amp in the RME.

Mani.

Amirm wright in mk5 Rewiew ---> "So better than a checklist item but best to use a proper headphone amplifier."

 

spalmgre

Member
Joined
May 22, 2019
Messages
48
Likes
14
Location
Helsinki
I wonder if they be able to get it to play 192 content at some point. If it could do that and play nice with Roon Rock I'd be very happy.
Why do you think it would be better using 192. Is it an important feature? Or is it so that you already got everything else right and this is kind of one of the last to do?
 

jtwrace

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
May 31, 2017
Messages
1,215
Likes
1,399
Location
Orlando, FL
Why do you think it would be better using 192. Is it an important feature? Or is it so that you already got everything else right and this is kind of one of the last to do?
Yeah just a why not thing. Certainly no real need.
 

phoenixdogfan

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Nov 6, 2018
Messages
3,233
Likes
4,881
Location
Nashville
Dualazmak you are the greatest! I really really don't want to throw more cash at an integrated multichannel amplifier given that I already have power amps (perhaps a multichannel preamp but that would likely cost as much as an integrated amplifier) but it's a great suggestion and I'm absolutely going to read all of your posts and take it under consideration.

I absolutely follow your project thread, it's what I used to implement my first active crossover designs - thank you so much! Literally it's been my primary guide on how to implement things.

I'm going to take a look at your integrated amplifiers post now.
You just really need to add gain to compensate for the digital headroom you traded off with the DSP, right? Well there may be a solution coming down the pike soon.

Archimago recently reviewed a prototype of the e1da Cosmos Scaler which is a small preamp module able to apply up to 26.7 db of "very clean amplification. Think it's only for two channels, but generally e1da units are very reasonably priced, so buying for as many channels as needed might not be cost prohibitive. Again, just a prototype for now, but something, I think, to keep an eye on.

 

anphex

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Forum Donor
Joined
May 14, 2021
Messages
656
Likes
863
Location
Berlin, Germany
I am very interested in this since I want to try to activate my speakers in the hope of using the chassis more efficiently.

So I hook up a Motu or any other decent multichannel interface to my PC, use Roon (or other tools?) to assign each crossover path to an output, hook it up to their respective amps and the start designing the crossover/filters?

Edit: I just sent MOTU a mail asking if their devices and drivers are capable of this.
 
Last edited:

spalmgre

Member
Joined
May 22, 2019
Messages
48
Likes
14
Location
Helsinki
So I hook up a Motu or any other decent multichannel interface to my PC, use Roon (or other tools?) to assign each crossover path to an output, hook it up to their respective amps and the start designing the crossover/filters?
I have been looking into this same and think it is just what the mk5 can doo. But the marketing department is not aware of this kind of need. So I have not found any information about this way of using the interface. The Motul mk5 is thought of as an interface for music production and not for reproduction as we like to use it.

I have an 8-channel active setup and I'm planning to upgrade my DAC, therefore, Motu 8-channel DAC is of interest.

I'm interested in the mk5 as I want to solve how to play also other sound sources than computer-based sound files. So I like to solve how to connect TV Toslink and vinyl record player preamp into the computer. I like to use the computer as a preamp with FIR filter convolution capabilities for the active setup that I have.

I think this can be done by routing the inputs from mk5 into the computer. Then I would direct the signals into Voice Meeter banana to be able to choose what to listen to. Then I would direct the output of the Voice Meeter to HLConvolver. This can be done with Virtual Audio Cable.
Now the tricky question is, will Motu mk5 allow me to send the output from the HLConvolver back so that the signal can be further sent through the interfaces to the DAC outputs?
If it can do this then mk5 can do that what Toppings MD7 and Octo dac8 can not do.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_3463.JPG
    IMG_3463.JPG
    599.3 KB · Views: 37

mdsimon2

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Oct 20, 2020
Messages
2,440
Likes
3,275
Location
Detroit, MI
I am very interested in this since I want to try to activate my speakers in the hope of using the chassis more efficiently.

So I hook up a Motu or any other decent multichannel interface to my PC, use Roon (or other tools?) to assign each crossover path to an output, hook it up to their respective amps and the start designing the crossover/filters?

Edit: I just sent MOTU a mail asking if their devices and drivers are capable of this.

It is possible as shown in this thread and many others. It really just depends on what DSP software you want to use.

I'm interested in the mk5 as I want to solve how to play also other sound sources than computer-based sound files. So I like to solve how to connect TV Toslink and vinyl record player preamp into the computer. I like to use the computer as a preamp with FIR filter convolution capabilities for the active setup that I have.

With external digital inputs like TOSLINK and coaxial you need to consider how the interface will be clocked. If you are using a TOSLINK input you will want the clock source set to TOSLINK. Theoretically you should be able to leave the clock source set to TOSLINK when using an analog input but in my experience many TVs stop outputting when not in use so it won't work. In that case you will need to switch the clock source to the MOTU internal clock.

The other consideration is how you will do volume control. The MOTU has a small knob which can control volume of the analog outputs but has no remote volume control.

I think this can be done by routing the inputs from mk5 into the computer. Then I would direct the signals into Voice Meeter banana to be able to choose what to listen to. Then I would direct the output of the Voice Meeter to HLConvolver. This can be done with Virtual Audio Cable.
Now the tricky question is, will Motu mk5 allow me to send the output from the HLConvolver back so that the signal can be further sent through the interfaces to the DAC outputs?

I am not sure about this specific chain as I am a Linux and Mac user but conceptually it can be done (see link in my signature for examples using CamillaDSP). Your proposed chain seems a bit complicated and I would be looking for a single software solution that is capable of capturing / routing / outputting a signal from hardware devices and applying IIR / FIR processing in between.

If it can do this then mk5 can do that what Toppings MD7 and Octo dac8 can not do.

While the DM7 is more limited the Octo dac8 pro has both USB and AES inputs and is specifically designed to take an AES input, route it to a computer for processing and then play the processed signal over the analog outputs, this is called USB / AES mode. In general the Okto is much more consumer friendly than the MOTU as it has IR volume control, has no additional software than needs to be managed, trigger output, bigger display, bigger volume knob, etc.

Michael
 

anphex

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Forum Donor
Joined
May 14, 2021
Messages
656
Likes
863
Location
Berlin, Germany
If I''ve read right on MOTUs site, their driver software "Pro Audio" has more a less a whole DAW as a driver where you can do routing, mixing, EQ, Delay and AUX sends. I think even VST.

So you would :
- create a pre-fader aux send to 4 bus channels (let's impagine a 4-way-crossover for now).
- route the output of each bus to a dedicated line output of the MOTU
- hook up the outputs to your amps and hook the amps up to pathway of your choice
- measure FR, time alignment, distortion, basically anything you want to change or optimize
- put a delay and EQ (or convolution) on those channels to match your desired response
- measure again to verify

If MOTU can do this, you're basically opening the box of pandora as you can design a whole new speaker out of an existing one (or actually build your own personal active speaker).

I'll wait for the answer of MOTU ... or anyone who actually owns a MOTU to verify the driver software is capable of this.
 

mdsimon2

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Oct 20, 2020
Messages
2,440
Likes
3,275
Location
Detroit, MI
If I''ve read right on MOTUs site, their driver software "Pro Audio" has more a less a whole DAW as a driver where you can do routing, mixing, EQ, Delay and AUX sends. I think even VST.

So you would :
- create a pre-fader aux send to 4 bus channels (let's impagine a 4-way-crossover for now).
- route the output of each bus to a dedicated line output of the MOTU
- hook up the outputs to your amps and hook the amps up to pathway of your choice
- measure FR, time alignment, distortion, basically anything you want to change or optimize
- put a delay and EQ (or convolution) on those channels to match your desired response
- measure again to verify

If MOTU can do this, you're basically opening the box of pandora as you can design a whole new speaker out of an existing one (or actually build your own personal active speaker).

I'll wait for the answer of MOTU ... or anyone who actually owns a MOTU to verify the driver software is capable of this.

I assume you are referring to this -> https://motu.com/proaudio/index.html? As far as I can tell MOTU uses the term "pro audio interface" to mean "AVB interface", the Ultralite Mk5 is NOT an AVB interface and is NOT referenced on that page.

1673371074682.png


The Ultralite Mk5 runs Cuemix 5 which is very limited from a DSP perspective and will not be able to implement a simple active crossover, let alone anything more complicated. Again, there are other software packages that can do so.

Michael
 
OP
manisandher

manisandher

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Nov 6, 2016
Messages
643
Likes
598
Location
Royal Leamington Spa, UK
I am very interested in this since I want to try to activate my speakers in the hope of using the chassis more efficiently.

So I hook up a Motu or any other decent multichannel interface to my PC, use Roon (or other tools?) to assign each crossover path to an output, hook it up to their respective amps and the start designing the crossover/filters?

Edit: I just sent MOTU a mail asking if their devices and drivers are capable of this.

I explain how I've done it using Roon here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...tive-crossover-using-roon.29882/#post-1046894

Mani.
 

192kbps

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Apr 3, 2019
Messages
510
Likes
559
Maybe you can experience Dolby 5.1.4 with MK5 now!
 

Music1969

Major Contributor
Joined
Feb 19, 2018
Messages
4,508
Likes
2,734
I believe the Motu now plays nice with all Linux kernel 5.10 and later

True ?
 
OP
manisandher

manisandher

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Nov 6, 2016
Messages
643
Likes
598
Location
Royal Leamington Spa, UK
With the latest update from SOtM (firmware 0.5.4 and kernel 6.1.33), the smS-200 now works perfectly with the MOTU UltraLite-mk5... at all sample rates up to its maximum 192k. (Only 44.1k and 48k rates worked previously.)

Mani.
 

spalmgre

Member
Joined
May 22, 2019
Messages
48
Likes
14
Location
Helsinki
I'm 48 years old and my biological hardware is likely more of a limiter

Hearing and listening are not the same thing. You will better understand and be able to recognise different sounds, quality, nuances etc. than a young listener would. Like wine or food, quality is better understood once you have some milages under your belt.
 

Trell

Major Contributor
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
2,752
Likes
3,278
Hearing and listening are not the same thing. You will better understand and be able to recognise different sounds, quality, nuances etc. than a young listener would. Like wine or food, quality is better understood once you have some milages under your belt.
Uh huh.
 
Top Bottom