Linkwitz LX521.4 - new build and impressions

[fluid]

It also looks like the slightest push could have the top part tumbling to the ground, do people weigh them down or attach them to the bass unit in some fashion?

They are actually the opposite. They could be tipped over forwards or backwards when the woofer box is not in place, however the bridge is shorter than the front or back of the woofer box and when it is in place it is almost impossible to actually tip it over as it bangs into the woofer box. With two 10" drivers in each one the woofer box weighs somewhere in the realm of 30Kg and is not easily shifted. The same applies to left right movement.

In comparison to a bookshelf speaker on a stand they are quite toddler and animal safe.

 

[JP]

Not sure where that pic came from, but per the original design the top baffle isn't attached to the bridge. Not that it's easy to tip regardless.

 

[fluid]

If a person is not happy with some particular aspect of one of the Linkwitz designs, he/she has no one to blame but themselves for not doing the proper homework beforehand.

I don't agree with this assessment. It is not always possible to know up front what you want or need and whether a speaker system will deliver that regardless of how much homework you do beforehand. It is equally as pointless to blame the designer for picking a set of compromises that don't work for you but do work for them.

Working out your own preferences can be a long and expensive journey. I understand why people ask for opinions ahead of time to try and reduce the chances of picking wrong. Most worthwhile endeavours have some speed bumps along the way, feel lucky if you mange to pick right the first time.

 

[fluid]

Not sure where that pic came from, but per the original design the top baffle isn't attached to the bridge. Not that it's easy to tip regardless.

The original advice was to screw it down when you found the right angle.

I built mine with two bolts, one of which could run in a routed section of a circle to allow it swing either side and then be tightened down

Image was from here

https://www.linkwitzlab.com/What_is_new_at_linkwitzlab.htm

 

[JP]

Well after Siegfried was gone.

 

[suttondesign]

FWIW, I cannot fathom anyone being unhappy with a properly-built 521.4. The wide-open quality of the sound, with a recessed but accurate soundstage, is addictive.

 

[fluid]

Well after Siegfried was gone.

Frank Brenner has been selling those CNC kits for a very long time, SL was still around for a long time after that.

 

[fluid]

I think maybe what you're eluding to is usage experience actually modifying an owner's priorities over time.

That is not what I mean but it happens. What I mean't is that you don't really know what you want until you have experienced it. In my own experience the difference between good and I can't find fault with it was not actually that far. So now good is not good enough. The problem being that what tipped it to great for me might be meh to you.

 

[JP]

Frank Brenner has been selling those CNC kits for a very long time, SL was still around for a long time after that.

Oh, I know. I've been a victim of his work.

 

[Jokerbre]

Yeah, I gotcha.

The LX521 system is not without issues. I think probably the main one (for me) is the workload on the upper-midrange driver. With the system as-designed that particular driver has the toughest job of any of them.
As you've seen on the OPLUG, I have ginned up a hybrid system that uses higher electrical roll-off rates for the midrange pair. To me, that solves the irritating sound the upper-midrange driver sometimes has. But, it does take away some of the seamless blending of the two drivers.
SL was aware of this from day one, but he made the decision to operate the drivers as you see. The early version LX521.3 was actually superior to the LX521.4 in this context because it included further HP filtering at 120Hz.

Not true. Each speaker is not loaded and works in the comfort zone. On the simulation you can see Xmax for FU10-4 at 10W and 50W

 

[fluid]

I have quite a bit of experience.

Certainly, your user name here makes more sense when spelled backwards

 

[fourdogslong]

Is there a concensus on what sounds better between the ASP.4, the ASP v2.0 and a minidsp for these Linkwitz speakers?
I prefer the idea of using an analog crossover, because I am pretty satisfied with my actual DAC and would rather not put more AD/DA conversion in the chain.
I use the RME ADI-2 Pro FS R. It doesn't have anough ouputs to do the crossovers in the computer and I think I'd rather not anyway because I'm a sound engineer and prefer to keep latency as low as possible.

 

[suttondesign]

there’s no consensus. the asp is best for people who need plug-n-play, assuming they buy it ready-made. the minidsp route is nice because you can tailor individual drivers to your desires or needs. i have a big dip in my hearing in one ear from 1-3khz, so i can adjust the upper mid on that side. i can also high pass the speakers above 30hz to avoid bottoming out. my subs take over there. the minidsp flex is a nice device and has been stable and carefree for me.

also, the asp I used with the Orions had awful noise issues, picking up fields from nearby electronics.

 

[JP]

i can also high pass the speakers above 30hz to avoid bottoming out

How loud do you listen? I haven't managed to bottom mine yet.

 

[mamsterla]

Is there a concensus on what sounds better between the ASP.4, the ASP v2.0 and a minidsp for these Linkwitz speakers?
I prefer the idea of using an analog crossover, because I am pretty satisfied with my actual DAC and would rather not put more AD/DA conversion in the chain.
I use the RME ADI-2 Pro FS R. It doesn't have anough ouputs to do the crossovers in the computer and I think I'd rather not anyway because I'm a sound engineer and prefer to keep latency as low as possible.

I have an ASP.4 and decided to get an ASP v2.0. I think they are very similar in sound - I like the balanced output from the ASPv2.0 and have been able to use a very short run of BlueJeans cables between the ASPv2.0 and my ATI AT528NC amp. I have not heard the miniDSP implementation, so I cannot comment. The main difference in the v2.0 is that the circuit optimization eliminates cascaded active components. I find both of the ASP to be transparent to the sound. If you choose the newer Linkwitz MG lower mid drivers, the ASPv2.0 makes sense (I went that route which was my primary reason for the change).

 

[AudioJester]

Digital crossover allows so much more and continues to sdvance/develop. The hardware/software is not limited to one speaker. ASP assumes perfect quality control in cabinet construction and driver performance. There will be cabinet resonances, level matching, room effects that need attention. While you can do it at a speaker level, you get much better results at a individual driver level imho.
Then you can adjust crossover points, types, slopes etc. and lots more.

In this day and age I find it difficult to see the point of a fixed analogue network for a multiway active speaker

 

[fourdogslong]

Thank you guys.
I see your point, basically the MiniDSP allows more tweaking, personnalization and room correction so the advantages possibly outweighs the disadvantages of the additionnal AD/DA conversion.
The ASP on the other side offers a simpler plug and play operation and the v2.0 allows the midrange driver upgrade.

The kit from Linkwitz is a lot more expansive than the one from Madison, especially with the midrange upgrade and ASP v2.0 so that is to be considered as well. The LX521.4 is not a cheap DIY project.
The LXStudio or Lxmini+2 might fit my budget more and possibly my room too. My room, which is under construction, will be 15' x 19' including a 2' deep bass trap on the back wall, so it's 17' deep of usable space + 2' of bass trapping, with 8' ceiling. So it seems to be right on the lower limit of what is recommended for the LX521.

I would use the speakers for enjoyment as well as for work (mixing/mastering). Would you recommend one over the other if budget is not an issue? (It is but I could wait longer if the LX521 is really worth it).

 

[jhenderson0107]

Thank you guys.
I see your point, basically the MiniDSP allows more tweaking, personnalization and room correction so the advantages possibly outweighs the disadvantages of the additionnal AD/DA conversion.
The ASP on the other side offers a simpler plug and play operation and the v2.0 allows the midrange driver upgrade.

The kit from Linkwitz is a lot more expansive than the one from Madison, especially with the midrange upgrade and ASP v2.0 so that is to be considered as well. The LX521.4 is not a cheap DIY project.
The LXStudio or Lxmini+2 might fit my budget more and possibly my room too. My room, which is under construction, will be 15' x 19' including a 2' deep bass trap on the back wall, so it's 17' deep of usable space + 2' of bass trapping, with 8' ceiling. So it seems to be right on the lower limit of what is recommended for the LX521.

I would use the speakers for enjoyment as well as for work (mixing/mastering). Would you recommend one over the other if budget is not an issue? (It is but I could wait longer if the LX521 is really worth it).

I use the LX-521s in a large living room with vaulted ceiling, placed ~5 ft from the front walls and they work well in that context. I don't recommend the LX-521s unless you can position them at least 4 ft away from front and side walls (with even more distance preferrable). I use monopoles (Genelec) in my family room, whose dimensions are similar to the room you're constructing.

 

[fourdogslong]

I use the LX-521s in a large living room with vaulted ceiling, placed ~5 ft from the front walls and they work well in that context. I don't recommend the LX-521s unless you can position them at least 4 ft away from front and side walls (with even more distance preferrable). I use monopoles (Genelec) in my family room, whose dimensions are similar to the room you're constructing.

Since this will be a dedicated room, 4 feet from the side walls is definitely doable, same for the front wall. I already have another set of standard monitors but the open baffle has been intriguing me for some time now.

Even though I could leave 4 feet between the speakers and the walls, would you still recommend the LXmini+2 instead? I'm open to other DIY suggestions as well but I don't want to deviate from the thread topic too much.

 

[suttondesign]

How loud do you listen? I haven't managed to bottom mine yet.

not that loud, but there are movie soundtracks which have infrasonics