KEF R/Reference Meta vs Perlisten

[aoaaron]

KEF R/Reference Meta vs Perlisten
Any thoughts?

I was edging towards Perlisten S series for fronts, and then R for surrounds. Want dynamic impactful speaker with good imaging. Coming from Arendal 1723.

 

[sweetchaos]

We have spinorama's for both companies:

A collection of loudspeakers measurements

www.spinorama.org

A collection of loudspeakers measurements

www.spinorama.org

Sorted by price descending.

Are you looking at towers or bookshelves?
Do you have multiple seats or do you primarily care about the center seat?
Will you be adding subs?
What room correction software/hardware will you be using?
How big is your room, in dimensions?
How loud do you want to play?

I really don't think there's a wrong option here, seeing how Kef and Perlisten are both excellent choices.

 

[aoaaron]

We have spinorama's for both companies:

A collection of loudspeakers measurements

www.spinorama.org

A collection of loudspeakers measurements

www.spinorama.org

Sorted by price descending.

Are you looking at towers or bookshelves?
Do you have multiple seats or do you primarily care about the center seat?
Will you be adding subs?
What room correction software/hardware will you be using?
How big is your room, in dimensions?
How loud do you want to play?

I really don't think there's a wrong option here, seeing how Kef and Perlisten are both excellent choices.

I'm looking at 2x S5M, 1x S5C, 4x R4S.

I have one row of seats. I have 2x Monolith THX 15 which I'll need to swap out for bigger subs (2x JTR RS1 most likely). I use DIRAC. Its 5Mx8.5M and will likely get bigger.
I play at reference.

From my limited research, the Perlisten seem better suited.
The KEF seem to have a bigger soundstage which some may prefer and more forgiving vertical directivity but the Perlisten look like they will sound better with less room treatment and, maybe importantly, will be more dynamic and generate much more SPL easier without running into distorsion.

 

[Battlebeast]

I'm looking at 2x S5M, 1x S5C, 4x R4S.

I have one row of seats. I have 2x Monolith THX 15 which I'll need to swap out for bigger subs (2x JTR RS1 most likely). I use DIRAC. Its 5Mx8.5M and will likely get bigger.
I play at reference.

From my limited research, the Perlisten seem better suited.
The KEF seem to have a bigger soundstage which some may prefer and more forgiving vertical directivity but the Perlisten look like they will sound better with less room treatment and, maybe importantly, will be more dynamic and generate much more SPL easier without running into distorsion.

I don't know about the Perlisten being able to play louder with less distortion. The Kef Reference 1 does better than the Perlisten S4b in Erin's compression testing.

I would expect the Kef Ref 3 and 5 to be equal to or better than the equivalent Perlisten towers in this regard.

 

[ahofer]

I was just looking at the spinoramas for the KEFs, Perlistens and one of my sets ofspeakers, the Revel F228be. I have to say, I'm still not conversant in interpreting the Sound Power DI and Early Reflections DI curves and making the appropriate inferences about room size or other matters. Anyone want to take a shot?

 

[quattro98]

The in-wall speaker that corresponds to the Reference 5 Meta is THX Dominus certified. If output is a major concern, then the Ci5160REFM-THX, Reference 5 Meta, and Reference 4 Meta should all be ok.

Ci5160REFM-THX

The in-wall Ci-Reference architectural speaker Ci5160REFM-THX is KEF's first in-wall speaker to be THX® Certified Dominus among the very few that can achieve this ultimate standard worldwide. Together with a 12th generation Uni-Q driver array with Metamaterial Absorption Technology (MAT™)...

us.kef.com

As Erin’s testing with the Reference 1 Meta showed, the speaker’s distortion and compression are quite low. That’s for the smallest one in the line.

 

[aoaaron]

I don't know about the Perlisten being able to play louder with less distortion. The Kef Reference 1 does better than the Perlisten S4b in Erin's compression testing.

I would expect the Kef Ref 3 and 5 to be equal to or better than the equivalent Perlisten towers in this regard.

I see 1db distortion in kef and 0.5db in perlisten.

Or am I wrong here ?

Could @Matthew J Poes chime in with which brand would likely handle peak spl better?

I’m ideally looking at s5m vs reference 3 as I can get both for similar price

 

[aoaaron]

The in-wall speaker that corresponds to the Reference 5 Meta is THX Dominus certified. If output is a major concern, then the Ci5160REFM-THX, Reference 5 Meta, and Reference 4 Meta should all be ok.

Ci5160REFM-THX

The in-wall Ci-Reference architectural speaker Ci5160REFM-THX is KEF's first in-wall speaker to be THX® Certified Dominus among the very few that can achieve this ultimate standard worldwide. Together with a 12th generation Uni-Q driver array with Metamaterial Absorption Technology (MAT™)...

us.kef.com

As Erin’s testing with the Reference 1 Meta showed, the speaker’s distortion and compression are quite low. That’s for the smallest one in the line.

Wow in wall is a nice option but I’d rather have on wall or surrounds. I’ve changed my room and upgraded so many times, I can’t commit to in walls.


This is a really tough decision between perlisten and kef reference.

 

[thewas]

I see 1db distortion in kef and 0.5db in perlisten.

Or am I wrong here ?

Could @Matthew J Poes chime in with which brand would likely handle peak spl better?

I’m ideally looking at s5m vs reference 3 as I can get both for similar price

The comparison of the two plot is not unambiguous, for example at 102 dB the KEF has shows less compression above 80 Hz but more below 60 Hz. For high listening levels I would make my choice rather dependent on multitone distortion measurements which unfortunately at that time Erin didn't perform.

 

[aoaaron]

The comparison of the two plot is not unambiguous, for example at 102 dB the KEF has shows less compression above 80 Hz but more below 60 Hz. For high listening levels I would make my choice rather dependent on multitone distortion measurements which unfortunately at that time Erin didn't perform.

Thanks mate.

I guess the takeaway point is they are both fairly similar which is a decent bit of information?

 

[thewas]

Thanks mate.

I guess the takeaway point is they are both fairly similar which is a decent bit of information?

You are welcome, without multitone distortion measurements I cannot give a definite answer, but my guess is that they could be quite similar as both being three-way with good engineering and drivers.

 

[aoaaron]

Thanks. The issue I have is the kef are what are my on wall surround options? The reference bookshelves are way too big

 

[quattro98]

Thanks. The issue I have is the kef are what are my on wall surround options? The reference bookshelves are way too big

Perlisten is one of the few companies which has on wall options. The S4s & R4s are nice. In KEF, if you want an on-wall option, the R8 Meta is elegant. I will likely wall mount the R3 Meta (similar in size/shape to the Reference 1 Meta). The LS50 Meta is an option too. For all of the bookshelves, you need to make your own mounting solution. If our space allowed, I would do in-wall.

 

[aoaaron]

Perlisten is one of the few companies which has on wall options. The S4s & R4s are nice. In KEF, if you want an on-wall option, the R8 Meta is elegant. I will likely wall mount the R3 Meta (similar in size/shape to the Reference 1 Meta). The LS50 Meta is an option too. For all of the bookshelves, you need to make your own mounting solution. If our space allowed, I would do in-wall.

The issue with r3 meta for me is it won’t look very elegant. I guess perlisten have a slightly better speaker ecosystem for home cinema.

I assume the s4s and r4s will strongly better the r8 meta

 

[Vacceo]

I'd say that the fair comparison would be Perlisten S to KEF Reference and Perlisten R to KEF R series.

For the top choices, I guess the difference should be small, dispersion pattern aside.

For the R to R series comparison, perhaps Perlisten is a bit ahead due to frequency range. Still, even if better, how much compared to KEF?

 

[aoaaron]

I'd say that the fair comparison would be Perlisten S to KEF Reference and Perlisten R to KEF R series.

For the top choices, I guess the difference should be small, dispersion pattern aside.

For the R to R series comparison, perhaps Perlisten is a bit ahead due to frequency range. Still, even if better, how much compared to KEF?

Thanks. Due to surround options and looks, I'll likely go Perlisten.

LCR: 2xS5M, S5C
Surrounds: 4x R4S
Atmos: 4x 1723S Height OR 4x 1961 Atmos OR 4x KEF R8.

 

[aoaaron]

thansk i got 2x S5M.

2xS5M sounds better than my entire arendal 1723 7.X.4 setup. crazxy stuff.

 

[Descartes]

Also compare pricing Perlisten is more expensive for what you pay!

 

[aoaaron]

Also compare pricing Perlisten is more expensive for what you pay!

I went for 2x s5m 1x s7c and 4x s4s
Really happy with them

 

[Impossible]

I have heard the Perlisten's a bunch of times now (in different rooms) and they come cross bright. High frequency's dont sound natural to me. So looked at the data and compared to the Kef ref 1. All credit to Erin for measuring them.

I think the Perlisten's DI is marginally better but other then that the on-axis is better on the Kef (see on axis graph). More importantly with the Perlisten there is a large steep peek starting at 5khz getting larger all the way to +5db at 10khz which I think explains the brightness and unnatural/mutated high frequency tonality.

Looking at the horizontal directivity, both for the most part are under 2db deviation but after 9khz the Perlisten starts to drop off more. Then looking at the vertical directivity after only 10deg the Perlisten really struggles. At 1khz there is a significant dip. Erin on his video said he checked this a few times to validate the data and it wasn't a measurement error. Audioholics review also mention it.

I'm no expert and if I'm not reading the data right kindly let me know.