Is Audyssey microphone a calibrated spl meter

[gelv]

Hi
This is my first post here although ive been lurking the forum for years
Im still a beginner when it comes to hifi better than people in my friend circle but a beginner compared to real audio enthusiasts

I recently came across a thread here thats discussing how to use audyssey microphone included with denon avr with REW with a calibration file from the youtube channel OCA. This made me research the difference between umik 1 vs audyssey calibration microphone But i was unable to find info wether or not the audyssey mic is a calibrated spl meter

Basically If it is then i can make use with the audyssey mic while saving money by not buying umik while also avoiding having another hardware piece at home lol
I dont do much measurements But recently ive noticing that my sound system is not as good sounding as it was years ago which made me quickly measure the frequency response with an android app where i discovered that i have a huge null from 100hz to 300hz. This started When i moved to another apartment but this is a subject for another thread.

Is the audyssey microphone a decently calibrated spl meter?
Thank you

Also unrelated question what are tags that i can use on this thread?

 

[staticV3]

Is the audyssey microphone a decently calibrated spl meter?

Since the audyssey microphone has a 3.5mm analog output and depends on an external mic pre and ADC with unknown gain and sensitivity, it cannot be a calibrated SPL meter on its own.

The UMIK-1 in contrast has its own mic pre and ADC with known sensitivity and gain, and can therefore be a calibrated SPL meter out of the box.

The audyssey microphone you'd have to calibrate yourself with a known good SPL reference, if you want to use it with REW to measure SPL.

You do not need an SPL calibrated microphone to measure frequency response btw.

 

[gelv]

Thank you for the reply.
I was mostly weighing up pros vs cons for audyssey mic vs umik. In case i wanted to use audyssey mic as spl meter in the future. It seems umik is the best all around solution.
But the question rises how would i do a measurement in REW without knowing the spl? When i start a measurements inget a pop up asking me to calibrated dcb which i assume is the same as spl?
Im currently going through my things trying to find the audyssey mic to try it with REW but If its not worth the effort then i might get umik instead but then i would invest in something that i would only use for REW measurements or for measuring spl.

Would the audyssey mic with calibration file be enough for home use? My goal is to set up a proper atmos home theater system in the future but also maybe set up studio monitors for desktop use but that would be in the far future. If its enough for home use then what would be the pros for geting umik instead? Beside it being properly calibrated?

 

[staticV3]

But the question rises how would i do a measurement in REW without knowing the spl? When i start a measurements inget a pop up asking me to calibrated dcb which i assume is the same as spl?

Simply click on Continue anyway:

Would the audyssey mic with calibration file be enough for home use?

Yeah I think so.

If its enough for home use then what would be the pros for geting umik instead? Beside it being properly calibrated?

The UMIK-1 outputs directly via USB, so there's no messing around with sound cards or audio interfaces to to get the sound into REW.

 

[gelv]

This is very helpful
I take it that its no good connecting the audyssey mic to pc or laptop headphone jack port since? Noise floor? But also not a flat frequency range is that correct?

Then for someone who does not have usb interface it would be best to use umik instead?

I have another somewhere related question. When using the audyssey mobile app to create a housecurve the app is not letting me move the pins freely. The app most to the left has a step downward slope. I tried to change the crossover in the app for each piece but the pins still do not want to move to the far left because it is snapping to the grid? Its seems to be impossible to avoid the downward slope or move pin to the far left.
I also tried setting it to full range with no result

 

[staticV3]

I take it that its no good connecting the audyssey mic to pc or laptop headphone jack port since? Noise floor? But also not a flat frequency range is that correct?

Your laptop headphone jack port may have supremely low noise and flat frequency response, or it may not. I don't know. I'd have to test it. It's an unknown variable.

 

[staticV3]

If I wanted to use the Audyssey microphone for room measurements, then I'd buy an Apple headphone adapter and a CTIA splitter to connect it to my PC:

 

[gelv]

I might try that since i own both items needed

I assume it would be impossible to measure computer soundcards frequency response without something that is calibrated?
If impossible then i might stick with umik since it would be impossible to know if the measurements are correct.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

I might try that since i own both items needed

I assume it would be impossible to measure computer soundcards frequency response without something that is calibrated?
If impossible then i might stick with umik since it would be impossible to know if the measurements are correct.

That is not impossible and quite easy. Just do a loop test ie connecting the output to the input of your soundcard. Switch of any “soundtools” which might run on Windows. Get REW and run a sweep. You might be positively surprised about its linearity.

BTW: Why do you need that? Remember the UMIK1 does the ADC. Or do you have doubts the sound card output is skewed?

 

[gelv]

That sounds interesting!
Since its an internal soundcard I suspect its microphone input frequency response is skewed. I might be nitpicking but since I havent found measurements for internal soundcards I am worried it might be skewed.

Im currently setting up the audyssey mic to test it. All I need is for the neighbours to calm down lol.

 

[dlaloum]

Hi
This is my first post here although ive been lurking the forum for years
Im still a beginner when it comes to hifi better than people in my friend circle but a beginner compared to real audio enthusiasts

I recently came across a thread here thats discussing how to use audyssey microphone included with denon avr with REW with a calibration file from the youtube channel OCA. This made me research the difference between umik 1 vs audyssey calibration microphone But i was unable to find info wether or not the audyssey mic is a calibrated spl meter

Basically If it is then i can make use with the audyssey mic while saving money by not buying umik while also avoiding having another hardware piece at home lol
I dont do much measurements But recently ive noticing that my sound system is not as good sounding as it was years ago which made me quickly measure the frequency response with an android app where i discovered that i have a huge null from 100hz to 300hz. This started When i moved to another apartment but this is a subject for another thread.

Is the audyssey microphone a decently calibrated spl meter?
Thank you

Also unrelated question what are tags that i can use on this thread?

The Audyssey mic is "batch calibrated" - ie: they have a generic calibration file for that design, based on measurements made of that design at the design stage....

Individual variation during production can vary from that calibration but the variance in most cases (90%+) is slight and of no consequence.

AVR's have the calibration file pre-loaded, and a number of people have devised their own calibration files for these which are floating around on various forums. (so if you find that cal file, you can then use the Audyssey mic on your PC .... as a calibrated microphone)

 

[gelv]

All right i tried to use the mic today with REW while following a tutorial on youtube but didnt know what to choose when clicking on th spl meter button in rew. The youtuber clicked on C weight but he was usung umik. What shoukd i use if i am using audyssey mic?

 

[gelv]

Also should i use java or asio? Do i need asio?

 

[staticV3]

What shoukd i use if i am using audyssey mic?

Do you have an SPL reference to calibrate your Audyssey mic with?
If not, then the SPL Meter in REW is pretty much useless to you.

Also should i use java or asio? Do i need asio?

You do not need ASIO. Ideally, you should use Java EXCL.

 

[gelv]

Thank you for the helpful comments. I tried measuring my system today. I was surprised when it turned out that I had an exponentially rising curve starting from about 10khz at 95db up to but continuing over 20khz at 115 db but continuing to rise. I then tried using the audyssey calibration file from OCA YouTube channel but it didn’t help as the rising curve started from 10khz at 85 db up to 20khz at 104 db where it plateaued.

What is going on here? Is my mic broken? Ive read about drivers used by famous brands that go over 40khz but usually those dont starting rising from around 10khz. This could explain why the system sounds really bright but this made me consider umik since i cant be 100 that my audyssey mic is not broken. Could have been because i was little rough when i unboxed it the first time i got the avr.

How should i go forward?

 

[gelv]

I tried to do a measurement an inch from the wonder but i still got the exponentially rising curve starting from around 10khz
Anyone got any advice

 

[HarmonicTHD]

I tried to do a measurement an inch from the wonder but i still got the exponentially rising curve starting from around 10khz
Anyone got any advice

I think you are chasing your tail with trying to use the Audyssey mic. As said several times before, there is no knowledge on its default frequency response and the actual calibration needed. The rising curve can well be part of the Audyssey mic FR and Denon internally compensated for that (or might not, we simply don’t know).

Just get an UMIK1. Problem solved.

 

[No. 5]

Don't worry about what you're seeing above 10kHz, especially if you are pointing the mic at the speaker. In addition to the mic being uncalibrated, it's intended for diffuse field measurements so it will have a rising high frequency response if it is used for a free field measurement. Likewise with absolute SPL readings, without a reference you have no way of knowing if what it says is 100dB is actually 100dB. However, being able to get relative SPL readings between channels is useful. For example, it is important to know if all your channels are producing the same SPL level but less important to know exactly what that level is.

The youtuber clicked on C weight but he was usung umik. What shoukd i use if i am using audyssey mic?

C Weighting applies some high and low frequency roll off, not for the microphone being used but for what the user wants or needs to see. Different weighting curves have their uses, but if all your are doing is checking SPL levels between channels, it doesn't matter all that much which one you use.

What is going on here? Is my mic broken?

It doesn't sound like it to me. A microphone like Audyssey's is going to use an inexpensive but very consistent capsule (as will the UMIK-1). It's probably close to spec, but spec is probably pretty loose above 10kHz. Without a reference the actual response is unknown, however, it's pretty safe to assume that it's flat between 100Hz and about 2kHz. Below 100Hz there is likely some roll-off, and above 2kHz it'll have a rising response (in free field conditions) and potentially a peak at the very high end. It is still a useable microphone and will tell you important things about your system. Especially at low frequency where being able to see the major response variations are makes addressing them a whole lot easier.

If you don't intend on making many measurements and don't want another piece of gear sitting around your house or to spend the money on something you're not going to use a lot, stick with the Audyssey mic. Just don't take its results as gospel (especially at high frequency).

 

[gelv]

you are propably right
But If i go with umik but the rising grensle curve still shows up then what could be the cause
Is it possible it caused by the room
Its a living room with concrete walls with tapestry
What to do to solve the eleveted treble

 

[staticV3]

Is it possible it caused by the room
Its a living room with concrete walls with tapestry

You can try a gated measurement to remove room effects:
https://www.minidsp.com/applications/acoustic-measurements/loudspeaker-measurements#anchor-2

That way you can see if it's the room or the speaker.

What to do to solve the eleveted treble

Use EQ.