I have four speaker cables here and they all sound different!

[HarmonicTHD]

Ok. I already knew that folks here believe that there are no audible differences between cables.
I didn't come on here for a debate. That is boring and a waste of my time.
I thought I'd ask how one could explain these things.
A few things -

To someone telling me I didn't do something I know that I did, I have no response other than - I am not interested in proving anything to anyone. If you don't believe me, wonderful. No need for your input as there is nowhere to go from there.

If this is not going to be a pleasant exchange, I'll just quit the site now. I did not join to argue or debate.
I asked some questions and if these questions are beyond what anyone here can fathom, then perhaps I am in the wrong place after all.
I didn't come on here to prove whether or not I heard something.
I asked if anyone had any idea what is causing the differences.
If you do not believe it is possible, then there is no need to respond. Again, that would be a waste of time.



Doesn't worth that much around here... Many ASR members are in Audio for twice that long and don't say it out loud.

I didn't say it to be of any value "around here." I said it to provide context and give a bit of background and to say that I didn't just start listening yesterday. I was not trying to prove anything to anyone. I thought this was going to be a friendlier place. you needn't reply again.


I did NOT forget to mention the rest of my system. I left it out specifically to avoid complicating the question. It is largely irrelevant as this test was performed using 5 different amplifiers. The amps which were better and more resolving are the ones I could hear the greater differences between cables.
I am not listing off all of the equipment for everyone's approval. They range from vintage to contemporary and are in the $2-6k range.
My preferred system is of a very high quality and the only system I've ever heard to match it was the $85k

I didn't say it was a controlled, double blind study.
It was just a blind test in my home, performed over a few months as it is a lot of work.
I was not told which wires were changed or if any were changed.

I did NOT say I could tell which wires were which brand. Other than one set of wires, the rest were all new, so new to my ears.
There were actually six different wires, but two were the same brand. Audioquest.
I also didn't mention brand names in order to keep bias out of the replies here.
What I was able to discern EVERY time according to the notes of the person doing the changing, was when a wire was changed and the ones which I described in a certain way were consistently described in those specific ways. There was one exception. The change between the Audioquest FLX DB/ 16/4 and 16/2, which I did not count as it is the same wire, which we threw in there just to see if there was an audible difference in going thicker with the same wire. There was none that I could tell consistently.

Etc. means just that. A bunch of descriptors that I see are typically scoffed at on this site based on the couple of hours of reading(I did just find this site a couple of hours ago).
I chose not to include the list of them. Tight bass, extension in the highs, decay, etc. etc. etc.
Some of the wires had noticeably more bass.

I was happy to list the wires and get into the details of the tests, but it is clear this is not my cup of tea.

I thought this was going to be a discussion.
Not a contentious back-and-forth.
Ugh. What a turn-off.

Bye.

We don’t believe, we know and that discussion has been held a gazzillion times (use the search functions and you find the explanation you asked for) so it is very very boring and the myth debunked. If you want to ignore the science and facts - fine. I guess you are then indeed in the wrong forum, although the forum title gives strong hints what this is forum is about. So why come here in the first place? Oh you are still around - didn’t you wanted to cancel your account?

 

[Willem]

Well, to be fair, he now writes that he used a pretty serious protocol, even if the description remains a bit vague. My hypothesis remains that the explanation can be found in the test methodology.

 

[Deleted member 50060]

We can have a discussion if you describe your testing methodology, and you have not yet done that. I am a research scientist, and I can tell you if there is an unexpected result, the first thing you do is look very carefully at your observational methodology. Please do realize, however, that this is not a new problem, and all previous claims that decent cables used under domestic conditions can have a sonic signature have been refuted. Strong claims demand strong evidence.

I would have been happy to describe any and all aspects of the testing methodology and conditions. But you're not understanding that there is more to discussion than interrogation. If we're having a debate, I am all for interrogative logic and sound reasoning. But again, I didn't come on here for a debate. You say this claim demands strong evidence. But I didn't come on here to prove anything. I came on to have a discussion. Perhaps it is because I don't spend time on forums and waste my life away staring at screens that I actually expected this to flow more like a conversation in REAL LIFE. I don't sit down with someone and begin speaking by reciting a dissertation with an intention of proving a theory.
I shared some things I'd experienced and would have been happy to share more if any of you had any social skills whatsoever.
you lot are too high-strung.
Conversations don't happen like this in the real world.
I am enjoying my audio. Always have. That's all that matters. I'm a musician and recording engineer and I know what I hear. I understand that the sense of hearing involves the brain. Pathetic to state obvious things and look for such petty arguments. It was an expression. I can see here that there is an assumption that if it's not all explained, there is nothing more to it.
Not everyone comes onto a forum to write for hours so you can be satisfied and still dismiss their claims.

If you believe there is no difference is sound between cables, no problem. I didn't come on here to convince anyone of anything.

This will be my last reply. This place is a wasteland.

 

[JSmith]

I thought this would be more a conversation and not an interrogation.

It's not an interrogation... please stop trying to play the martyr. Take a step back for a moment... everyone is passionate about their views.

I did an actual blind test.

Please provide the results, controls used etc. We are very interested in results and data here, not anecdotes.

I know what I hear.

All good... we just expect proof here is all, rather than your word.


JSmith

 

[VintageFlanker]

I thought I'd ask how one could explain these things.
A few things -

Easy. Your imagination. Done.

you needn't reply again.

As far as I can recall, I don't take instructions, especially from just registered members...

Bye.

 

[Deleted member 50060]

We don’t believe, we know and that discussion has been held a gazzillion times (use the search functions and you find the explanation you asked for) so it is very very boring and the myth debunked. If you want to ignore the science and facts - fine. I guess you are then indeed in the wrong forum, although the forum title gives strong hints what this is forum is about. So why come here in the first place? Oh you are still around - didn’t you wanted to cancel your account?

I actually messaged the forum an hour ago asking to have the account canceled, but I continue to receive these message popups. I have not read all of the forum as I just found it hours ago, if you'd read what I wrote. I also wrote why I came on here, but I guess you skipped that part, too.
Why reply just to be argumentative?
What kind of person does that?
you're pathetic.

 

[Deleted member 50060]

Easy. Your imagination. Done.

As far as I can recall, I don't take instructions, especially from just registered members...

View attachment 219129

 

[Deleted member 50060]

Actually, the site won't close my account. And I don't want to have my membership adding to the reported numbers of this cesspool.

It's so funny to watch people react in such extreme ways over their views. What a miserable existence you must have.

Easy. Your imagination. Done.

As far as I can recall, I don't take instructions, especially from just registered members...

View attachment 219129

Actually, the site won't close my account. And I don't want to have my membership adding to the reported numbers of this cesspool.

It's so funny to watch people react in such extreme ways over their views. What a miserable existence you must have. Life must be hard for you, having to make yourself feel better by being rude to strangers on the internet.

 

[Absolute]

Depending on output impedance of the amplifier and electrical characteristics (capacitance?) of the cable you can experience an effect on frequency response, often high in frequency where the output impedance on the amplifier is highest.

Sticking a microphone close to the tweeter and measuring the frequency response of the speaker with different cables may tell you what you hear.

 

[Katji]

I actually messaged the forum an hour ago asking to have the account canceled, but I continue to receive these message popups.

The notifications indicator cannot be visible unless you have the website open. If you mean email notifications, go to the Settings and switch if off.

 

[VintageFlanker]

It's so funny to watch people react in such extreme ways over their views. What a miserable existence you must have. Life must be hard for you, having to make yourself feel better by being rude to strangers on the internet.

OK, enough of this passive-agressive shit.

Maybe it's time for @BDWoody and @AdamG247 to show you the door.

 

[Willem]

But why get so angry if people question your observation? There is no scientific evidence thus far that such differences actually exist. So before we try to explain the reported differences we have to be sure that there are in fact any. If not, there is nothing to explain. That is what scientific discussion is all about. And something else, I don't want to be ridiculed as pathetic etc, that is neither elegant nor appropriate in scientific discussion.

 

[Vacceo]

I actually messaged the forum an hour ago asking to have the account canceled, but I continue to receive these message popups. I have not read all of the forum as I just found it hours ago, if you'd read what I wrote. I also wrote why I came on here, but I guess you skipped that part, too.
Why reply just to be argumentative?
What kind of person does that?
you're pathetic.

You don't set the rules on a public forum you don't run.

 

[JSmith]

JSmith

 

[Rednaxela]

It's not an interrogation... please stop trying to play the martyr.

Exactly.

Be thankful for people here not rushing into the conversation you say you’re after. It would have been the most unscientific thing for them to do.

Your first question should have been did I do this test right, instead of how can we explain my findings.

 

[deniall83]

What the hell did I just read? OP, you came in here asking a question and you got an answer you didn't like. Doesn't give you the right to start acting like a child. Grow up. It's 100% placebo effect. Get over it.

 

[posvibes]

When 1 type of cable does this for you audibly so and you tested only 6 then, most likely, you could maybe get more 'improvements' with other cables. That must be bothering you in the back of your mind as all cables you tested were different they all should do so ?

That right there is the basis for a business plan presented to production and marketing. Well put, the nightmare and the dream of audiophilia.

 

[LTig]

I would have been happy to describe any and all aspects of the testing methodology and conditions. But you're not understanding that there is more to discussion than interrogation.

How can we have a discussion if you don't supply the details? There are cases were a cable can change the sound, and this depends not only on the cable (impedance) but also on the power amplifier (output impedance, stability against complex loads) and the speaker (impedance over frequency).

If we're having a debate, I am all for interrogative logic and sound reasoning. But again, I didn't come on here for a debate. You say this claim demands strong evidence. But I didn't come on here to prove anything. I came on to have a discussion.

This may be your point of view. In my point of view you stated a very strong claim while knowing in advance that it would be questioned with scrutiny, and now when people ask for details you enter a kind of blocking mode. This is not what how I understand the word discussion.

Perhaps it is because I don't spend time on forums and waste my life away staring at screens that I actually expected this to flow more like a conversation in REAL LIFE.

One should not enter an internet forum and expect a real life conversation.

I don't sit down with someone and begin speaking by reciting a dissertation with an intention of proving a theory.
I shared some things I'd experienced and would have been happy to share more if any of you had any social skills whatsoever.

See above. This is a science oriented forum were you cannot expect that claims agains proven science will be left undisputed.

you lot are too high-strung.
Conversations don't happen like this in the real world.

See above.

I am enjoying my audio. Always have. That's all that matters.

Nobody disputes that, and its true for all of us. And it doesn't matter at all if you prefer one cable over the other. You cannot expect though that your personal preference shall be viewed as fact ("I prefer this cable so it must be better").

I'm a musician and recording engineer and I know what I hear. I understand that the sense of hearing involves the brain. Pathetic to state obvious things and look for such petty arguments. It was an expression. I can see here that there is an assumption that if it's not all explained, there is nothing more to it.

This is true because claims for audible differences in cables have shown again and again and again to being false insofar as the experience was genuin but influenced by other things apart from the electronic features of the cable.

Not everyone comes onto a forum to write for hours so you can be satisfied and still dismiss their claims.

If you believe there is no difference is sound between cables, no problem. I didn't come on here to convince anyone of anything.

This will be my last reply. This place is a wasteland.

I sense a lot of frustration. I'm not sure what you really did expect with your first posting.

Just as a note: The easiest way to get rid of the loudspeaker cable "problem" is to get rid of them in the first place. Active speakers are the future of high end audio. As recording engineer you probably know this anyway.

 

[BDWoody]

I'm a musician and recording engineer and I know what I hear.

Of course you are.

It's so funny to watch people react in such extreme ways over their views.

It really is. We watch people show nearly fatal levels of butthurt because their erroneous perceptions aren't being validated.

Let me help you find the way out.

I'll just close this thread...nothing useful here.

 

[Astoneroad]

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