Genelec 8030C Studio Monitor Review

[somebodyelse]

No - KH-80 would be more my size but back when I was tempted the iPad-only DSP app put me off. Other options have appeared since.

 

[dimxbox]

Just a little bit of subjective impressions from an Adam A5x vs Genelec 8030c comparison for the current A5x owners that are looking for replacement monitors and are considering the Genelecs. I realize that all this is only valid for my own audio system, room and ears and others may have a completely different experience.

1. The Adams' bass seems more inward and hard hitting whereas the Genelecs' bass seems more outward and fluent/rounded. Bass-wise I find electronic music to somewhat favor the Adams while "analog" music to somewhat favor the Genelecs.
2. The Adams' mids are not as transparent as the Genelecs', I caught myself noticing new details in old tracks specifically in the mids on the Genelecs. The Genelecs' mids definitely feel more proper. And that is why if I were to choose between the two, I'd go for the Genelecs.
3. The Adams' highs seem more detailed, structured than the Genelecs' and it can be both good and bad. I don't believe the extra detail is always intended, sometimes it is just some distortion that only makes the track more harsh/sibilant. On Metallica's Master Of Puppets I definitely don't want the Adams' high frequency exuberance, it is out of place and does the tracks no good. I prefer the sound of a trumpet of the Adams though.
4. I find the Adams really good for low volume listening, you don't feel a lack of detail or scale regardless of the volume. The downside is - to me they become a bit too harsh as I crank them up, a bit too bass-heavy and shrill. The Genelecs on the other hand encourage me to raise the volume and they don't get as tiring as the Adams that way. Could be totally room-dependent, but that is what I hear in my room.
5. I would describe both speakers as very capable overall and choose the Genelecs for their better mids. I find some tracks to sound preferable on the Adams still, especially on low volumes.

I also have an Adam A5X and a Genelec 8030B (B version has a class A/B LM4780 amplifier), but I think the sound should be similar.
I didn't expect a significant advantage from the Genelec 8030B, as they have a simpler woofer and tweeter, but in terms of soundstage and detail, they are far superior to the Adam A5X.
Yes, the A5X has clearer high frequencies, but the Genelec 8030B's are perceived as more accurate and pleasant to listen to.
As for the lower frequencies, Adam A5X has less of them, they are completely cut off at 50 Hz, less separated (less detailed), which makes it seem that there are more of them.
The midrange of Adam A5X is on par with Genelec 8030B, both are very good.
I was impressed by the soundstage of the 8030B compared to the Adam A5X, the sounds seem to be formed out of thin air, I don't feel that the sound comes out of the speakers.
The background hiss of the 8030B is slightly less than that of the A5X, I can feel it if I bring my ear closer than ~20 cm.

 

[thewas]

I also have an Adam A5X and a Genelec 8030B (B version has a class A/B LM4780 amplifier), but I think the sound should be similar.
I didn't expect a significant advantage from the Genelec 8030B, as they have a simpler woofer and tweeter, but in terms of soundstage and detail, they are far superior to the Adam A5X.
Yes, the A5X has clearer high frequencies, but the Genelec 8030B's are perceived as more accurate and pleasant to listen to.
As for the lower frequencies, Adam A5X has less of them, they are completely cut off at 50 Hz, less separated (less detailed), which makes it seem that there are more of them.
The midrange of Adam A5X is on par with Genelec 8030B, both are very good.
I was impressed by the soundstage of the 8030B compared to the Adam A5X, the sounds seem to be formed out of thin air, I don't feel that the sound comes out of the speakers.
The background hiss of the 8030B is slightly less than that of the A5X, I can feel it if I bring my ear closer than ~20 cm.

The AxX series wasn't really good, here are some insights from an ex ADAM engineer https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...wered-studio-monitor.22860/page-2#post-761372

 

[dimxbox]

The AxX series wasn't really good, here are some insights from an ex ADAM engineer https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...wered-studio-monitor.22860/page-2#post-761372

Spoiler: offtop

Yes, the Adam A5X has some problems, but still, the A5X was a good model for the price.
I find the F series, which he praises, to be the most disappointing in terms of sound quality, compared to the F5 and T5V.

I believe that Genelec is better and more thoughtfully designed by engineers. Another level.

 

[dimxbox]

Of course the smell came from the chinese components inside. I chose the genelec mainly cause is made of metal thinking since is not MDF (which can off gas) then i wouldn't be having any smells, but i was naive thinking their components would be non chinese lol

Genelec has always had high-quality components from well-known manufacturers, capacitors Vishay (USA) and Samwha (Korea), a Swedish transformer...

Spoiler: photo Genelec 8030B

Perhaps in the case of 8030C - not so much

 

[Cigibroke]

Can i connect 8030 speakers directly to my pc's headphone output via below 3.5mm to twin xlr cable? or should i buy a decent dac for any reason? Thanks

pro snake Adapter Cable XLR - Mini Jack

Adapter Cable XLR male - mini jack 2x XLR male to stereo mini jack 3.5 mm, Outer sheath diameter: 8.0 mm, Length: 3 m, Colour: Black, Made in Germany

www.thomann.de

 

[Ellebob]

You can connect it to the headphone jack. You them rely on the PC's DAC.

 

[dimxbox]

Can i connect 8030 speakers directly to my pc's headphone output via 3.5mm to twin xlr cable? or should i buy a decent dac for any reason? Thanks

You can buy a cable and connect it to a regular headphone input. For example, a cable like this Cordial CFY WMM-Long (Amazon)
But these monitors deserve more, even a budget DAC (SMSL M300SE as an option) will greatly improve the sound than the built-in sound card of a laptop.

 

[Cigibroke]

You can buy a cable and connect it to a regular headphone input. For example, a cable like this Cordial CFY WMM-Long (Amazon)
But these monitors deserve more, even a budget DAC (SMSL M300SE as an option) will greatly improve the sound than the built-in sound card of a laptop.

so as i understand that, if i buy a decent dac-preamp like rme adi-2 dac fs or even smsl m300se, this will be "better sound creation" on genelec 8030 speakers, is that correct?
(and then i can connect the dac through xlr balanced output to speaker's xlr input)

 

[dimxbox]

so as i understand that, if i buy a decent dac-preamp like rme adi-2 dac fs or even smsl m300se, this will be "better sound creation" on genelec 8030 speakers, is that correct?
(and then i can connect the dac through xlr balanced output to speaker's xlr input)

That's absolutely right. But the monitors themselves (the speaker system) are more important in sound reproduction. Therefore, it is important to find this optimal balance.

I listened to the Audalytic AH90 on my Genelec 8030Bs, and I liked the sound, which was as neutral as possible. This is my next purchase.

 

[Cigibroke]

That's absolutely right. But the monitors themselves (the speaker system) are more important in sound reproduction. Therefore, it is important to find this optimal balance.

I listened to the Audalytic AH90 on my Genelec 8030Bs, and I liked the sound, which was as neutral as possible. This is my next purchase.

so my question at this point is; which one is the better for genelec 8030 speakers? smsl m300se - audalytic ah90 or rme adi-2

 

[dimxbox]

so my asking at this point is; which one is the better for genelec 8030 speakers? smsl m300se - audalytic ah90 or rme adi-2

This is a tricky question that depends on your preferences and budget.
My experience: The biggest difference was after replacing the sound card of my MacBook Pro 2021 with an smsl m300se, but I wanted to try something more high-end, so I listened to several options within the ~$500 budget.

I listened in the demo room with my 8030Bs and settled on a few DACs: Audalytic AH90, Topping DX70 Pro Octa, SMSL SU9 Ultra and SMSL DO400.

 

[Cigibroke]

This is a tricky question that depends on your preferences and budget.
My experience: The biggest difference was after replacing the sound card of my MacBook Pro 2021 with an smsl m300se, but I wanted to try something more high-end, so I listened to several options within the ~$500 budget.

I listened in the demo room with my 8030Bs and settled on a few DACs: Audalytic AH90, Topping DX70 Pro Octa, SMSL SU9 Ultra and SMSL DO400.

thanks for your advices, i will go to rme i think

 

[LTig]

You can buy a cable and connect it to a regular headphone input. For example, a cable like this Cordial CFY WMM-Long (Amazon)

Yep.

But these monitors deserve more, even a budget DAC (SMSL M300SE as an option) will greatly improve the sound than the built-in sound card of a laptop.

No. There may be bad DACs in soundcards or Notebooks but for their shortcomings in frequency response, noise and distortion to become audible they must be really bad. Remember that the input impedance of the monitors is very high compared to headphones so distortion would be much lower than when driving headphones.

I'd say as long as the computer output is loud enough to feed the monitors a separate DAC will not lead to a significantly better sound quality - chances are that in a level matched blind test no audible differences are found. Been there done that - my SOTA RME ADI-2 PRO fs does not sound better than my old Edirol UA25 when feeding HD800 or Genelec 8020a. I may have cloth ears though ...

 

[dimxbox]

No. There may be bad DACs in soundcards or Notebooks but for their shortcomings in frequency response, noise and distortion to become audible they must be really bad. Remember that the input impedance of the monitors is very high compared to headphones so distortion would be much lower than when driving headphones.

I'm writing from my own experience. Compared to the MacBook, the difference is very noticeable in terms of tonal balance and the amount of information I hear.
I have a PRESONUS AudioBox 22VSL, Fiio K3, SMSL M300SE, PRESONUS sounds very bad, it steals all the details at high frequencies.

 

[Cigibroke]

Yep.

No. There may be bad DACs in soundcards or Notebooks but for their shortcomings in frequency response, noise and distortion to become audible they must be really bad. Remember that the input impedance of the monitors is very high compared to headphones so distortion would be much lower than when driving headphones.

I'd say as long as the computer output is loud enough to feed the monitors a separate DAC will not lead to a significantly better sound quality - chances are that in a level matched blind test no audible differences are found. Been there done that - my SOTA RME ADI-2 PRO fs does not sound better than my old Edirol UA25 when feeding HD800 or Genelec 8020a. I may have cloth ears though ...

so should i just connect 8030 speakers directly to pc's headphone output via 3.5mm stereo jack to twin xlr cable? Is this way enough for good sound and safe for genelec 8030 speakers?

 

[LTig]

I'm writing from my own experience.

Of course, and so do I.

Compared to the MacBook, the difference is very noticeable in terms of tonal balance and the amount of information I hear.
I have a PRESONUS AudioBox 22VSL, Fiio K3, SMSL M300SE, PRESONUS sounds very bad, it steals all the details at high frequencies.

If the output impedance of the DAC is high this can result in high frequency loss. For the PRESONUS this is not the case, and looking at its output specs it should sound transparent. Did you compare blind and level matched to not more than 0.1 dB? Or is it broken? Do you have a decent ADC to test it?

 

[LTig]

so should i just connect 8030 speakers directly to pc's headphone output via 3.5mm stereo jack to twin xlr cable?

Yes.

Is this way enough for good sound and safe for genelec 8030 speakers?

I think so, it's certainly worth a try before investing in a DAC. It is also safe if you keep in mind that the volume setting of the PC is close to zero before switching on the 8030s.

 

[xaviescacs]

It is also safe if you keep in mind that the volume setting of the PC is close to zero before switching on the 8030s.

That's actually my main concern when driving speakers from a computer, how easy is to miss an unattenuated volume (100% level). I prefer to have some external volume control, whether a DAC or a preamplifier with attenuation.

 

[Miguelón]

This is a review and detailed measurements of the powered Genelec 8030C Professional Monitor (speaker). It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $700 each.

The 8030C has the same look of Genelec speakers of the last decade or so:

View attachment 74148

To me it looks more "cute" than serious piece of gear.

There are a few dip switches in the back and control its operation:

View attachment 74149

I set all the switches on the right to off which tailor the tonality of the speaker. I left the gain at -6 dB as supplied by the owner.

Measurements that you are about to see were performed using the Klippel Near-field Scanner (NFS). This is a robotic measurement system that analyzes the speaker all around and is able (using advanced mathematics and dual scan) to subtract room reflections (so where I measure it doesn't matter). It also measures the speaker at close distance ("near-field") which sharply reduces the impact of room noise. Both of these factors enable testing in ordinary rooms yet results that can be more accurate than an anechoic chamber. In a nutshell, the measurements show the actual sound coming out of the speaker independent of the room.

I used over 800 measurement point which was sufficient to compute the sound field of the speaker. Measurement axis is the recommended upper part of the woofer ring, not my usual tweeter axis.

Temperature was 78 degrees. Measurement location is at sea level so you compute the pressure.


Spinorama Audio Measurements
Acoustic measurements can be grouped in a way that can be perceptually analyzed to determine how good a speaker is and how it can be used in a room. This so called spinorama shows us just about everything we need to know about the speaker with respect to tonality and some flaws:

View attachment 74150

The on-axis (black) is what we hear the most and we want that to be as flat as possible. Such is the case here with a slight dip in the 2 to 4 kHz.

The inclusion of a wave guide (dished out surround on the tweeter) means that width of the woofer radiation is better matched to that of the tweeter (they would be wildly different otherwise as one is operating at its top end, but the other at its bottom).

We can see an off-axis response that is excellent sans the same dip which has deepened a bit more:
View attachment 74153

Putting the two together and this would our predicted in-room response in far field standardized room:
View attachment 74151

All great other than some energy lose in that 2 to 4 kHz range. And a minor one at that.

Speaker Dispersion Measurements
Let's measure how wide the response is before we lose 6 dB of sound strength (red):
View attachment 74154

Using that metric we have 60 degrees to either side of the speaker which is good. This means you don't have to sit right at tweeter axis if you don't want. This is useful in near-field operation where you are going to move around some and angle of your ear to monitor can change a lot.

Using 3-D "heatmap" of the same we get:

View attachment 74156

Often speakers have this kind of response but start to narrow more at we get past 10 kHz. Not so here. Directivity width is maintained much more to upper ranges of the response. So you get a bit more high frequency energy than you would with a speaker that narrows more.

And here is vertical:
View attachment 74157

Unlike the more expensive Genelecs with coaxial drivers, vertical directivity is not nearly as good but this is very typical. We have rather large variations with that single "eye" above our axis so try to stay more or less at the tweeter height (or tilt it up so it points at you).

While we are on pretty pictures, I thought I also dig in and see what is up with that dip in 2 to 4 kHz:

View attachment 74162

Looks like there is more woofer energy than tweeter there. But otherwise very clean.

Here is the individual driver responses:

View attachment 74164

Speaker Distortion Measurements
Let's start with our standardized distortion measurements at 86 and 96 dB SPL @ 1 meter with room effect taken out with our Klippel measurement system:

View attachment 74165

At low volumes at least (left graph), I am impressed that we see much less bass distortion than we typically see.

At 96 dB SPL, the situation naturally gets worse and distortion is not as controlled. Here is the actual levels as opposed to percentages at 96 dB SPL:

View attachment 74166

If you look to the top left, you see that distortion is below the fundamental signal which is good. Often I have that exceeding the level of the signal itself!

We now switch instruments to my Audio Precision for more distortion drill down:

View attachment 74167

At lower test SPL of 86 dB SPL, distortion level is more or less the same as recently reviewed Revel M105 non-active hi-fi speaker. But if we increase the level, the Genelec pulls ahead in bass (solid pink):

View attachment 74170

In mid-range though, the Revel (dashed orange) still does better.

Next test is amplitude compression. Here we compare whether the speaker produces less sound pressure at higher levels than lower ones. An ideal speaker would keep getting louder forever. A real speaker has stiffness which increases non-linearly and so reduces output. Same thing happens with the "motor" (voice coil action within magnetic field) gets weaker as the woofer travels father from its rest position. The combination of these factors and any electronic limiters in these active speakers (if any) will reduce the output linearity:

View attachment 74175

I am continuing to refine this test and here, I added a second frequency of 50 Hz. We see that there is strong limiting at 50 Hz relative to 200 Hz normal test frequency. So the notion of "how loud this speaker plays" is highly dependent on the content. The more low frequencies you have, the more compression you get. In this case we have a 6 dB difference between 50 and 200 Hz.

You all are a fan of multitone (32) tests so here it is as a comparison to a Behringer B2030P:
View attachment 74176

The Genelec is producing much less intermodulation distortion in bass, confirming what we found before, but also in tweeter. Both however produce similar amount of distortion in the 500 to 1.5 kHz region.

Comparing the Genelec 8030C at two output levels gives us:

View attachment 74177

We mainly see a rise in distortion in the same region stated above. Unfortunately that is the most audible region to us. Hopefully the music you play provides good bit of masking.

Finally here is the spectrum of a 100 Hz tone:

View attachment 74178

I measured my room noise (not shown) and it was about half as much as what you see in the spectrum of the distortions. So even the 10th harmonic is representing proper distortion levels that are above room noise. In other words, mere act of playing a 100 Hz tone/note, will create distortion well into area of our hearing that is most sensitive.

On the other hand, the second and probably third harmonic help to increase the perception of amount of bass there is.

There are so many distortion mechanisms in speakers that we have a lot more work left to fully characterize them. So expect this measurement section to keep evolving as I find more and better ways to measure these non-linearities.

Speaker Listening Tests
I set up the Genelec 8030C on my workstation desk on a 5 inch high stand that is tiled up a few degrees. I pointed the speaker right at me and started to play. Instantly all of my reference music tracks "translated" to this speaker and sounded just beautiful. My track list is varied from Blues, to Rock and classical and all without exception sounded great.

Not wanting to leave well enough alone , I decided to play with EQ. I added my usual low frequency cut of 30 Hz with 36 dB slope. To my surprised it lowered the bass some. I played around with but could not find a setting where it did some good but did not impact bass response. I also went after one of the small resonances in the response and had the same issue.

I went after the dip in 2 to 3 kHz and there, the difference was a very positive one:

View attachment 74181

That increased detail nicely with no negative side-effects at all.

Once there, the response was exceptional. As often it happens, I could not stop listening to my music tracks. An example is this high-res download:
Naxos 8.559757
John CORIGLIANO (b. 1938)
Conjurer* • Vocalise†
Evelyn Glennie, percussion*
Hila Plitmann, soprano†
Electronics produced and performed by Mark Baechle†
Albany Symphony • David Alan Miller


View attachment 74182

Can't quite find the track I was playing but here is a sample:

The classic Roger Waters demo album was to die for:
View attachment 74184

All was not well though. On tracks with deep bass such as the Animals from Dunwells produced severe distortion at anything but modest levels:

Bass response was impressive and deep but turn up the level and you are greeted with static and clear distortion.

Conclusions
Some audiophiles like to say there is a dichotomy between accuracy and good sound in speakers. They need to listen to a speaker like Genelec 8030C to change their mind forever. Accuracy is what we need to reproduce all that is in our recording without permanently boosting and lowering some frequencies/tones.

Importantly, accurate speakers provide similar pleasure when listening to well recorded music. Despite having very different pedigrees, I find the Genelec 8030C just as nice sounding as my Revel speakers. There is an incredible "rightness" that clicks when the response is kept flat in 200 to 4 kHz or so. Delight sets in and you melt in your chair, enjoying well recorded music and appreciating the art instead of speaker bringing attention to itself. There is no "oh that sounds bright" or "why is the vocal recessed."

I wish you could be here to experience in excellent in sound reproduction that these well engineered speakers following best acoustic research and science provide.

No, one size does not fit all. The 8030C is a near-field monitor that opts to bring you more bass as the expense of limited headroom in deep region there. Fortunately that limitation does not protrude often so the capabilities it provides are near perfect. Considering its price, I think it is a great find.

Needless to say, I highly recommend the Genelec 8030C monitor.

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As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.

Two reviews on a weekend. Did you read that? I said weekend. While you all are enjoying reading these reviews, I have to work! I demand double pay for overtime work. Please reach in your wallet and donate using: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-support-audio-science-review.8150/

Thanks for the super detailed review, had convinced me to buy a pair of 8030cpm! Very happy with the results.

I never understood the advice to don’t use studio monitors for pleasure listen: in my personal experience they are the most truthful and insight listening one can achieve.

Particularly I find Genelecs very musical specially on vocals and piano (connected to my Kawai ES 920 sound barely as a grand), a massive improvement over my Yamaha HS7, despite being 5 inches woofer.

I actually listening 90% or more of the music via Tidal, can you or any other recommend me a good streamer? Preferably with usb output to use it in combination with a DAC.

Congratulations for all your efforts on reviewing monitors and other musical gear, very happy to joining ASR one month ago!