Many people say many things. You do you.
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Drop Dan Clark Audio Aeon Closed X
- Thread starter TheHighContemplator
- Start date
I'm struggling to understand your above response? Are you somehow attempting to get me to feel that my posting my impression was invalid and not appropriate?
If I read between the lines
"Many people say many things"
It seems that you may be saying, it doesn't really matter what others say, there is no reason to make note and post what I have read. It really was just me writing about what I have read.
"You do you"
This feels rather disconnected from any point at all. It may be you simply saying, whatever buddy nobody cares, don't post just be quiet. Maybe you meant something else?
Now I'm not going to pretend that my post that prompted your reply was overly useful, or substantive, but even so, I am confused why you replied the way you did. Do you doubt that I have read many posts over the years where people have noted that they find DC Audio headphones lack dynamics?
I have almost 13000 posts at head-fi and I don't know how many thousands I have read. I posted what I believed to be a valid observation. Did you feel like my post attacked you and somehow diminished the enjoyment you get from your choice of headphone?
Anyway. I really don't think that there was anything wrong with my post.
I allow there may be more dynamic headphones than the Noire, from frequent testimony by others who have also tried Focal's, some Audeze models, etc. However, I don't want them, because with my Noire and very dynamic recordings, I already find it difficult to find a volume setting that allows for a correct average SPL, as well as useful volume for quiet passages, without also causing uncomfortably loud SPL peaks. I have read similar comments by others.
However, peeling back the onion, it is likely the case that not everyone hears that same thing. For example, some people are more sensitive to, say, treble peaks than others. I would welcome comment by anyone who is familiar with the research on this, if any.
Further, I see discussions of the "punch" of any given headphone model, with various definitions of it that are not simply a matter of the dynamic range of SPL's, but also involve transient response and related time-domain attributes; I gather that this kind of commentary suffers from the lack of any consensus definition of what is being measured or heard.
My thought is that this aspect of headphones is not clearly defined, and that there may be significant individual variation in perception and preference. This suggests you might want to find some recordings that you find dynamic and exciting, and then find a venue or two to compare different models with the same music. Or use the 'buy, try, and if necessary, return' mail-order strategy that some ASR members report using. In other words, let your own ears be your guide.
Boltman92124
Active Member
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- Feb 14, 2023
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What do you think of the Emotivas? I have a pair but nothing to compare them to except Senn Momentum. I do like them after not liking them much early on. They need EQ imo.
gfinlays
Senior Member
Without EQ, the Emotivas are very bass heavy IME. With equalisation, they're a really good listen. Soundstage is decent, not as wide as the Aeon Closed X though. I don't enjoy them as much as my 2 vintage pairs of Sennheiser HD580, but being very open-backed I can't use them around my Mrs. in the evening. The Emotivas are semi-closed, so good for evening use when she's around. The Dan Clark's are on my bedside rig so I can listen when she wants to sleep.
Boltman92124
Active Member
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Right. EQ is a must but then they really sound good I think. That Graphene stuff or whatever. A silky sound. The Sivga Phoenix was reviewed here, which is similar. The included cable is nice too. No micro stuff. Plus a hard case.
New and happy owner of a used AEON closed X. Using them with Dekoni sheepskin pads. These boost the bass a little so they sound fine to me without EQ. Did try that too.
The only thing I do not like is the look of the carbon baffle. Hoped to be able to replace those, but they are glued.
As I could not find any here are some pictures of the inside.
The only thing I do not like is the look of the carbon baffle. Hoped to be able to replace those, but they are glued.
As I could not find any here are some pictures of the inside.
Hard to find any info online about how worn out pads affect these headphones, so here's what I noticed when I replaced my earpads after a full year of several hours a day usage. I should've replaced them a few months ago when I started noticing issues, but I'm poor, they're like $60, and I didn't know the warranty would cover replacement pads until I asked DCA about it.
I've A/Bd my new and old pads a few times and here's all the differences I noticed. My ears aren't really trained for being able to pick out what frequencies are causing problems, I can only describe issues with some of the technicalities and tonal balance.
Worn out pads issues:
- Smaller soundstage. It slowly got that way over time, this issue didn't stand out to me until it got pretty bad
- Less precise imaging - sort of a "5-blob effect" where there's hotspots in the soundstage around panned left, mid-left, center, mid-right, and panned right, rather than instruments being placed evenly between those 5 points.
- Treble overall feels a bit less sharp, especially mid-to-upper treble. This and the imaging issue are possibly related?
- Bass reduction. I had to turn my bass shelf down by about 2 dB when I got new pads.
- Mids change shape in a weird way. This is what eventually drove me to ask DCA about it, synths and guitars just weren't shaped "correctly" anymore and it was a constant frustration.
Other things I noticed with new earpads that I didn't necessarily notice as "issues" on the old pads:
- Extremely clear reverb trails again. I loved this about these headphones when I got them but eventually the pad wear made reverb much less clear, though I never noticed. New pads brought it back.
- Better bass intangibles. Like I mentioned before I had to turn my bass shelf down by 2dB to get it back to the same level, but kick drums in particular feels a bit more precise and impactful somehow.
- More depth to the soundstage. My possibly BS crackpot uneducated theory is that it's related to the better treble clarity/imaging, where the upper harmonics of instruments feel more correctly placed "in front" of the fundamentals creating a better illusion of depth, whereas the placement of the treble was getting a bit fuzzy on the old pads and ruining the illusion.
Hope this helps someone else decide if they need new pads or not. I had heard before that pad wear is really bad for DCA headphones, but I still wasn't expecting there to be such a huge difference. I definitely won't be waiting as long when these start to wear out.
I've A/Bd my new and old pads a few times and here's all the differences I noticed. My ears aren't really trained for being able to pick out what frequencies are causing problems, I can only describe issues with some of the technicalities and tonal balance.
Worn out pads issues:
- Smaller soundstage. It slowly got that way over time, this issue didn't stand out to me until it got pretty bad
- Less precise imaging - sort of a "5-blob effect" where there's hotspots in the soundstage around panned left, mid-left, center, mid-right, and panned right, rather than instruments being placed evenly between those 5 points.
- Treble overall feels a bit less sharp, especially mid-to-upper treble. This and the imaging issue are possibly related?
- Bass reduction. I had to turn my bass shelf down by about 2 dB when I got new pads.
- Mids change shape in a weird way. This is what eventually drove me to ask DCA about it, synths and guitars just weren't shaped "correctly" anymore and it was a constant frustration.
Other things I noticed with new earpads that I didn't necessarily notice as "issues" on the old pads:
- Extremely clear reverb trails again. I loved this about these headphones when I got them but eventually the pad wear made reverb much less clear, though I never noticed. New pads brought it back.
- Better bass intangibles. Like I mentioned before I had to turn my bass shelf down by 2dB to get it back to the same level, but kick drums in particular feels a bit more precise and impactful somehow.
- More depth to the soundstage. My possibly BS crackpot uneducated theory is that it's related to the better treble clarity/imaging, where the upper harmonics of instruments feel more correctly placed "in front" of the fundamentals creating a better illusion of depth, whereas the placement of the treble was getting a bit fuzzy on the old pads and ruining the illusion.
Hope this helps someone else decide if they need new pads or not. I had heard before that pad wear is really bad for DCA headphones, but I still wasn't expecting there to be such a huge difference. I definitely won't be waiting as long when these start to wear out.
Jimster480
Major Contributor
I also felt like my Aeon Closed sounded much better after new pads. Definitely can agree on the bass and treble being off.
The rest I am not sure about but I didn't really A/B it so closely.
SuperWookie
Member
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- Dec 4, 2025
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- 4
I know this is pretty late to the party, but thought I'd share my initial thoughts and feelings about these headphones now that I've had them for a little over a week. So I know I don’t have the full vocabulary to accurately describe how these amazing headphones sound, but I wanted to let others know, these are it. These are amazing headphones and even though they cost almost double what I’d be willing to pay for "good" headphones, it now feels like money well spent. Most of what I’m going to say is already known by most people in this thread since they own this headphone. This is more for people that are on the fence about getting this product and leaving my own initial review for posterity for others to hopefully help them in some way.
TLDR
These are absolutely phenomenal headphones and worth every dollar I spent on them. I can't imagine anything sounding better than this and highly recommend them if you're on the fence.
The first few days, I was just listening to my regular music I usually listen to either at home, in the car or at the gym: rock, punk, hip-hop and electronic stuff like Chemical Brothers and Juno Reactor. And stock, without EQ’ng them, they really don’t blow you away. They sound fairly thin, almost no perceptible low end and are very bright. Very clean, precise and no perceptible distortion, but nothing that would Wow you. I was not happy or blown away at first and was even contemplating returning them. But over the last week, I’ve been working hard on understanding it’s FR, so I can know where to cut and boost, as well as just familiarize myself with EQ (I’m using Peace with Equalizer APO), how it works and what it does to a headphones sound. I’ve used Robb099999’s EQ#2 and Oratory’s EQ as a starting point. Both sound much better than without EQ. But they both still lacked a lot of low end and warmth that I desire. So I’ve been messing around with editing those and creating some of my own and really discovering just how incredible this headphone can be in all sorts of different ways! I have 7 EQ’s now that I switch between depending on the type of music, haha. Each one doing something different to make certain songs sound better in my eyes.
It takes EQ extremely well and can completely change the sound very easily depending on what you do with the EQ and last night was the “Coming Out” party for these amazing headphones. I started listening to classical pieces and boy oh boy did these come alive with the right EQ settings! I actually normally prefer a slightly veiled mid-range sound (warm but flat). A healthy amount of beef on the low end and low to med highs (depends on the headphone/iem in question and what it’s inherent “sound signature” is). But when I started listening to the classical pieces and older music with instruments that are less synthesized or heavy distorted guitars, I realized some of my own EQ settings were much more geared toward hard music that sounds best loud. And listening to the classical and other music with those EQ settings sounded "veiled and gauzy". And once I switched over to Robbo and Oratory's EQ settings, an entire world of sounds blossomed in my ears! It was almost transformative.
First Mari Samuelsen playing Vivaldi’s Winter and Summer from Four Seasons. Absolutely insane! Blew my mind how much detail I could hear coming from her Violin and her bow. You can literally hear the fine grain sound of the rosin on the bow grinding on the strings of the violin. Then I moved on to Rachmaninov’s Piano Concerto no 2 played by Evgeny Kissin and it too just blew me away in it’s detail, warmth and clarity. Hearing certain piano parts that he plays at lower volume while the string sections are out front was unreal. Never heard these parts before! And I've listened to that piece hundreds of times in my life on all sorts of equipment. And hearing both the piano and the entire backing orchestra play at the same time and be able to hear both SO clearly, yet as one is eargasmic. Same with Mari playing the Vivaldi pieces. The parts where the backing strings are more out front while Mari's parts are quieter were phenomenal. I’ve never heard music sound like this and it truly is amazing. Can't wait to go through my entire catalog of Classical music I enjoy and listen to them one by one on these! I listened to the entire Piano Concerto no 2. The novelty of how amazing the music sounded through these headphones was gripping and I just couldn't tear myself away.
After listening for a bit using both EQ’s, I decided to go with Oratory’s EQ version, but up the 70hz bass level to around +4 or 5, add some warmth by boosting the 110hz region to +2-3 and then mostly left the rest alone and it made this classical music and others come to life and open up new sounds I never knew existed. It kept the excellent clarity and neutrality of the original EQ, but added that tight, precise low end that didn’t make it sound muddy or like it was bass boosted. When I put on Earth, Wind & Fire September and Let’s Groove, it was transformational! To HEAR actual basslines from the bass guitar and hear it’s attack and texture and everything while still hearing everything else so clearly was just mind blowing! I almost cried, haha. And oh my god! I never realized how spatial that song is. I’ve only ever listened to it on the car stereo system or speakers. Never through headphones and never hearing the rich lush textures, layering and spatial dimensions that are in that songs recording. Then I moved on to Donna Summer’s legendary I Feel Love, then the ultra-intense banger from The Chemical Brothers… It Began in Afrika ka ka ka ka ka ka ka and I just melted into my chair! The insanely complex layering, the grainy texture and squank of the analog synths and the pulsing, driving sampled drums was almost too much! It was euphoric to say the least. To hear that squanch of the analog synths so clearly was orgasmic. Then finally to some Tame Impala tracks just to put these bad boys through the ringer and they did not disappoint. Really good soundstage and imaging for a closed back. Nothing insane or out of the ordinary, but much better than anything I've ever listened to or owned.
I’ve never listened to any headphones that are a whole lot better than my ATH-M50x. I’ve heard some BeyerDynamic models at my local music store or Guitar Center and thought the sounded very clean, very precise, very detailed, but lacked a lot of soul, heft, warmth, and bass. And up until recently my M50x’s used to sound pretty dang good to me… until I got the Hidiz MP145 IEMs about a year ago. I have been messing around with EQ to get the best out of the M50x and it helped a lot. But after last night, I can see why Dan Clark and "HiFi" products cost so much. Why high-end audio is so much better than run of the mill. The utter lack of any distortion and hearing such a clean, precise, separated yet cohesive sound is wild. And then to tailor that sound to add some clean, fast, textured bass to the mix is just unreal. I don’t know enough about soundstage or depth to talk about how these sound intelligently. But I can say they sound much better than anything I’ve ever listened to in the past. Including my Hidiz MP145 IEM’s. I can definitely hear every single instrument on it’s own, yet part of the whole, which I’ve rarely if ever heard before. Only my Hidiz MP145 IEMs get close.
It's interesting, I feel like after listening to a bunch of music with Robbo99999’s EQ#2 settings vs Oratory’s, the main difference to my ear is that Robbo’s is more forward. The mids are flat and clear, neither scooped nor too forward, but definitely a bit brighter than warm, while the highs are clean, crisp and clear without being too bright. But it’s an overall more forward sound that isn’t as relaxed or easy to listen to for long periods of time.
As opposed to Oratory’s settings which is a bit more relaxed, yet still neutral. It’s a good amount less treble and a few parts of the mid frequencies are a bit too low for certain types of music. But it sounds very relaxed, clean and neutral. For example while listening to some of the Chemical Brothers songs A/B’ng between both, the synth squanch that comes from an analog synth sounds much more noticeable and forward with Robbo’s EQ, while it’s a tiny bit recessed but smoother and easier to listen to for longer periods of time on Oratory’s settings. But both are excellent though and I’m sure I’ll use both often. Also fyi, I took out the white filter before I even listened to the headphones, so I have no idea how much better or worse they sound with them in because everyone was saying "take them out" immediately.
Anyways, I could go on for hours about these, but don’t want to bore anyone any longer. Just thought I’d add my two cents to the thread to let others know how great these headphones are. How happy I am with them and that I highly recommend them if you’re on the fence about them.
Also, hands down the most comfortable headphones I’ve ever tried or worn. I can’t even tell they’re on sometimes! And the earcups are transformational. ALL headphones should be this shape, depth and comfort. And even though I don’t have any way to say one way or another (because I can ONLY use them with my dac/amp because I have no other way to use them), I’m pretty sure that using the SMSL DL200 DAC/Amp is a major reason they sound their best. These headphones don’t need a lot of watts/mW power, they need a lot of voltage and current. So that’s a BIG part of this headphone I think. I’ve read a lot of reviews and people that have a powerful amp always have nothing but glowing reviews for these headphones. While people that don’t are all over the place with their reviews. So make sure you get or have a powerful amp that not only has enough watts or mW, but volts and current.
Also, thank you Robbo99999 and Oratory and everyone else that has worked on these EQ settings! And thank you to everyone that left a review or shared their thoughts on these headphones. It made it very easy to make the best informed decision for me to plunk down the crazy money I spent to get them and the dac/amp needed to drive them. It was totally worth it and every evening I come home from work, relax at my computer desk, light some Japanese Incense and take a sip of my drink while listening to music through these headphones, I just let out a huge sigh. I feel SO at home listening to music through these and it truly has transformed how I hear and enjoy music. It's a shame though, as I also just purchased some Edifier R1700bt desktop speakers for my setup. They're fantastic as well, but hardly listened to them at all so far because of these Dan Clark headphones, haha. Listening to music has always been an integral part of my life, but with these, it’s like rediscovering certain songs and music in general.
I'll post my modified EQ settings here when I get home so others can try it out of they like.
TLDR
These are absolutely phenomenal headphones and worth every dollar I spent on them. I can't imagine anything sounding better than this and highly recommend them if you're on the fence.
The first few days, I was just listening to my regular music I usually listen to either at home, in the car or at the gym: rock, punk, hip-hop and electronic stuff like Chemical Brothers and Juno Reactor. And stock, without EQ’ng them, they really don’t blow you away. They sound fairly thin, almost no perceptible low end and are very bright. Very clean, precise and no perceptible distortion, but nothing that would Wow you. I was not happy or blown away at first and was even contemplating returning them. But over the last week, I’ve been working hard on understanding it’s FR, so I can know where to cut and boost, as well as just familiarize myself with EQ (I’m using Peace with Equalizer APO), how it works and what it does to a headphones sound. I’ve used Robb099999’s EQ#2 and Oratory’s EQ as a starting point. Both sound much better than without EQ. But they both still lacked a lot of low end and warmth that I desire. So I’ve been messing around with editing those and creating some of my own and really discovering just how incredible this headphone can be in all sorts of different ways! I have 7 EQ’s now that I switch between depending on the type of music, haha. Each one doing something different to make certain songs sound better in my eyes.
It takes EQ extremely well and can completely change the sound very easily depending on what you do with the EQ and last night was the “Coming Out” party for these amazing headphones. I started listening to classical pieces and boy oh boy did these come alive with the right EQ settings! I actually normally prefer a slightly veiled mid-range sound (warm but flat). A healthy amount of beef on the low end and low to med highs (depends on the headphone/iem in question and what it’s inherent “sound signature” is). But when I started listening to the classical pieces and older music with instruments that are less synthesized or heavy distorted guitars, I realized some of my own EQ settings were much more geared toward hard music that sounds best loud. And listening to the classical and other music with those EQ settings sounded "veiled and gauzy". And once I switched over to Robbo and Oratory's EQ settings, an entire world of sounds blossomed in my ears! It was almost transformative.
First Mari Samuelsen playing Vivaldi’s Winter and Summer from Four Seasons. Absolutely insane! Blew my mind how much detail I could hear coming from her Violin and her bow. You can literally hear the fine grain sound of the rosin on the bow grinding on the strings of the violin. Then I moved on to Rachmaninov’s Piano Concerto no 2 played by Evgeny Kissin and it too just blew me away in it’s detail, warmth and clarity. Hearing certain piano parts that he plays at lower volume while the string sections are out front was unreal. Never heard these parts before! And I've listened to that piece hundreds of times in my life on all sorts of equipment. And hearing both the piano and the entire backing orchestra play at the same time and be able to hear both SO clearly, yet as one is eargasmic. Same with Mari playing the Vivaldi pieces. The parts where the backing strings are more out front while Mari's parts are quieter were phenomenal. I’ve never heard music sound like this and it truly is amazing. Can't wait to go through my entire catalog of Classical music I enjoy and listen to them one by one on these! I listened to the entire Piano Concerto no 2. The novelty of how amazing the music sounded through these headphones was gripping and I just couldn't tear myself away.
After listening for a bit using both EQ’s, I decided to go with Oratory’s EQ version, but up the 70hz bass level to around +4 or 5, add some warmth by boosting the 110hz region to +2-3 and then mostly left the rest alone and it made this classical music and others come to life and open up new sounds I never knew existed. It kept the excellent clarity and neutrality of the original EQ, but added that tight, precise low end that didn’t make it sound muddy or like it was bass boosted. When I put on Earth, Wind & Fire September and Let’s Groove, it was transformational! To HEAR actual basslines from the bass guitar and hear it’s attack and texture and everything while still hearing everything else so clearly was just mind blowing! I almost cried, haha. And oh my god! I never realized how spatial that song is. I’ve only ever listened to it on the car stereo system or speakers. Never through headphones and never hearing the rich lush textures, layering and spatial dimensions that are in that songs recording. Then I moved on to Donna Summer’s legendary I Feel Love, then the ultra-intense banger from The Chemical Brothers… It Began in Afrika ka ka ka ka ka ka ka and I just melted into my chair! The insanely complex layering, the grainy texture and squank of the analog synths and the pulsing, driving sampled drums was almost too much! It was euphoric to say the least. To hear that squanch of the analog synths so clearly was orgasmic. Then finally to some Tame Impala tracks just to put these bad boys through the ringer and they did not disappoint. Really good soundstage and imaging for a closed back. Nothing insane or out of the ordinary, but much better than anything I've ever listened to or owned.
I’ve never listened to any headphones that are a whole lot better than my ATH-M50x. I’ve heard some BeyerDynamic models at my local music store or Guitar Center and thought the sounded very clean, very precise, very detailed, but lacked a lot of soul, heft, warmth, and bass. And up until recently my M50x’s used to sound pretty dang good to me… until I got the Hidiz MP145 IEMs about a year ago. I have been messing around with EQ to get the best out of the M50x and it helped a lot. But after last night, I can see why Dan Clark and "HiFi" products cost so much. Why high-end audio is so much better than run of the mill. The utter lack of any distortion and hearing such a clean, precise, separated yet cohesive sound is wild. And then to tailor that sound to add some clean, fast, textured bass to the mix is just unreal. I don’t know enough about soundstage or depth to talk about how these sound intelligently. But I can say they sound much better than anything I’ve ever listened to in the past. Including my Hidiz MP145 IEM’s. I can definitely hear every single instrument on it’s own, yet part of the whole, which I’ve rarely if ever heard before. Only my Hidiz MP145 IEMs get close.
It's interesting, I feel like after listening to a bunch of music with Robbo99999’s EQ#2 settings vs Oratory’s, the main difference to my ear is that Robbo’s is more forward. The mids are flat and clear, neither scooped nor too forward, but definitely a bit brighter than warm, while the highs are clean, crisp and clear without being too bright. But it’s an overall more forward sound that isn’t as relaxed or easy to listen to for long periods of time.
As opposed to Oratory’s settings which is a bit more relaxed, yet still neutral. It’s a good amount less treble and a few parts of the mid frequencies are a bit too low for certain types of music. But it sounds very relaxed, clean and neutral. For example while listening to some of the Chemical Brothers songs A/B’ng between both, the synth squanch that comes from an analog synth sounds much more noticeable and forward with Robbo’s EQ, while it’s a tiny bit recessed but smoother and easier to listen to for longer periods of time on Oratory’s settings. But both are excellent though and I’m sure I’ll use both often. Also fyi, I took out the white filter before I even listened to the headphones, so I have no idea how much better or worse they sound with them in because everyone was saying "take them out" immediately.
Anyways, I could go on for hours about these, but don’t want to bore anyone any longer. Just thought I’d add my two cents to the thread to let others know how great these headphones are. How happy I am with them and that I highly recommend them if you’re on the fence about them.
Also, hands down the most comfortable headphones I’ve ever tried or worn. I can’t even tell they’re on sometimes! And the earcups are transformational. ALL headphones should be this shape, depth and comfort. And even though I don’t have any way to say one way or another (because I can ONLY use them with my dac/amp because I have no other way to use them), I’m pretty sure that using the SMSL DL200 DAC/Amp is a major reason they sound their best. These headphones don’t need a lot of watts/mW power, they need a lot of voltage and current. So that’s a BIG part of this headphone I think. I’ve read a lot of reviews and people that have a powerful amp always have nothing but glowing reviews for these headphones. While people that don’t are all over the place with their reviews. So make sure you get or have a powerful amp that not only has enough watts or mW, but volts and current.
Also, thank you Robbo99999 and Oratory and everyone else that has worked on these EQ settings! And thank you to everyone that left a review or shared their thoughts on these headphones. It made it very easy to make the best informed decision for me to plunk down the crazy money I spent to get them and the dac/amp needed to drive them. It was totally worth it and every evening I come home from work, relax at my computer desk, light some Japanese Incense and take a sip of my drink while listening to music through these headphones, I just let out a huge sigh. I feel SO at home listening to music through these and it truly has transformed how I hear and enjoy music. It's a shame though, as I also just purchased some Edifier R1700bt desktop speakers for my setup. They're fantastic as well, but hardly listened to them at all so far because of these Dan Clark headphones, haha. Listening to music has always been an integral part of my life, but with these, it’s like rediscovering certain songs and music in general.
I'll post my modified EQ settings here when I get home so others can try it out of they like.
Last edited:
Robbo99999
Master Contributor
I'm glad you enjoyed my EQ of them & also Oratory's. I'm less convinced that it makes sense to have different EQ's for different types of music, I generally find the best EQ sounds good or OK on everything, and it's less hassle, so maybe you just need to narrow it down to one EQ that works on everything alright.
SuperWookie
Member
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2025
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- 19
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- 4
I could see how that would be someone’s preference. To not have to switch and just have one good one. But it’s no big deal for me and I like listening with different EQ’s. It makes everything sound new all the time and brings out certain sounds you wouldn’t hear with another EQ. Plus I listen to so many different varieties of music, and I want them to all sound a certain way. I say 7 EQ’s, but that’s just a temporary thing for now. I'm just all excited with my new toys and learning all about how to EQ and what constitutes "good sound" etc. So I'm in experimental mode. I'm sure I'll settle on 3-4 at the most eventually. I’m listening to more and more music with all the EQ’s on and trying to decide which ones I like the best for what type of music and how to make all of them a little better each time I listen.
For loud, heavy, exciting songs, I have a much more heavy, punchy, almost boomy bass with slightly recessed mids EQ that actually tilts down a tiny bit from around 200-1k. So warm. Then around 2k and above comes up. So that gives me a more V shape, that’s super dynamic and powerful sounding, but is also a bit relaxed in the upper mids and low treble so as not to be too exhausting to listen to. It sounds a bit veiled and not as open as your EQ#2 and Oratory’s. But it’s easier to listen to distorted guitars or heavy music at louder volumes when I just want to rock out hard. It sounds amazing for that type of music. Less accurate but more more visceral and exciting.
Then I have 3 of your EQ and 3 of Oratory’s as my “reference” EQ’s. So 6 total. They sound so great with Classical, Jazz, most Electronic music and music that’s not as bombastic, rocking and distorted. So one is a bit more neutral with very low levels of bass. One is a mild bass and 110hz warmth boost and one is in the +4-6 range for the bass and 110hz warmth. But I’ll probably narrow it down to just 2 of these total. So 1 of yours and 1 of Oratory’s for when I want clean, precise, learning more neutral and more along the lines of a mild Harman curve.
Then I have a “warm” EQ I made myself that sounds good with rock and distorted guitars and the like. It’s very relaxing and not as in your face as the first “rock” or heavy EQ that’s a bit more V shaped. But it’s not as good as your EQ and Oratory’s and I’ll probably delete it. It was my first attempt to create my own EQ for the headphones.
But as you know, when you get into this, you go crazy and your tastes change daily and you quickly change as time goes on. Oratory and your EQ’s are just about perfect and I think when it’s all said and done, I’ll probably only have 3-4 total EQ’s. One for heavy exciting music. And then 2 for everything else.
I don’t know if you’re familiar with this members article over on Head-Fi? His handle is: Lunatique. And he has this insanely long/detailed article on how to get perfect EQ for your headphones by doing all sorts of laborious testing. But in the end he claims it’s worth it and should result in a near perfect EQ for each individual. I think I’ll start working on this and go through this entire process just to see what it spits out in the end and how it compares to what I already like. Should be a fun project to keep me busy and out of trouble for a while.
Headphone Reviews and Discussion - Head-Fi.org
www.head-fi.org
Thanks again for all your hard work on your EQ for this headphone and other helpful information in this thread. I read the entire thing from beginning to end over the last week or so.
Cheers
Robbo99999
Master Contributor
Had a quick scan of that Headfi link: it's from 2016 for a start so things have changed since then anyway, but basically he's saying you should listen to sine sweeps and correct the peaks, but I don't think that's a great way of doing it because you don't know where the "reference level" is - you might correct the local loud peaks but the overall tonality might be wrong still. Also we don't hear all tones at equal loudness so it's not valid to correct them all to equal loudness. I wouldn't recommend that process. Instead I'd recommend starting with a Harman EQ and then adjusting the bass & treble using broad shelf filters.I could see how that would be someone’s preference. To not have to switch and just have one good one. But it’s no big deal for me and I like listening with different EQ’s. It makes everything sound new all the time and brings out certain sounds you wouldn’t hear with another EQ. Plus I listen to so many different varieties of music, and I want them to all sound a certain way. I say 7 EQ’s, but that’s just a temporary thing for now. I'm just all excited with my new toys and learning all about how to EQ and what constitutes "good sound" etc. So I'm in experimental mode. I'm sure I'll settle on 3-4 at the most eventually. I’m listening to more and more music with all the EQ’s on and trying to decide which ones I like the best for what type of music and how to make all of them a little better each time I listen.
For loud, heavy, exciting songs, I have a much more heavy, punchy, almost boomy bass with slightly recessed mids EQ that actually tilts down a tiny bit from around 200-1k. So warm. Then around 2k and above comes up. So that gives me a more V shape, that’s super dynamic and powerful sounding, but is also a bit relaxed in the upper mids and low treble so as not to be too exhausting to listen to. It sounds a bit veiled and not as open as your EQ#2 and Oratory’s. But it’s easier to listen to distorted guitars or heavy music at louder volumes when I just want to rock out hard. It sounds amazing for that type of music. Less accurate but more more visceral and exciting.
Then I have 3 of your EQ and 3 of Oratory’s as my “reference” EQ’s. So 6 total. They sound so great with Classical, Jazz, most Electronic music and music that’s not as bombastic, rocking and distorted. So one is a bit more neutral with very low levels of bass. One is a mild bass and 110hz warmth boost and one is in the +4-6 range for the bass and 110hz warmth. But I’ll probably narrow it down to just 2 of these total. So 1 of yours and 1 of Oratory’s for when I want clean, precise, learning more neutral and more along the lines of a mild Harman curve.
Then I have a “warm” EQ I made myself that sounds good with rock and distorted guitars and the like. It’s very relaxing and not as in your face as the first “rock” or heavy EQ that’s a bit more V shaped. But it’s not as good as your EQ and Oratory’s and I’ll probably delete it. It was my first attempt to create my own EQ for the headphones.
But as you know, when you get into this, you go crazy and your tastes change daily and you quickly change as time goes on. Oratory and your EQ’s are just about perfect and I think when it’s all said and done, I’ll probably only have 3-4 total EQ’s. One for heavy exciting music. And then 2 for everything else.
I don’t know if you’re familiar with this members article over on Head-Fi? His handle is: Lunatique. And he has this insanely long/detailed article on how to get perfect EQ for your headphones by doing all sorts of laborious testing. But in the end he claims it’s worth it and should result in a near perfect EQ for each individual. I think I’ll start working on this and go through this entire process just to see what it spits out in the end and how it compares to what I already like. Should be a fun project to keep me busy and out of trouble for a while.
Headphone Reviews and Discussion - Head-Fi.org
Thanks again for all your hard work on your EQ for this headphone and other helpful information in this thread. I read the entire thing from beginning to end over the last week or so.
Cheers
SuperWookie
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Oh ok. Well that's a bummer. But thanks for saving me from wasting a ton of my time. Do you or any of you know of any good ways to use tests or listening material to listen in order to try and EQ your headphones to about as close as you can to neutral or "perfect"? Or is that not possible? I ask not because I'm on some quest to get "perfect" tone or perfect neutrality from my headphones per say, but more just to have a reference point.
Like I mentioned, after using your EQ#2 and Oratory's, I can hear a distinct difference in sound in the mid to upper Mids and low Treble. Your's is brighter, more open and a bit too forward for my liking. But... has EXCELLENT detail and clarity. When I listen to certain older Chemical Brothers tracks on your EQ, I can distinctly hear that squank and gritty texture of the analog synth sounds they use. It's almost like overdrive or distortion for a guitar. Hear instruments as they sound in person. Whereas with Oratory's it's more recessed and hard to hear. It's there, but not as forward. And overall your EQ is just a tad more tiring to listen to at the volumes I listen to music at (med to loud). Whereas it's more relaxed and easier with Oratory's but again, lacking that detail, clarity and sparkle of yours.
And that gets me thinking, is there a way to test your ears and find what is truly balanced with great clarity, yet still pretty neutral and not so forward and bright? Are there listening tests or things I can do to test for that kind of thing? I mean, I know I can just mess around with your EQ and probably get something I'm happy with, but for my own curiosity and knowledge, I'm wondering if there are ways I can test my hearing and find "My neutral" or "perfect" sound for these headphones? I think it would be a fun exercise to try. Plus I'm just a tinkerer and always want to learn more.
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I have these, which for whatever reason didn't please a guy who sold them to me in pristine condition for $225. As you might imagine, that's my all time steal in 50 years of audiophilia.
As far as I am concerned, one cannot define a "right" EQ because there are far too many variables. Two "not-least-of-which" are the huge tonal balance differences between recordings by the same artist and the fact that many of us find the Harman curve to be overly boosted in that 2-4 kHz range.
For instance, I am a big fan of Sarah Jarosz and have all her albums. I consider them well-recorded for the most part, and they usually sound right to me with Oratory's EQ, maybe with a slight cut in the Harman bump range. But if I listen to any of them and then start any cut from "World on the Ground", the vocals immediately sound dull and recessed, and that is consistent throughout the entire album.
That's why all that "tone controls are BAD" stuff we saw for decades in the community never made sense to me.
Fifty years of headphone listening from the original Senn HD414 through innumerable trades of in-ear and on-ears on Head-Fi has taught me this: Buy a technically excellent performing phone with low distortion then EQ it to your liking, and stop worrying about "perfection." It's not only the evil of "entirely adequate", it can well be the enemy of enjoying the music.
As far as I am concerned, one cannot define a "right" EQ because there are far too many variables. Two "not-least-of-which" are the huge tonal balance differences between recordings by the same artist and the fact that many of us find the Harman curve to be overly boosted in that 2-4 kHz range.
For instance, I am a big fan of Sarah Jarosz and have all her albums. I consider them well-recorded for the most part, and they usually sound right to me with Oratory's EQ, maybe with a slight cut in the Harman bump range. But if I listen to any of them and then start any cut from "World on the Ground", the vocals immediately sound dull and recessed, and that is consistent throughout the entire album.
That's why all that "tone controls are BAD" stuff we saw for decades in the community never made sense to me.
Fifty years of headphone listening from the original Senn HD414 through innumerable trades of in-ear and on-ears on Head-Fi has taught me this: Buy a technically excellent performing phone with low distortion then EQ it to your liking, and stop worrying about "perfection." It's not only the evil of "entirely adequate", it can well be the enemy of enjoying the music.
Robbo99999
Master Contributor
It's not easy to be sure you have total neutrality in your headphone when you're EQing it. It helps if you have some reference anechoic flat speakers that are setup well in your room on which you can listen to some of your favourite tracks - then this would indeed be what neutral is supposed to sound like - and then you compare the details & tonality of what you hear on your speakers vs your headphone EQ. That's still difficult to do, but as you get to know the tracks really well then you do things like at least getting the bass level right. You'd start with an Oratory EQ or that EQ of mine, (they're both EQ's to Harman but just using different measurements), and then just adjust bass to liking using 105Hz Low Shelf Filter, and then perhaps adjust upper treble using 10kHz High Shelf Filter. Finer adjustment than that is difficult even if you do have anechoic flat speakers that you listen to. You could maybe make some fairly small adjustments with ear gain around 2-3kHz using a fairly broad Peak Filter which is related to how forward a headphone can sound and how "shouty" it can be. But yeah, with headphones it's hard to be sure you've reached neutrality, but it helps if you have some Anechoic Flat Speakers to compare against.......if not then you can still adjust bass and the other filters I mentioned to your best liking. With headphones is best to realise those limitations rather than getting stressed about it. To get headphones totally sounding like speakers then you'd need to invest in something like the Smyth Realiser and have that setup really well, but it's expensive & a bit of a complicated process - I've also not tried it myself so can't totally vouch for how fantastic it really is, just I've heard really good things about it.
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SuperWookie
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Just wanted to say, that the more I listen to your EQ #2 and mess around a bit with certain frequencies, the more I realize yours is the best. I just adjusted the bass and treble and high mids/treble a bit and now it's absolutely phenomenal. It's very clear which one is better. Yours is much more open, clean, clear, balanced and detailed. It's neither warm nor cool. It's just about perfect. I've been A/B'ng, messing with the EQ and listening to Radiohead Live From the Basement "The King of Limbs" and Mari Samuelsen pieces and yours is so much better for these headphones. I know the bass is probably more than most of you here like, but I like a dynamic sound. Exciting. Something that is visceral and I can feel. I have this exact same EQ setup, but with a bit less low end saved as well for pieces I don't want as much bass. I'm not quite a basshead, but not too far from it, hahaha. I just love feeling and hearing some thud. Some thunder. Some slam. Some texture with my low end. Thanks again for all your work to create this. And just wanted to say I'm having fun tinkering with the EQ for this headphone and continually refining and honing in fewer choices. Trying to just narrow it down to 2-3 total EQ's.
Here's where I'm at the last 2 nights that sounds really good for almost every style of music.
Robbo99999
Master Contributor
I think you copied one of the filters wrongly - it's 568Hz not 588Hz but that shouldn't really make much difference. I do recommend you use 0.71 (or 0.707) for the Q value for your high and low shelf filters and you seem to have them at 1 instead. If you have them at 1 then it will affect frequencies above the Low Shelf and below the High Shelf, but I see that "1" is also slightly greyed out so that might be a quirk of Peace whereby it is indeed the standard Shelf Filter (meaning Q0.71) but you entered Q1 before changing it to a Low Shelf that doesn't allow input of Q. Lol, that last sentence is so complicated, it's difficult to explain - basically I'd just double check you're using the right Low Shelf & High Shelf filter selections in Peace - I'm pretty sure you can choose one that allows you to enter the Q value properly, and I recommend you use those and put Q at 0.71 (or if being pedantic 0.707). Yes, you've got loads of bass in that!
SuperWookie
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Yeah, I understand what you're saying. So that's just what Peace does when you turn on a Low or High shelf filter. It just automatically freezes the Q value. Not sure if it actually changes it to .5 or .7 or what? But what I'll do is change it back to peak, set the Q value to what you recommend and then turn it back to a shelf. There by freezing it at the value you recommend. I don't know if it will do anything, but, at least at that point I'll have done everything to make sure it's all set correctly. Thanks
And it's funny, to me, that is "controlled" bass. Not a lot. I used to listen to music with more bass, but I've realized that when it's too much, it takes over and colours everything too much. So that is actually "tame" for me, haha. Although I did just create another profile that is exactly the same, but I just lowered the bass shelf by about 1-2db, and lowered the 20, 48, 60 and 189 by about 1db. I use that setting for classical, jazz and quieter music that's not as aggressive or dynamic and it works well for that.
Cheers
Robbo99999
Master Contributor
Ok, good, I think that should be the right Q value given it greyed out the Q option, but if you like I think you can even select the Shelf Filter option that lets you change the Q - but given what I remember & what you've described then I think it's fine.
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