Dayton Audio OPAL1 speaker launches

[Rick Sykora]

The measurements for the Epique drivers seem to have some disppointingly high distortion readings in the upper bass (>3% from 550-800 Hz, ouch). Seems like a dud design despite the cool engineering that appears to have went into them:

Test Bench: The E180HE-44 Full-Range Subwoofer from the Dayton Audio Epique Line

In this article, Vance Dickason characterizes the E180HE-44 woofer, from the Dayton Audio Epique lineup. As with the E150HE from the same range, the E180HE-44 uses the patented Multiple Magnet Air Gap (MMAG) technology, invented by Enrique Stiles and patented by Step Technologies. The E180HE is...

audioxpress.com

Along with the potential leakage issue, this higher distortion disqualified these for use in Directiva projects. Have heard the RST tweeter was not as good as its predecessor either. I have a few RS28s and it was a decent tweeter.

 

[Guddu]

Could the sensitivity be listed as a typo? It is rated at half space which means at full space it would be even less sensitive.

I was curious too......
Checked with their support and they confirmed the publish specifications are correct.

 

[jaakkopetteri]

The measurements for the Epique drivers seem to have some disppointingly high distortion readings in the upper bass (>3% from 550-800 Hz, ouch). Seems like a dud design despite the cool engineering that appears to have went into them:

Test Bench: The E180HE-44 Full-Range Subwoofer from the Dayton Audio Epique Line

In this article, Vance Dickason characterizes the E180HE-44 woofer, from the Dayton Audio Epique lineup. As with the E150HE from the same range, the E180HE-44 uses the patented Multiple Magnet Air Gap (MMAG) technology, invented by Enrique Stiles and patented by Step Technologies. The E180HE is...

audioxpress.com

That's just the 7 inch, though. The E150HE keeps 3rd order HD to 1% at 500Hz, which is quite OK for a woofer that size at 94dB

 

[Bryguy]

I asked about wall placement, they said 2-2.5” minimum

2-2.5 inches minimum?

 

[Head_Unit]

Just looked at the specs, 32Hz F3

each speaker down to 30s

Specs are cute, and generally meaningless says this engineer. Independent measurements needed to confirm (though with very low sensitivity perhaps possible). The question is, can they put out enough SPL at that frequency from a 5.5" woofer and radiators to even be audible? Serious question
https://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=5147

 

[Ze Frog]

Specs are cute, and generally meaningless says this engineer. Independent measurements needed to confirm (though with very low sensitivity perhaps possible). The question is, can they put out enough SPL at that frequency from a 5.5" woofer and radiators to even be audible? Serious question
https://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=5147

Looking at the 5.5" Epique raw driver specifications it certainly seems plausible having had the whole output drawn down. These have high power handling according to specs, but digging around it's clear these Epique variants have or at least had a few glaring issues such as heat and being leaky coned. I wouldn't touch them myself.

 

[lewdish]

Matt Phillips is the lab tech @Parts Express posted this. Seems like there aren't any issues w/ the driver sealing & the pinholes. Anyone own a Epique driver care to comment? Supposedly the clear resin should be creating a proper seal on the cone. Another Parts Express employee also posted a video showing water sitting in the cone w/o leaking through.

 

[lewdish]

Along with the potential leakage issue, this higher distortion disqualified these for use in Directiva projects. Have heard the RST tweeter was not as good as its predecessor either. I have a few RS28s and it was a decent tweeter.

Tho the 7" one seems to be hugely differing in distortion compared to the 5.5" version used in the OPAL-1. Seems like the larger 7" one is significantly worse, Not sure why the difference is so significant, they're not purifi levels of low but the 5.5" is still quite good.

Test Bench: The E150HE-44 5.5” Full-Range Subwoofer from the Dayton Audio Epique Line | audioXpress

 

[Penelinfi]

Water isn't a good test for air leak holes. Maybe a sealed box with smoke? Dyed alcohol?

Light isn't a confirmation test. I've had carbon fibre cone drivers in the past with similar light holes

 

[Ze Frog]

Matt Phillips is the lab tech @Parts Express posted this. Seems like there aren't any issues w/ the driver sealing & the pinholes. Anyone own a Epique driver care to comment? Supposedly the clear resin should be creating a proper seal on the cone. Another Parts Express employee also posted a video showing water sitting in the cone w/o leaking through.

View attachment 364179

Interesting. Wonder if they were fixed after a certain time or was nothing wrong to start with. Seems odd the claims were made by a few different people though and a lot of the comments I saw seemed to be by at least somewhat experienced D.I.Y'ers. Always liked using Dayton Audio parts, I would rather use their aluminium coned woofer's over these though.

 

[kemmler3D]

Matt Phillips is the lab tech @Parts Express posted this. Seems like there aren't any issues w/ the driver sealing & the pinholes. Anyone own a Epique driver care to comment? Supposedly the clear resin should be creating a proper seal on the cone. Another Parts Express employee also posted a video showing water sitting in the cone w/o leaking through.

View attachment 364179

Sounds reasonable to me, and not to drag Tekton into every effing thread, but THIS is how you respond to critiques effectively. Acknowledge the weakness, explain the tradeoffs you made, why you made them, and why that makes your product special. Don't just pretend they aren't there, and DEFINITELY don't threaten to sue people who point them out.

 

[Rick Sykora]

Before he passed, Rick Craig had shared how PE quality and his interactions with them had shifted lately. At the time, we had both decided to use the ES180Ti in projects. Rick emphasized how the driver was made by a more reliable supplier than other Dayton drivers. The result of his effort was the Integrity speaker that he dedicated to Jeff Bagby. I built the prototype and shipped to Amir for review. Along the way, I acquired 4 or 5 woofers and planned to use them in a minitower design. I called Parts Express and asked about ES180 sales and longevity. I was concerned as the new Epique driver seemed very comparable. I was assured PE planned to continue to sell the ES180. The E180HE was new and had heard complaints about leaky cones. So decided to stick with the ES180.

As some of you know, my ES180 plans were for the Directiva r2 bass module. As the r2 monitor plans got delayed, I held off on the bass module. By then, the ES180 was gone without warning from Parts Express. Now am finding the SIG180 does not meet spec. So, you can see why I might be a little hesitant about Dayton drivers at this point. I hope Dayton improves, but hope is not a strategy. I share this as I truly want to see PE succeed but suspect they need a wakeup call.

 

[Bryguy]

Before he passed, Rick Craig had shared how PE quality and his interactions with them had shifted lately. At the time, we had both decided to use the ES180Ti in projects. Rick emphasized how the driver was made by a more reliable supplier than other Dayton drivers. The result of his effort was the Integrity speaker that he dedicated to Jeff Bagby. I built the prototype and shipped to Amir for review. Along the way, I acquired 4 or 5 woofers and planned to use them in a minitower design. I called Parts Express and asked about ES180 sales and longevity. I was concerned as the new Epique driver seemed very comparable. I was assured PE planned to continue to sell the ES180. The E180HE was new and had heard complaints about leaky cones. So decided to stick with the ES180.

As some of you know, my ES180 plans were for the Directiva r2 bass module. As the r2 monitor plans got delayed, I held off on the bass module. By then, the ES180 was gone without warning from Parts Express. Now am finding the SIG180 does not meet spec. So, you can see why I might be a little hesitant about Dayton drivers at this point. I hope Dayton improves, but hope is not a strategy. I share this as I truly want to see PE succeed but suspect they need a wakeup call.

Despite the Sig180's not matching claimed specs, how do you like them?

 

[Rick Sykora]

Despite the Sig180's not matching claimed specs, how do you like them?

The higher Fs hurts, as did not want to eq to get decent bass. Currently, I have only listened to them in a slightly undersized vented cabinet away from room boundaries. Some eq helps and does not seem to strain. At the price point, they are usable. Am dropping them into the same chassis as Directiva r1 and that speaker sets a high bar.

Once I have some time to try the Wavecor WF182, will hear how well it compares. Maybe there will be a Wavenotiva too.

 

[mikeinmn]

Not a kit but a finished speaker for $800/pair. See what you think…

NEW Dayton Audio OPAL1 Bookshelf Speaker Pair Gloss Black

Dayton Audio OPAL1 Bookshelf Speaker Pair Gloss Black Dayton Audio OPAL1 2-Way Hi-Fi Bookshelf Speaker Pair Since its establishment, Dayton Audio has been synonymous with premier loudspeaker components, and ready-to-build designs. During our research and development process to develop new and...

www.parts-express.com

View attachment 363223

No real measurements posted as yet. Is a passive radiator design using Dayton drivers.

 

[mikeinmn]

Not a kit but a finished speaker for $800/pair. See what you think…

NEW Dayton Audio OPAL1 Bookshelf Speaker Pair Gloss Black

Dayton Audio OPAL1 Bookshelf Speaker Pair Gloss Black Dayton Audio OPAL1 2-Way Hi-Fi Bookshelf Speaker Pair Since its establishment, Dayton Audio has been synonymous with premier loudspeaker components, and ready-to-build designs. During our research and development process to develop new and...

www.parts-express.com

View attachment 363223

No real measurements posted as yet. Is a passive radiator design using Dayton drivers.

my audiophile son and i listened to these at AXPONA. loved them. now i own a pair. more later after more experience with my system. yes, the bass is amazing.

 

[hex168]

Before he passed, Rick Craig had shared how PE quality and his interactions with them had shifted lately. At the time, we had both decided to use the ES180Ti in projects. Rick emphasized how the driver was made by a more reliable supplier than other Dayton drivers. The result of his effort was the Integrity speaker that he dedicated to Jeff Bagby. I built the prototype and shipped to Amir for review. Along the way, I acquired 4 or 5 woofers and planned to use them in a minitower design. I called Parts Express and asked about ES180 sales and longevity. I was concerned as the new Epique driver seemed very comparable. I was assured PE planned to continue to sell the ES180. The E180HE was new and had heard complaints about leaky cones. So decided to stick with the ES180.

As some of you know, my ES180 plans were for the Directiva r2 bass module. As the r2 monitor plans got delayed, I held off on the bass module. By then, the ES180 was gone without warning from Parts Express. Now am finding the SIG180 does not meet spec. So, you can see why I might be a little hesitant about Dayton drivers at this point. I hope Dayton improves, but hope is not a strategy. I share this as I truly want to see PE succeed but suspect they need a wakeup call.

Come to think of it, I've heard that the RS52AN mids started off good and then did not meet spec.

 

[lewdish]

my audiophile son and i listened to these at AXPONA. loved them. now i own a pair. more later after more experience with my system. yes, the bass is amazing.

What are you driving them with?

 

[Wolf]

It's like a Sierra LX cross Sointuva that costs less than either.

Interesting. I heard rumours of March Audio potentially making a smaller speaker; would be interesting to compare measurements if that happens

I do like the idea of compact speakers with decent bass. Would be fun for someone to create a 3 way compact mini monitor for reduced IMD

Already done, if you DIY.... my Bottleships (https://www.diyaudio.com/community/...smallest-diy-3-ways-ive-built-or-seen.392609/) are a 3.5ltr 3way.

I am planning a small 3way of same style with the E150HE44 as well. These will be about 0.35ft^3 gross.

There are quite a few other examples out there. Mudjock's "Hafniums", my Monoculus and Purveyor also hit the mark.

 

[Wolf]

$800 is a great price for something like this completed so a profit can be made.
As to the cost being 'worth it', it is!
Going from driver retail costs...
100 + 100 + 35 + 35 + 35 + 35 + 38 + 38 = 416
The cabinets are prefinished, but supposedly cheaper than the precut knockdown cabs would have been. Even if I say $100 for the mdf, the finish adds likely another $50-100 of cost for most of us to finish a set of cabs.
If you then add in the design time and R&D, that $616 will hit that $800 pretty quickly.

This is a commercial product, and has to make a profit upon sale. I see this way too often that commercial products could be made for much less, but when you figure in the overhead and time being money (labor), you have to include it. Free labor is only applicable if you do it yourself.

The better deal on the market is likely the SB Bromo kit, but it will not dig as low. Pick your poison.
The output was crazy on the OPAL1, lest you think the bass was not palpable or even barely noticeable.

The E150HE44 I own do not appear to have holey cones, same for the 7" PRs I also have.