DAC ABX shootout - unable to distinguish between 10$ and 15k$

[Zensō]

You can't really say it's not justifiable to spend $15K on a DAC just based on this test. There are cases where it would be justifiable for the added functionality.

Like if the DAC comes with a motorcycle attached to it, or something.

 

[pkane]

You can't really say it's not justifiable to spend $15K on a DAC just based on this test. There are cases where it would be justifiable for the added functionality.

Like if the DAC comes with a motorcycle attached to it, or something.

I'd go for that! But only if it's a NOS motorcycle

 

[MarkWinston]

Which, of course, has nothing to do with any of this.

No one is preaching that's what you should use. Just that it isn't going to be audibly different under most circumstances from the latest greatest veil removing wunderdac.

If you believe you can demonstrate its audible inferiority, by all means do so. Otherwise, maybe stop intentionally missing the point.

Ll

Which, of course, has nothing to do with any of this.

No one is preaching that's what you should use. Just that it isn't going to be audibly different under most circumstances from the latest greatest veil removing wunderdac.

If you believe you can demonstrate its audible inferiority, by all means do so. Otherwise, maybe stop intentionally missing the point.

Says who it 'isnt going to be audibly under most circumstances"? Thats the point tvgreek was trying to make. You are you to define what people can hear that you cant? I cant hear what Amir hears and vice versa. Do you really think that science stops here at the current measurements we have? Just fyi, that is not science to say the least. Read all the reviews Amir wrote from 5 years back and what he is writing now. You dont see the how Amir test equipments back then compared to now? You dont see a 'contradiction' or rather an evolution? If you dont see that, you are scientifically blinded. The 9 dollar dongle and burden of proof line are getting old, these 2 statements will put a heavy pause into the progression of science. Its up how to define science, but science to some will not stop. Too bad so sad if it what I said doesnt fit your narrative of 'science'.

 

[BDWoody]

Says who it 'isnt going to be audibly under most circumstances"?

You are welcome to show how wrong I am.

Otherwise, you're just trolling at this point.

 

[MarkWinston]

The reveiw is here,

Review: Apple vs Google USB-C Headphone Adapters

This is a review, detailed measurements and comparison of Apple's USB-C adapter to the current and last version of Google Pixel headphone adapters. The Apple adapter costs just $9 including one day shipping for free. The Google dongle costs $12. Not that any of these are large by any stretch...

www.audiosciencereview.com

and suggests that differences from SOTA Dac's will be inaudible for most people. Only you can verify that a differene can be heard. People who can't hear a difference can't confirm what you want confirmed.

Step up, do the blind test and post your results. You'll get more respect for your confrontational approach when you do.

I have done proper abx blind test (double if you want ti be anal about it) and have posted results. My comments was disabled on that thread and I decided to let it go. Make no mistakes, im not a 'cable makes a difference' kind of guy, but there are certain things that we cant put a fullstop on currently.

 

[DonR]

I have done proper abx blind test (double if you want ti be anal about it)

The only proper blind test is double.

 

[MarkWinston]

You are welcome to show how wrong I am.

Otherwise, you're just trolling at this point.

Clearly you do not understand what trolling means. Everyone that has a different opinion is TROLLING? Everyone that dont fit your narrative is stupid and dont know better? I know you are an admin, that dont mean whatever you feel is right is right. Ask Amir or Erin to feed a 9 dollar dongle in their system and start making a review whenever they can without feeling that dongle will be a bottleneck.

 

[pkane]

I have done proper abx blind test (double if you want ti be anal about it) and have posted results. My comments was disabled on that thread and I decided to let it go. Make no mistakes, im not a 'cable makes a difference' kind of guy, but there are certain things that we cant put a fullstop on currently.

Where did you post the procedure and the result of your blind test? Couldn't find it in the dongle thread.

 

[Gene LeClair]

I have done proper abx blind test (double if you want ti be anal about it) and have posted results. My comments was disabled on that thread and I decided to let it go. Make no mistakes, im not a 'cable makes a difference' kind of guy, but there are certain things that we cant put a fullstop on currently.

Just as a reference for someone who is interested in reading it, your thread would be this one, right?
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/abx-blind-test-and-level-matching.26626/

 

[Mnyb]

The human animal has not changed in long time , how much better than we can hear do we need ? even a 30 year old CD player is better than humans . So it has nothing to do with progress of science .

However there are reasons for for better than human performance EQ and room corrections system . for example in my headphone rig i sacrifice -10dB in digital gain to accommodate the EQ and the extra headroom to avoid issues . And in the maths for filters and EQ in products with them inside , there you want better performance .

The DAC + amp is dead quit anyway even if i toss away 10dB. I dont hink a phone dongle would and i would not drive the headphones very well .

The test OP did was a very easy on the phone dongle it only had to provide voltage not driving headphones , in that limited capacity it performed "good enough" aka better than most humans .

Also . if you use DAC with digital volume controll as a preamp , depending on amp sensitivity etc , there may be very good reasons to step up from a phone dongle . It cost more but it does not need to be a dCS stack either .

On the other hand high end is filled with products that performs much much worse than a phone dongle . The TotalDAC ? every NOS filterless dac ever sold . Audio Note ?

 

[Zensō]

Just as a reference for someone who is interested in reading it, your thread would be this one, right?
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/abx-blind-test-and-level-matching.26626/

I don’t see any results posted in that thread. Maybe post the results here?

 

[MarkWinston]

Where did you post the procedure and the result of your blind test? Couldn't find it in the dongle thread.

It isnt in the dongle thread. I got post banned in that thread and I couldnt reply further in that particular thread.

 

[SIY]

Looking forward for you to show what your 9 dollar dongle can do.

Ive always known whatever rejection to the 9 dollar dongle claim will spark an outrage among some of you, Ive yet to see any of your main systems consist of that 9 dollar dac. Go on, show me your flat neutral speakers with sota measured amp paired with this 9 dollar plastic.

I’ve posted the test results. I’ve also published them. Full description of test methods and equipment.

Ready to step up?

 

[TheBatsEar]

We could not tell the difference reliably between the systems.

Sucks for the manufacturers of $15k DACs. Sucks for me because i bought a 1000€ SACD player and also a 120€ DAC.
You had to find out, didn't you!

 

[MarkWinston]

I’ve posted the test results.

So YOU did. Does that represent every single human in this world? Again, the point tvgreek was trying to make. I know with what I said it will make me unpopular in this forum but I will still say it. As usual, all you 9 dollar dongle apple gang can come slam on every single one that says otherwise.

I find this forum very useful to single out clearly bad measuring products, but a few here are insisting that data presented here is end all be all. And no, no one is talking about 15k dacs here. Price dont matter, or does it?

 

[TheBatsEar]

It is no more than an ignorant belief that the measurements made, as good as they are, are the complete differences.

In other words, you think you can hear things we can't measure.

Consider these rings:

Your brain will tell you the circles move. Your ears, just like your heat sensors, taste buds and pain receptors are flawed and can be tricked.

Measurements however, they tell you the truth: the rings don't move.

 

[Killingbeans]

Does that represent every single human in this world?

Of course not. Personally I feel fine making the assumption that neither my hearing nor my situation/setup is anything out of the ordinary.

If I should ever get the urge to put any of those things on a pedestal, I could just take the test myself.

 

[SIY]

So YOU did. Does that represent every single human in this world? Again, the point tvgreek was trying to make. I know with what I said it will make me unpopular in this forum but I will still say it. As usual, all you 9 dollar dongle apple gang can come slam on every single one that says otherwise.

I find this forum very useful to single out clearly bad measuring products, but a few here are insisting that data presented here is end all be all. And no, no one is talking about 15k dacs here. Price dont matter, or does it?

So basically, you’ve got nothing.

 

[pkane]

So YOU did. Does that represent every single human in this world? Again, the point tvgreek was trying to make. I know with what I said it will make me unpopular in this forum but I will still say it. As usual, all you 9 dollar dongle apple gang can come slam on every single one that says otherwise.

I find this forum very useful to single out clearly bad measuring products, but a few here are insisting that data presented here is end all be all. And no, no one is talking about 15k dacs here. Price dont matter, or does it?

If others think a $9 dongle works perfectly fine as a DAC for them, why is this a problem for you? If you've done a proper ABX test and heard a difference, then don't use the $9 dongle. The only reason to get upset, IMHO, is if you've spent $15k on a DAC and can't tell the difference between it and the dongle. That would really p!ss me off.

 

[antcollinet]

So YOU did. Does that represent every single human in this world? Again, the point tvgreek was trying to make. I know with what I said it will make me unpopular in this forum but I will still say it. As usual, all you 9 dollar dongle apple gang can come slam on every single one that says otherwise.

I find this forum very useful to single out clearly bad measuring products, but a few here are insisting that data presented here is end all be all. And no, no one is talking about 15k dacs here. Price dont matter, or does it?

No one is insisting anything except that people back up opinions with evidence.