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Cary Audio - Sad experience

voodooless

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This is why (and I have no tech knowledge whatsoever) I didn't rush to plug the amplifier and instead sent 3 email to imply doubts about the issue. All the replies failed to correct the mistake.
Only after the unit broke came the "Evrika"..
Did you mention to them that you've been using the device using a converter all these years?
 

tvih

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That is the whole point. It is certain that this amp needs a change. Changing nothing definitely will damage the amp. It should have been obvious to the technician that Cary Audio gave the wrong advice. Now, I won't go so far as to blame the technician, but it is certainly not a good thing.
Was it "certain" in advance though? Hindsight is always easy, but there are plenty of power sources sources than work with 100-240V/50-60Hz without needing anything changed, other than the correct wire/plug to connect to the wall socket. In such a case you could do the voltage conversion like the OP did and it could work, but it would still work without said conversion as well. Especially with that being the case the end user - or even the tech - really can't be blamed if the manufacturer gives flat out incorrect info about their own damned product.

Needless to say, very poor form from Cary Audio.
 

Count Arthur

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Who was the tech guy you asked to look at it?

Anyone familiar with electronics should have been able to figure it out, dual primaries and jumpers on transformers for 110/115v - 220/230v operation is very common:

iu

I'm a random DIY dabbler, with no formal elecronics training whatsoever, and I'm familiar with the concept.
 
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muslhead

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I'm well past the crying spot. I practically beg them to not let me be placed in a position to get all this to the public view.
I reached the point where it felt I was the Cary Audio and not the other way around.
Nope. They gone ostrich on me ..
IMHO your only recourse (other than throwing more money at this problem) is to take it public. Well beyond ASR and into whatever forum or site Cary has a following. May not do much but sometimes this kind of pressure can elicit the response you want. If not, i would look elsewhere for another tube amp option and be done with Cary.
Thanks for posting. its hearing stories like these that can and will change buying decisions.
Wishing you a good outcome
 

voodooless

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Was it "certain" in advance though? Hindsight is always easy, but there are plenty of power sources sources than work with 100-240V/50-60Hz without needing anything changed, other than the correct wire/plug to connect to the wall socket.
It's a tube amp, it's bound not to have a DC/DC that has wide voltage input. Nor was there an external switch. The chances that it needs an internal change are just about 100%. No hindsight is needed here.
 
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Varail

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Who was the tech guy you asked to look at it?

Anyone familiar with electronics should have been able to figure it out, dual primaries and jumpers on transformers for 110/115v - 220/230v operation is very common:

iu

I'm a randon DIY dabbler, with no formal elecronics training whatsoever, and I'm familiar with the concept.

I dont understand you. The guys job was to solder the jumpers as instructed by Cary. The jumpers were already set.
He didnt know anything about the machine schematics. He didnt change or break anything.
He coulnt have changed jumpers randomly just because something should be changed. I needed to go back and ask Cary which I did.
There was plenty of time to fix everything after I sent 3 mails of confirmation..
 

Blumlein 88

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I dont understand you. The guys job was to solder the jumpers as instructed by Cary. The jumpers were already set.
He didnt know anything about the machine schematics. He didnt change or break anything.
He coulnt have changed jumpers randomly just because something should be changed. I needed to go back and ask Cary which I did.
There was plenty of time to fix everything after I sent 3 mails of confirmation..
Any tech knowing you used a converter would know you cannot skip the converter with no changes and have it work. As should Cary if they understood the situation.

Am I right you didn't purchase it from Cary, but some 3rd party? I really don't think you'll be able to get satisfied on this. According to your description of events they are at worst only partly to blame, you or your tech are too, and you purchased from another person and are in another country. You can't expect Cary to be globally on the hook for used gear even if they gave poor instructions in a country they don't even have a business presence in. Maybe if a really good tech could figure out what's wrong they could help with parts.

EDIT to add: A really good tech suspicious of the connections could have used a variac to check voltages as they are brought up and confirmed to Cary they were giving bad instructions as the voltages weren't right. This would not have damaged anything. Alternatively, he could have checked voltages with your converter which hadn't damaged the amp and sent the results to Cary indicating they definitely were giving bad instructions and requesting a schematic.
 
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Varail

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Any tech knowing you used a converter would know you cannot skip the converter with no changes and have it work. As should Cary if they understood the situation.

Am I right you didn't purchase it from Cary, but some 3rd party? I really don't think you'll be able to get satisfied on this. According to your description of events they are at worst only partly to blame, you or your tech are too, and you purchased from another person and are in another country. You can't expect Cary to be globally on the hook for used gear even if they gave poor instructions in a country they don't even have a business presence in. Maybe if a really good tech could figure out what's wrong they could help with parts.
The tech didnt modify anything. His advice was to contact Cary. Which I did. I didnt plug the unit to 220V.
1st I told Cary the jumpers were already as spec and the answer was "Its ok go for it"
2nd I emailed again. Are you sure ? .. Sure
3rd If you are sure than I will go for it. Still no recovering.

What would you have done in my place ? Write the 4th mail ? Go to US ?
If they dont know their own tech who would ?
 

voodooless

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Am I right you didn't purchase it from Cary, but some 3rd party? I really don't think you'll be able to get satisfied on this. According to your description of events they are at worst only partly to blame, you or your tech are too, and you purchased from another person and are in another country. You can't expect Cary to be globally on the hook for used gear even if they gave poor instructions in a country they don't even have a business presence in. Maybe if a really good tech could figure out what's wrong they could help with parts.
I see it a little bit differently. From what I understand, The OP bought the amp brand new 4 years ago and used a converter all the time. Then asked about the conversion, got instructions on how to do that, and found out that the supposed conversion was already done. Then asked several times for confirmation that this is the correct way for 220V operation, and all the time received a positive response. I think they are especially to blame if they give you wrong instructions. If they feel they can't give you proper service at your location, they should not give any advice. They should just have told him to not do any mods because they cannot support it, and leave the converter in place. But that is not what they did...

Now how to resolve the matter is another issue... The only leverage you may have is to have a public temper tantrum and make them aware of it.
 
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Varail

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Your tech doesn't understand basic electronics and shouldn't be working on tube gear.
His job was to solder the jumpers not to evaluate the machine.
He opened the enclosure, checked the jumpers layout , close the enclosure and advice me to contact Cary for forward development.
 

Blumlein 88

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I see it a little bit differently. From what I understand, The OP bought the amp brand new 4 years ago and used a converter all the time. Then asked about the conversion, got instructions on how to do that, and found out that the supposed conversion was already done. Then asked several times for confirmation that this is the correct way for 220V operation, and all the time received a positive response. I think they are especially to blame if they give you wrong instructions. If they feel they can't give you proper service at your location, they should not give any advice. They should just have told him to not do any mods because they cannot support it, and leave the converter in place. But that is not what they did...

Now how to resolve the matter is another issue... The only leverage you may have is to have a public temper tantrum and make them aware of it.
I can see it both ways, it isn't clear cut either way. Even more so if he didn't buy it from Cary which is what I thought was the case which Varail can clear up for us.
 
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Varail

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It was bought more than 4 years ago from a 3rd party. Iv been using it all these years with a 110-220V converter and it worked and sounded absolutely great. I also have a bucket of tubes for it.
I think I already did
 

Blumlein 88

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His job was to solder the jumpers not to evaluate the machine.
He opened the enclosure, checked the jumpers layout , close the enclosure and advice me to contact Cary for forward development.
I wouldn't do that. I would check voltages with the converter and told you, "listen to them if you want, but it will blow up on 220 volts". I also could have figured out what to do just looking it over unless they have some incredibly strange connections there. But I've some experience with working on tube gear.
 

voodooless

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I can see it both ways, it isn't clear cut either way. Even more so if he didn't buy it from Cary which is what I thought was the case which Varail can clear up for us.
I don't see how it matters where he bought it. It's 4 years old, so by EU law warranty responsibility lies with the manufacturer again, not where you bought it. Sadly, EU law probably does not apply here. The question is: is it even a warranty claim? Because the device got damaged due to instructions given explicitly by the manufacturer. It's a strange case for sure.

I think there are some legal expert forum members, they may be able to chime in...
 

Blumlein 88

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It is like this analogy to me. I have a flat tire. I have a tire repair guy call the tire maker and ask what to do. They tell me to cut a hole in the side of the tire which will let the air back in and it won't be flat.

I cannot imagine them telling someone that and confirming it. If they did, I also cannot imagine a tire repair guy actually following their instructions. If the customer insisted I'd advice them to get in writing before cutting into the tire the tire maker will replace the tire if it doesn't work because it is not going to work.
 

Blumlein 88

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I don't see how it matters where he bought it. It's 4 years old, so by EU law warranty responsibility lies with the manufacturer again, not where you bought it. Sadly, EU law probably does not apply here. The question is: is it even a warranty claim? Because the device got damaged due to instructions given explicitly by the manufacturer. It's a strange case for sure.

I think there are some legal expert forum members, they may be able to chime in...
I'm no attorney, but how can EU warranty law cover an item never sold new in the EU, shipped into the EU 2nd hand where the manufacturer does not do business? We also don't know if it is 4 years old or 20 years old. The OP purchased it from someone 4 years ago.
 
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