Career advice

[MKreroo]

Hi all, been on this forum for some time and have seen lots of members with exceptional knowledge/experience as well as great stories. I have some self dilemma regarding future career/education path and figured I will ask around here for some advice.

I have recently completed a bachelor degree in mechanical engineering, and plan on taking another comp-sci major to complement the ME degree. Since these two share some basic low level courses doing so means I can finish the second degree within 2 years. However having just finished university once is making me really burnt out with staying in university again, I just don't feel like I have the energy to engage with university in again.
However being in a big city makes finding a job as a ME little bit more challenging compared to SWE/CS. Currently I am slightly more inclined with a ME job especially that I had a really great experience during ME co-op, but at the same time seeing the benefit some of my friends working as software engineer have has gotten me reconsidering my priority.

I think I'm somewhat interested in programming/compsci, but I find myself learning much slower compared to when studying ME. I struggle to understand basic concepts about data structure, and find myself unable to utilize much of what I have learned in some low level CS courses.
My current plan is to try to find a job as ME, and self learn as much about CS as I can during my free time. I am however worried about the extent I can learn from books/online contents compared to what university offers.

Open to all suggestions and stories, thanks.

 

[JPA]

Try to hire on at a company that will reimburse tuition as you pursue a second degree at night. These days there are many universities that offer night and remote classes, so you might not even have to set foot in a classroom. Obviously it's not easy, but that's what I did and it was well worth the long hours of work + school.

Good luck.

 

[Beershaun]

Agree with see if you can get a company that will pay for you to go back. And I'd add go back for a master's rather than a second bachelor's. You will earn more with a masters.

 

[droid2000]

Hi all, been on this forum for some time and have seen lots of members with exceptional knowledge/experience as well as great stories. I have some self dilemma regarding future career/education path and figured I will ask around here for some advice.

I have recently completed a bachelor degree in mechanical engineering, and plan on taking another comp-sci major to complement the ME degree. Since these two share some basic low level courses doing so means I can finish the second degree within 2 years. However having just finished university once is making me really burnt out with staying in university again, I just don't feel like I have the energy to engage with university in again.
However being in a big city makes finding a job as a ME little bit more challenging compared to SWE/CS. Currently I am slightly more inclined with a ME job especially that I had a really great experience during ME co-op, but at the same time seeing the benefit some of my friends working as software engineer have has gotten me reconsidering my priority.

I think I'm somewhat interested in programming/compsci, but I find myself learning much slower compared to when studying ME. I struggle to understand basic concepts about data structure, and find myself unable to utilize much of what I have learned in some low level CS courses.
My current plan is to try to find a job as ME, and self learn as much about CS as I can during my free time. I am however worried about the extent I can learn from books/online contents compared to what university offers.

Open to all suggestions and stories, thanks.

I went a similar path. Got the EE bachelor degree and then masters in CS. But CS changes so fast that a university degree doesn't mean much. You either learn on your feet or fall behind. I've been doing it for 25 years. Still rapidly learning to this day on my own. So yes, you can do it in your free time... you don't need a degree. Get an ME job and learn CS on the side. If you can't, then it wasn't right for you anyways. If you can survive on savings, then skip the MS (eww) job and study study study build software and apply for jobs. For the basics that you'll need for entry level job study leetcode.com problems. Solve most of them. https://leetcode.com/studyplan/top-interview-150/

 

[MKreroo]

I went a similar path. Got the EE bachelor degree and then masters in CS. But CS changes so fast that a university degree doesn't mean much. You either learn on your feet or fall behind. I've been doing it for 25 years. Still rapidly learning to this day on my own. So yes, you can do it in your free time... you don't need a degree. Get an ME job and learn CS on the side. If you can't, then it wasn't right for you anyways. If you can survive on savings, then skip the MS (eww) job and study study study build software and apply for jobs. For the basics that you'll need for entry level job study leetcode.com problems. Solve most of them. https://leetcode.com/studyplan/top-interview-150/

Appreciate the advice, the speed at which CS is changing is really incredible and scary at times. I never really realized how much good content on CS there are on the internet, from the fundamentals to the advanced. I will sure be doing a good chunk of leetcode to test my own ability.

 

[Hollywood_Bob]

My cheap advice is to stay away from CS. I think it's going to be turned upside down and inside out because of AI, and there is already too much competition from people from diverse backgrounds, some of whom are brilliant and never needed a degree anyway.

Instead, focus on things that will save the planet and people. Small nuclear plants, large scale atmospheric water generators, desalination plants, high production greenhouse systems, geo-thermal systems that actually work financially, etc.

Get a ME job with a large multi-disciplinary, international engineering firm like Stantec or Aecom (I live in Canada), then afer a few years, start working on an MBA, and then move up into management. Get to travel a lot too.

 

[MaxwellsEq]

Personally, I feel there's no substitute for getting some practical experience. It helps add weight to your resume and also gives you insight into what you enjoy and what you are good at.

I'm an EE, but have done a lot of computer and network stuff. I was self-taught on both. Learning material is very rich in the CS world. What wil always be useful is fundamentals, they tend to stay useful whilst everything else rapidly evolves

 

[MKreroo]

Try to hire on at a company that will reimburse tuition as you pursue a second degree at night. These days there are many universities that offer night and remote classes, so you might not even have to set foot in a classroom. Obviously it's not easy, but that's what I did and it was well worth the long hours of work + school.

Good luck.

Haven't really thought much about this, thanks for bringing it up.

 

[Fred H]

My experience is that I did best what I enjoyed most. I once had a student who was majoring in accounting -- and told me that he hated it. I asked "Why do what you hate for the rest of your life?" He replied "I can always get a job."

I changed fields several times: systems engineering to engineering psychology to finance to databases. took courses in the evening (statistics) and full time (business and finance). I worked for private firms (one with free beer after 5pm), the government, universities, and as an independent consultant. I avoided boredom and looked forward to working.

Do what you enjoy and challenges you.

 

[DVDdoug]

I'm sure it helps to have "the paper" to get in the door as a programmer but I've known quite a few programmers who have electrical engineering degrees, or degrees in scientific fields, and somehow "found their way" into programming without a CS degree. I know one guy who had a physics degree and he taught himself programming. He was doing "physics work" for a military contractor and he got some part-time contract jobs before eventually finding a full-time programming job. I knew one very-good programmer who didn't complete high school and he had some high-level jobs in the past but when I knew him he was working at the same small company as me and I'm sure he wasn't making as much money as before.

However having just finished university once is making me really burnt out with staying in university again, I just don't feel like I have the energy to engage with university in again.

I have an electronics degree and I went back to "night school" for an MBA abut 10 years later. (I was single without kids.) It was a great experience! Almost all of the students were working adults with experiences in different industries, and in graduate school everybody is serious about school. After a 10 year "break" I had a better attitude about school too! Working was also great after my 1st graduation... No homework and lots more money!

My current plan is to try to find a job as ME, and self learn as much about CS as I can during my free time. I am however worried about the extent I can learn from books/online contents compared to what university offers.

I've never worked as a "programmer" but I've done some programming in several different programming languages for work and as a hobby. I took a few programming classes in college and that was very useful for learning the basic concepts. But every time I needed-wanted to learn a new programming language I just got a book. I'm old so I'm more of a "book guy". Plus, books are more organized/structured than the Internet. But the Internet has far-more information and it's usually quicker if you just need to look something up.


But... I think formal classes are the best way (for most people) to learn almost anything... The learning is organized & structured and your progress is constantly "evaluated". You've got instructors/professors to guide you and you can learn from your fellow students, etc. And the motivation is more "forced".

 

[LightninBoy]

Software Professional here, and sometimes hiring manager. Fewer and fewer companies are requiring degrees period to hire for software jobs. You already have a degree (ME), so even if they do require a degree you have one. The CS part is totally learnable for free, night classes, or other formal professional training outside of college.

One caution on boot camp style training programs - I believe they tend to create tech specialist who are proficient in just a single programming tool/ecosystem. At your stage, I'd recommend a CS curriculum that prepares you for a lifetime of learning new programming tools and ecosystems.

 

[jbattman1016]

Hi all, been on this forum for some time and have seen lots of members with exceptional knowledge/experience as well as great stories. I have some self dilemma regarding future career/education path and figured I will ask around here for some advice.

I have recently completed a bachelor degree in mechanical engineering, and plan on taking another comp-sci major to complement the ME degree. Since these two share some basic low level courses doing so means I can finish the second degree within 2 years. However having just finished university once is making me really burnt out with staying in university again, I just don't feel like I have the energy to engage with university in again.
However being in a big city makes finding a job as a ME little bit more challenging compared to SWE/CS. Currently I am slightly more inclined with a ME job especially that I had a really great experience during ME co-op, but at the same time seeing the benefit some of my friends working as software engineer have has gotten me reconsidering my priority.

I think I'm somewhat interested in programming/compsci, but I find myself learning much slower compared to when studying ME. I struggle to understand basic concepts about data structure, and find myself unable to utilize much of what I have learned in some low level CS courses.
My current plan is to try to find a job as ME, and self learn as much about CS as I can during my free time. I am however worried about the extent I can learn from books/online contents compared to what university offers.

Open to all suggestions and stories, thanks.

My thoughts:
Completing the FE/PE exam is more worth it right, but from what I remember that's hard to pass.

I agree with others, if you don't have a passion for programming, then you should work it as a hobby and not spend the time at school. You can always take an online course as well to see if you even remotely like it.

 

[Hollywood_Bob]

Also, going to university can be a bit of a mental trap, and seems more important when you are younger. It can be hard to let go of, I think in part because a lot of the decisions are made for you, and that's what everyone you know is doing.

But once you have been in the work force for a while, made some money, are making your own decisions, you recognize that it is just a short period in your life and other things are more important.

And for my profession (city planner/development manager) continuing professional self-improvement is a requirement anyway just to maintain my professional memberships.

Get your P. Eng. That's the next step. Get it while you are young.

I work with a lot of engineers; structural, civil, building science, geotechnical, hydrology, environmental, mechanical, electrical, they all have their P. Eng.

Forgot a couple; transportation, railway, and since you are on this forum, drum roll please, wait for it, wait...

Acoustical engineering.

It seems to come up more and more, with developments in proximity to airports, railways, transit systems, etc. and we have to engage acoustical engineers in the analysis and design of the projects. Very interesting work.

 

[Timcognito]

This group sells learn at home software software for charity for penny's on the dollar. There is often bundles of Python, C++ etc., but none right now. Here is an example of the the kind of thing that could be useful to you $25 for $2500 of software. Not a scam I've obtained several packages.

Project Managers Toolkit - Become a Productivity Powerhouse

We’ve teamed up with Packt for our newest bundle. Get courses in project management (PM) and productivity using Trello, JIRA, Agile, Scrum, and more.

www.humblebundle.com

I'm a ME and retired from a lucrative, diverse and rewarding career in Medical Devices. As some have said the CS field is crowded.

 

[radix]

Understanding algorithms is very important to good programming, unless you are doing superficial or toy problems. Take an online course or get a decent algorithms book. I used the Corman, Leiserson, Rivest, and Stein book and the Aho books, but that was ages ago. Data structures are tools to achieve an algorithm or data flow (though I think most people just use them as ways to record data without considering its affects on the algorithm or the structure of a database). The way one represents data can make a problem very hard or very easy (I think of them like coordinate systems in physics: the right perspective can makes a problem easily solvable).

An understanding of graph theory, linear optimization, and dynamic programming (not to be confused with computer programming) is a big help too.

If you understand those things, then programming languages are mostly easy. It's not the language you program something in that matters, it's what you say in that language that counts. (ok, that was a generalization, language does matter due to platform support and other important things).

There are also a bunch of guidelines, like SOLID or TDD, that can help write good code that is easier to understand, has fewer flaws, and is easier to maintain by someone else down the road. I've interviewed a lot of CS candidates that do not really appreciate the utility of unit tests and documentation to code longevity and maintainability.

That's all traditional CS stuff. As others pointed out AI is changing things. Some of the most interesting stuff is combinations of neural networks with symantic reasoning. This begins to ground neural networks (which can go off and do strange things) with grounded concepts of what it is talking about, e.g. physics models. There's also some pretty amazing stuff with program synthesis (automatically writing computer programs) based on unit tests. Quantum has also come a long way and there are quantum programs being written and executed now. It will become practical very soon with quantum error correction.

Anyway, choosing the right path between data science, programming/algorithms, quantum, etc. is important. But you really need to have a passion for it. If. you just want CS tools to support ME, that's one thing, but if you want to make a career out of it you need to enjoy it.

Voting Software

xkcd.com

 

[MKreroo]

Software Professional here, and sometimes hiring manager. Fewer and fewer companies are requiring degrees period to hire for software jobs. You already have a degree (ME), so even if they do require a degree you have one. The CS part is totally learnable for free, night classes, or other formal professional training outside of college.

One caution on boot camp style training programs - I believe they tend to create tech specialist who are proficient in just a single programming tool/ecosystem. At your stage, I'd recommend a CS curriculum that prepares you for a lifetime of learning new programming tools and ecosystems.

Yeah I have seen many mention about bootcamp style and the cons while searching about my concern, decided to avoid bootcamp entirely. Will look into some more online CS curriculum to strengthen my fundamental skills, so far have found quite some good ones (MOOC, OSSU, and some offered by Harvard and MIT for free).
Thanks for the tips!

My experience is that I did best what I enjoyed most.

Do what you enjoy and challenges you.

My sister gave me the same advice too haha, and I really feel it when thinking back to my co-op, and was lucky enough to have very friendly and patient collegues/mentors there, made learning a lot of fun there.

But every time I needed-wanted to learn a new programming language I just got a book.

Books are amazing indeed, I've already got a few books (though in PDF) lined up to help.

 

[BlackTalon]

What did you focus on within ME? There is still a shortage of MEs in the building design sector, at least in major cities in the US. Most M/E/P Principals I'll talked to over the last year indicated they are having trouble finding enough new engineers. And it's a field where a MS isn't really needed.

 

[Multicore]

I employ computer programmers and and software engineers and I don't care about their education and don't even inquire about it. I tend to think that you can teach yourself programming better than most schools. And given that you already have an ME certificate, you've demonstrated your ability to gain qualifications and to think in abstractions.

What you perceive as difficulty with data structures, for example, is unfamiliarity. Software and computers are uniquely good at throwing huge waves of complicated new stuff at you (everything comes with hectares of technical API documentation). So you need to learn the skills of learning this kind of thing, which principally involves learning to not feel overwhelmed and get anxious or irritated by it, and to know how to find what you need for the next step of your work, and how to get help. Those skills are largely transferable over different software technologies.

So Idk. Get a starter ME job and teach yourself software. If the job can benefit from using some software, e.g. to calculate or simulate things, then you can mix them up.

 

[Hollywood_Bob]

We are using Rimkus on a project right now, and I have used them on several projects in the past.

Mechanical, Electrical, and Plumbing (MEP) Consulting - Rimkus

The Rimkus MEP Consulting Services team specializes in providing comprehensive mechanical, electrical, and life safety consulting services. Learn more.

rimkus.com

 

[Multicore]

Books are amazing indeed, I've already got a few books (though in PDF) lined up to help.

ok, yes, but there are many really bad books too. these days many specialized books (that come out mostly in ebook, pdf, and print on demand) are written by people who wrote them while they learned something. it's kinda like the software blogs. some are good but since most are written by someone who is motivated by the excitement of having just gained a competence and wanting to show off, not necessarily very good quality.