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Beta Test: DISTORT - audibility of distortions

DDF

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Dec 31, 2018
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#21
Do you have any good references for these studies? Papers, results, discussions? I can certainly measure phase of each harmonic. Adjusting it using the transfer function will require some research.
Here are my notes summarizing my reading of a couple related papers. The ear has a non linear transfer function which can change the inner spectrum envelope depending on external phase relationships. Doesn't mean any phase manipulation is audible, but it does mean using linear math is not really a good way to explore differences in perceived envelopes, and DBT is usually necessary.

From "Hearing, Its Psychology and Physiology" by the
Acoustical Society of America on the
audibility of 2nd harmonic distortion with a pure 370
Hz fundamental:

"The masking of an added harmonic is negligible below
a sensation level of 40 - 50 dB. From 50 to 80 dB,
the amount of harmonic necessary for an audible change
increases rapidly, first in absolute magnitude, and later
in relative magnitude as well...."

"...The qualitative character of the audible change produced
by adding this harmonic was different at the various sensation
levels of the fundamental. At low levels the harmonic was usually
heard as a separate tone. In the middle region [50 - 80 dBSPL]
it was heard as a sharpening or brightening of the timbre of the
tone, whereas at high levels the changes were so complex and so
dependent upon differences of phase that any generalization about
their character would be misleading."
------------------------------------------------------------------
From "The representation of speech in the peripheral auditory
system", there's a paper by Schroeder and Mehgart "Auditory Masking
in the perception of speech", where they show that reversing the
phase of even one harmonics component is audible. He could even
"produce little melodies by sheer phase manipulations."

Summarizing:
Some monaural phase effects can be explained by the concept of the
inner spectrum, the spectrum available to the inner ear. This is
different than the spectrum at the outer ear due to non linearities
in the middle ear and inner ear. Identical external power spectra
can lead to substantially different inner spectra for different
phase angles.

Details:

Experiments were conducted where a 1020 Hz tone was presented and a
complex signal was used to mask the tone. The complex had a
fundamental frequency that was a submultiple of 1200 Hz and between
30 and 300 Hz. The total power spectrum of the masker was "speech
like" (1/f) and up to 6 kHz. The phase angles of the harmonics of
the masker were either constant (all equal) or random.

If the phase of the harmonics were random, the 1020 Hz had to be
greater than about 10 dB below the level of the fundamental to be
heard. As the fundamental fell below 100 Hz, the 1020 Hz had to be
louder to the point that for a 30 Hz fundamental, the 1020 Hz had to
be 2 dB louder than the fundamental. The reason is that more
harmonics were generated and these crowded around 1020 Hz.

If the phase of harmonics was constant, a very different picture
emerged. If the fundamental of the masker was above 150 Hz, the
level of the 1020 Hz had to be greater than about 4 dB below the
level of the fundamental to be heard. Below 150 Hz, the 1020 Hz
tone could be increasingly QUIETER and still be heard, to the point
that at 30 Hz, the 1020 Hz could be 38 dB below the fundamental's
level and still be heard.

The theory is that the constant phase signal has small "silent"
intervals where even a weak signal can be perceived i.e. unmasked.
This is an important distinction that is not predicted by critical
band masking theory, in fact, are actually inconsistent with
critical band masking theory.

Further convincing experiments were conducted that strongly
supported this theory.

The conclusion:
"Since speech signals have more nearly constant rather than random
phases the results reported here are believed to be relevant to the
perception of speech signals."
 

Blumlein 88

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#22
I've been meaning to look at some electronic gear, but REW using speakers shows a variety of phase angles for each harmonic. I'd assumed it was partly due to differences in distance from the driver, but I've not used REW for THD of electronics enough to remember what the phase of those harmonics are in the gear.
 
OP
pkane

pkane

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Thread Starter #23
Just an update on the website. The certificate problem should be resolved. I created a separate website for Distort, so there's no longer a conflict with DeltaWave:

https://distortaudio.org

You may have to clear the browser cache if you've visited it recently.
 

maty

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#25
Harmonic content is a side-effect of the non-linear transfer function applied to the signal in time domain. I don't see how it can control phase of individual harmonics, but I'll do some research.

[PDF] http://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_h2.pdf
The Importance of Phase

...So why is the phase important? Well, it's a subtle thing. I don't suppose everyone can hear it, and fewer particularly care, but from listening tests we learn that there is a tendency to interpret negative phase 2nd as giving a deeper soundstage and improved localization than otherwise. Positive phase seems to put the instruments and vocals closer and a little more in-your-face with enhanced detail.
Your results may vary, but when I first explored this with the SIT-1 amplifier at First Watt, I had a knob on the front of the amplifier which varied the amount and phase of the 2nd harmonic. It was easy enough to lend the amplifiers to listeners who didn't know what the knob did and gather their comments. Roughly speaking, they tended to prefer about 1% negative phase 2nd harmonic, so it became my standard setting for that knob...
An amplifier with some kind of knob to regulate the H2 phase.... would be a great idea.


PS: I can not download the new 1.0.6
 
Last edited:

Blumlein 88

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#26
PS: I can not download the new 1.0.6
I downloaded it without any trouble. What kind of problem were you seeing?
 

maty

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#27
Probably is my Firefox. It has a lot of security and privacy restrictions...

With MS Edge without problems.
 
Last edited:

digitalfrost

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#28
No, it's using WASAPI or ASIO. So you are saying the supported format is 24/48k but it's not working? Let me see if I can figure out why.
Code:
2019-12-01 10:51:52.0677|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Distort 1.0.6.0 starting up
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] AcourateASIO Virtual Driver
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] ASIO MADIface USB
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] cmasiopPCIX
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Focusrite USB ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] JackRouter
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Realtek ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter AUX Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Insert Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1988|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{39338c84-1684-4f44-96c4-b60575e1e8c7} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter AUX VAIO) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.2338|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{45892d3a-6fc0-4a71-8948-409322435e7e} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter VAIO) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.2678|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{60dd535a-145d-4d1d-bcbb-2de88bb2eb79} | [WASAPI] Headset Earphone (CORSAIR VOID PRO Wireless Gaming Headset) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3059|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{78fb1caa-a58c-4904-a871-c7b62967011a} | [WASAPI] ADAT (25-32) (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3399|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd} | [WASAPI] Speakers (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3725|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{e3c55242-e02d-427a-b9fb-4c83472acde6} | [WASAPI] JRiver Media Center 25 (JRiver Media Center 25) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3725|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Current driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4445|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] AcourateASIO Virtual Driver
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4445|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] ASIO MADIface USB
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] cmasiopPCIX
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Focusrite USB ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] JackRouter
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Realtek ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter AUX Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Insert Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5246|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{39338c84-1684-4f44-96c4-b60575e1e8c7} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter AUX VAIO) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5596|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{45892d3a-6fc0-4a71-8948-409322435e7e} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter VAIO) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5947|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{60dd535a-145d-4d1d-bcbb-2de88bb2eb79} | [WASAPI] Headset Earphone (CORSAIR VOID PRO Wireless Gaming Headset) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.6287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{78fb1caa-a58c-4904-a871-c7b62967011a} | [WASAPI] ADAT (25-32) (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.6657|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd} | [WASAPI] Speakers (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.7007|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{e3c55242-e02d-427a-b9fb-4c83472acde6} | [WASAPI] JRiver Media Center 25 (JRiver Media Center 25) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.7007|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Current driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}
2019-12-01 10:51:56.5349|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|---Measurements (for a simple sine-wave only)---

2019-12-01 10:51:59.6630|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Comparison THD   =    0dB
2019-12-01 10:52:02.0922|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Performing raw processing only -- all matching turned off
2019-12-01 10:52:02.0922|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|ProcessAll
2019-12-01 10:52:03.1979|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Distort v1.0.6, 2019-12-01T10:52:03.1969075+01:00
2019-12-01 10:52:03.1979|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Reference:  06 - You Shook Me All Night Long.flac[L] 10424652 samples 44100Hz 16bits, stereo, MD5=00
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Settings: 
    Gain:True, Remove DC:True
    Non-linear Gain EQ:False    Non-linear Phase EQ: False
    EQ FFT Size:65536, EQ Frequency Cut: 0Hz - 0Hz, EQ Threshold: -160dB
    Correct Drift:True, Precision:30
    Non-Linear drift Correction:False
    Upsample:False, Window:Hann
    Spectrum Window:Kaiser, Spectrum Size:65536
    Spectrogram Window:Hann, Spectrogram Size:4096, Spectrogram Steps:2048
    Dither:False
    Trim Silence:False

2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Stopped!
   at Wave.DistortForm.ProcessAll(Double[] L, Double[] L1, Int32 freq, Int32 freq1, Int32 freq2, Int32 bits1, Int32 bits2, Boolean bMatch, Boolean bLoadOnly, Boolean bApplyManual, Boolean bUpdateCharts) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 809
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Stopped! Files loaded
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Signature: 6f9852e5c205d7564142a8c90eb44afc
2019-12-01 10:52:03.4561|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|PlayAudio WASAPI Speakers (RME Digiface USB), 44100, 32 bits floating point. Trying to reduce to 32/48000
2019-12-01 10:52:17.7007|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Can't play audio to [[WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}]
   at Wave.AudioPlayer.PlayAudio(WaveSettings& s, Int32 rate, Double[]& volMult, Int32 idx, String driver, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, BlendType blend, Int64 pos, Int64 end, Func`2 ampl) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\AudioPlayer.cs:line 783
   at Wave.DistortForm.PlayAudio2(PlotView p, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, Int32 freq, Int32 idx, BlendType blend, Func`2 amp) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 2655
2019-12-01 10:52:50.8738|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|PlayAudio WASAPI Speakers (RME Digiface USB), 44100, 32 bits floating point. Trying to reduce to 32/48000
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2380|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2380|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/24
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2480|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/24
2019-12-01 10:52:54.6873|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Can't play audio to [[WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}]
   at Wave.AudioPlayer.PlayAudio(WaveSettings& s, Int32 rate, Double[]& volMult, Int32 idx, String driver, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, BlendType blend, Int64 pos, Int64 end, Func`2 ampl) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\AudioPlayer.cs:line 799
   at Wave.DistortForm.PlayAudio2(PlotView p, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, Int32 freq, Int32 idx, BlendType blend, Func`2 amp) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 2655
However, even if you fixed this, I couldn't really use the software. I use EqAPO as crossover. Doesn't work with ASIO or WASAPI.
 

Blumlein 88

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#29
Code:
2019-12-01 10:51:52.0677|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Distort 1.0.6.0 starting up
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] AcourateASIO Virtual Driver
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] ASIO MADIface USB
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] cmasiopPCIX
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Focusrite USB ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] JackRouter
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Realtek ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter AUX Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Insert Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1988|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{39338c84-1684-4f44-96c4-b60575e1e8c7} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter AUX VAIO) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.2338|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{45892d3a-6fc0-4a71-8948-409322435e7e} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter VAIO) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.2678|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{60dd535a-145d-4d1d-bcbb-2de88bb2eb79} | [WASAPI] Headset Earphone (CORSAIR VOID PRO Wireless Gaming Headset) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3059|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{78fb1caa-a58c-4904-a871-c7b62967011a} | [WASAPI] ADAT (25-32) (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3399|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd} | [WASAPI] Speakers (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3725|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{e3c55242-e02d-427a-b9fb-4c83472acde6} | [WASAPI] JRiver Media Center 25 (JRiver Media Center 25) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3725|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Current driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4445|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] AcourateASIO Virtual Driver
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4445|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] ASIO MADIface USB
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] cmasiopPCIX
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Focusrite USB ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] JackRouter
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Realtek ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter AUX Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Insert Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5246|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{39338c84-1684-4f44-96c4-b60575e1e8c7} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter AUX VAIO) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5596|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{45892d3a-6fc0-4a71-8948-409322435e7e} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter VAIO) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5947|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{60dd535a-145d-4d1d-bcbb-2de88bb2eb79} | [WASAPI] Headset Earphone (CORSAIR VOID PRO Wireless Gaming Headset) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.6287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{78fb1caa-a58c-4904-a871-c7b62967011a} | [WASAPI] ADAT (25-32) (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.6657|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd} | [WASAPI] Speakers (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.7007|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{e3c55242-e02d-427a-b9fb-4c83472acde6} | [WASAPI] JRiver Media Center 25 (JRiver Media Center 25) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.7007|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Current driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}
2019-12-01 10:51:56.5349|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|---Measurements (for a simple sine-wave only)---

2019-12-01 10:51:59.6630|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Comparison THD   =    0dB
2019-12-01 10:52:02.0922|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Performing raw processing only -- all matching turned off
2019-12-01 10:52:02.0922|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|ProcessAll
2019-12-01 10:52:03.1979|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Distort v1.0.6, 2019-12-01T10:52:03.1969075+01:00
2019-12-01 10:52:03.1979|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Reference:  06 - You Shook Me All Night Long.flac[L] 10424652 samples 44100Hz 16bits, stereo, MD5=00
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Settings:
    Gain:True, Remove DC:True
    Non-linear Gain EQ:False    Non-linear Phase EQ: False
    EQ FFT Size:65536, EQ Frequency Cut: 0Hz - 0Hz, EQ Threshold: -160dB
    Correct Drift:True, Precision:30
    Non-Linear drift Correction:False
    Upsample:False, Window:Hann
    Spectrum Window:Kaiser, Spectrum Size:65536
    Spectrogram Window:Hann, Spectrogram Size:4096, Spectrogram Steps:2048
    Dither:False
    Trim Silence:False

2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Stopped!
   at Wave.DistortForm.ProcessAll(Double[] L, Double[] L1, Int32 freq, Int32 freq1, Int32 freq2, Int32 bits1, Int32 bits2, Boolean bMatch, Boolean bLoadOnly, Boolean bApplyManual, Boolean bUpdateCharts) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 809
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Stopped! Files loaded
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Signature: 6f9852e5c205d7564142a8c90eb44afc
2019-12-01 10:52:03.4561|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|PlayAudio WASAPI Speakers (RME Digiface USB), 44100, 32 bits floating point. Trying to reduce to 32/48000
2019-12-01 10:52:17.7007|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Can't play audio to [[WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}]
   at Wave.AudioPlayer.PlayAudio(WaveSettings& s, Int32 rate, Double[]& volMult, Int32 idx, String driver, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, BlendType blend, Int64 pos, Int64 end, Func`2 ampl) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\AudioPlayer.cs:line 783
   at Wave.DistortForm.PlayAudio2(PlotView p, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, Int32 freq, Int32 idx, BlendType blend, Func`2 amp) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 2655
2019-12-01 10:52:50.8738|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|PlayAudio WASAPI Speakers (RME Digiface USB), 44100, 32 bits floating point. Trying to reduce to 32/48000
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2380|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2380|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/24
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2480|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/24
2019-12-01 10:52:54.6873|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Can't play audio to [[WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}]
   at Wave.AudioPlayer.PlayAudio(WaveSettings& s, Int32 rate, Double[]& volMult, Int32 idx, String driver, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, BlendType blend, Int64 pos, Int64 end, Func`2 ampl) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\AudioPlayer.cs:line 799
   at Wave.DistortForm.PlayAudio2(PlotView p, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, Int32 freq, Int32 idx, BlendType blend, Func`2 amp) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 2655
However, even if you fixed this, I couldn't really use the software. I use EqAPO as crossover. Doesn't work with ASIO or WASAPI.
You can save the distorted file. And listen to it like any other. Not as convenient, but useful.
 

solderdude

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#30
Probably is my Firefox. It has a lot of security and privacy restrictions...

With MS Edge without problems.
My Firefox downloaded it fine (Linux Mint)
 

maty

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#31
I have so restrictions that is more easy to use other browser!

I can upload some tracks of the 24/192 vinyl rip, edited with Audacity to limited to 60", if there are people interested. Maybe in 24/192 WAV and so whoever wants to downgrade them to 24/96, 24/48 or 24/44 FLAC. Better always 24 bits to avoid the dithering effect in the sound. In Mega.

Distort-tracks-maty-selection.png


DR13 -0.76 dB -17.87 dB A1 Eduard Strauss - Bahn Frei Polka
DR11 -0.75 dB -15.40 dB A4 Martin Vatter - Exiting
DR15 -0.63 dB -18.40 dB B1 California Project - Wouldn't It Be Nice
DR13 -0.51 dB -17.32 dB B2 Lyn Stanley - Over The Rainbow
DR11 -0.53 dB -14.27 dB C1 Jacob Bellens - Benaeath A Cloud
DR13 -0.54 dB -15.94 dB C3 Paul Kuhn And The Best - Young At Heart
DR9 -0.29 dB -11.80 dB D2 Brian Flanagan - Whole Lot Of Livin
DR14 -0.25 dB -17.74 dB D3 Ron Nelson - Rocky Point Holiday
 
Last edited:

solderdude

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#32
Why downgrade vinyl rips even further, they are by definition already loaded with harmonics that weren't in the original recording.
It makes more sense to use well made digital recordings.
 

maty

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#33
Well, the master is digital. Mint, without clicks or... and any treatment with iZotope; only captured in 32/192 WAV, edited and converted to 24/192 FLAC.

It is about checking if we notice differences.
 

solderdude

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#34
The master may be digital but the cutting and playback alter the original sound in FR response and harmonic content so no matter how one twists and turns it the rip will already have added harmonics that can't be removed, only made 'worse'

A test you could do it to get the original digital version and add harmonics till you find the sound is about the same. You may also have to change the FR to match that of the playback cartridge+wires+RIAA correction deviations.
 
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pkane

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Thread Starter #35
Code:
2019-12-01 10:51:52.0677|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Distort 1.0.6.0 starting up
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] AcourateASIO Virtual Driver
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] ASIO MADIface USB
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] cmasiopPCIX
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Focusrite USB ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] JackRouter
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Realtek ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter AUX Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Insert Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1377|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.1988|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{39338c84-1684-4f44-96c4-b60575e1e8c7} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter AUX VAIO) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.2338|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{45892d3a-6fc0-4a71-8948-409322435e7e} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter VAIO) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.2678|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{60dd535a-145d-4d1d-bcbb-2de88bb2eb79} | [WASAPI] Headset Earphone (CORSAIR VOID PRO Wireless Gaming Headset) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3059|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{78fb1caa-a58c-4904-a871-c7b62967011a} | [WASAPI] ADAT (25-32) (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3399|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd} | [WASAPI] Speakers (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3725|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{e3c55242-e02d-427a-b9fb-4c83472acde6} | [WASAPI] JRiver Media Center 25 (JRiver Media Center 25) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.3725|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Current driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4445|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] AcourateASIO Virtual Driver
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4445|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] ASIO MADIface USB
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] cmasiopPCIX
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Focusrite USB ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4555|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] JackRouter
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Realtek ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter AUX Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Insert Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.4655|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [ASIO] Voicemeeter Virtual ASIO
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5246|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{39338c84-1684-4f44-96c4-b60575e1e8c7} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter AUX VAIO) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5596|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{45892d3a-6fc0-4a71-8948-409322435e7e} | [WASAPI] Speakers (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter VAIO) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.5947|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{60dd535a-145d-4d1d-bcbb-2de88bb2eb79} | [WASAPI] Headset Earphone (CORSAIR VOID PRO Wireless Gaming Headset) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.6287|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{78fb1caa-a58c-4904-a871-c7b62967011a} | [WASAPI] ADAT (25-32) (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.6657|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd} | [WASAPI] Speakers (RME Digiface USB) 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.7007|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Adding driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{e3c55242-e02d-427a-b9fb-4c83472acde6} | [WASAPI] JRiver Media Center 25 (JRiver Media Center 25) 44100/32
2019-12-01 10:51:52.7007|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Current driver: [WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}
2019-12-01 10:51:56.5349|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|---Measurements (for a simple sine-wave only)---

2019-12-01 10:51:59.6630|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Comparison THD   =    0dB
2019-12-01 10:52:02.0922|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Performing raw processing only -- all matching turned off
2019-12-01 10:52:02.0922|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|ProcessAll
2019-12-01 10:52:03.1979|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Distort v1.0.6, 2019-12-01T10:52:03.1969075+01:00
2019-12-01 10:52:03.1979|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Reference:  06 - You Shook Me All Night Long.flac[L] 10424652 samples 44100Hz 16bits, stereo, MD5=00
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Settings:
    Gain:True, Remove DC:True
    Non-linear Gain EQ:False    Non-linear Phase EQ: False
    EQ FFT Size:65536, EQ Frequency Cut: 0Hz - 0Hz, EQ Threshold: -160dB
    Correct Drift:True, Precision:30
    Non-Linear drift Correction:False
    Upsample:False, Window:Hann
    Spectrum Window:Kaiser, Spectrum Size:65536
    Spectrogram Window:Hann, Spectrogram Size:4096, Spectrogram Steps:2048
    Dither:False
    Trim Silence:False

2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Stopped!
   at Wave.DistortForm.ProcessAll(Double[] L, Double[] L1, Int32 freq, Int32 freq1, Int32 freq2, Int32 bits1, Int32 bits2, Boolean bMatch, Boolean bLoadOnly, Boolean bApplyManual, Boolean bUpdateCharts) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 809
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Stopped! Files loaded
2019-12-01 10:52:03.2009|INFO|Wave.DistortForm|Signature: 6f9852e5c205d7564142a8c90eb44afc
2019-12-01 10:52:03.4561|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|PlayAudio WASAPI Speakers (RME Digiface USB), 44100, 32 bits floating point. Trying to reduce to 32/48000
2019-12-01 10:52:17.7007|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Can't play audio to [[WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}]
   at Wave.AudioPlayer.PlayAudio(WaveSettings& s, Int32 rate, Double[]& volMult, Int32 idx, String driver, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, BlendType blend, Int64 pos, Int64 end, Func`2 ampl) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\AudioPlayer.cs:line 783
   at Wave.DistortForm.PlayAudio2(PlotView p, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, Int32 freq, Int32 idx, BlendType blend, Func`2 amp) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 2655
2019-12-01 10:52:50.8738|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|PlayAudio WASAPI Speakers (RME Digiface USB), 44100, 32 bits floating point. Trying to reduce to 32/48000
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2380|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/32
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2380|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/24
2019-12-01 10:52:52.2480|ERROR|Wave.AudioPlayer|Couldn't open wasapi device with 48000/24
2019-12-01 10:52:54.6873|ERROR|Wave.DistortForm|Can't play audio to [[WASAPI]{0.0.0.00000000}.{84c301ba-d76d-4657-8679-b15f37d191dd}]
   at Wave.AudioPlayer.PlayAudio(WaveSettings& s, Int32 rate, Double[]& volMult, Int32 idx, String driver, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, BlendType blend, Int64 pos, Int64 end, Func`2 ampl) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\AudioPlayer.cs:line 799
   at Wave.DistortForm.PlayAudio2(PlotView p, Double[] L1, Double[] L2, Int32 freq, Int32 idx, BlendType blend, Func`2 amp) in C:\Users\ypa\Documents\Visual Studio 2015\Projects\Distort\Wave\DistortForm.cs:line 2655
However, even if you fixed this, I couldn't really use the software. I use EqAPO as crossover. Doesn't work with ASIO or WASAPI.
It appears that DISTORT did try to open the device with 24/48000 settings and failed. Did you say that's what should work? Or is it because it's not WASAPI or ASIO compatible? The driver didn't like this setting. I see that I did make one mistake. I was going to try 16 bits, after 24, and it looks like it tried 24 twice :(

As @Blumlein 88 said, you can still use DISTORT, just have to save the file first. So you think DirectSound will work with EqAPO?
 

maty

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#36
Capercaillie - Secret People (1993), CD, Survival, UK
DR14 0.00 dB -16.32 dB 4:46 01-Bonaparte

Distort-105-H2-73-H3-90-Bonaparte-16-44.png


16/44. Female vocal + acoustic instruments + synthesized. I like more without, aka Bypass.

"Afro percussion, dancefloor synth zaps, funky soulful organ, and shaftular wah-wah, reeling fiddles and whistles overlaid with the poised and elegant voice of Karen Matheson" (Q Mag)

"Few woman fronting any kind of British band possess a voice to touch Karen Matheson's, remarkable in English but breathtaking when she draws on Hebridean roots to sing in Gaelic" (Daily Telegraph)
 
Last edited:

digitalfrost

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#37
Yeah, anything that doesn't use the device exclusively will work - MME/WDM/DS. I'm using the RME MADIface drivers, 0.9685 (latest atm). Card is set to 24/48. So while EqAPO will not work with ASIO/WASAPI, DISTORT should at least do something and not just fail.
 
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pkane

pkane

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Thread Starter #38
Yeah, anything that doesn't use the device exclusively will work - MME/WDM/DS. I'm using the RME MADIface drivers, 0.9685 (latest atm). Card is set to 24/48. So while EqAPO will not work with ASIO/WASAPI, DISTORT should at least do something and not just fail.
So it fails and exits the software? Or just displays an error message and continues?

I'll look into adding support for DirectSound.
 
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