Audio stutters with USB Dacs on Macbook M1 Pro

[Veri]

The jitterbug didn't help on my side, but now I have one, I guess? I figure it might be useful some day I'd like to take it apart... feels very snake-oilish to me...

Definitely..

 

[IHeartAudio]

I have the same issue (with a RME ADI-2 DAC). Let me state some lessons that I learned over the roughly past year:

• High memory usage can reproduce the issue reliably.
• Increasing the sampling rate to 192 kHz intensifies the stuttering (to the extent that I even hear a tiny stutter via the integrated speakers on rare occasions when they are set to their maximum of 96 kHz, still the issue is much more pronounce for external USB audio interfaces)
• The issue also persists with a fresh installation of macOS (I had my laptop checked and wiped at an Apple Store).
• The issue started with a MacBook Pro 14" M1 Pro. Just as others, I had no issue with my previous Intel MacBook Pro.

The glitches are also mentioned in other parts of the internet, but it seems like there is no critical mass so far for Apple or audio interface manufacturers to acknowledge the problem:

• https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=29658
• https://forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=36868
• https://discussions.apple.com/thread/253476970
• https://discussions.apple.com/thread/253604816
• https://discussions.apple.com/thread/252727766
• https://discussions.apple.com/thread/254047956
• https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/m1-pro-macbook-pro-use-with-third-party-dac-amps-daps.2324227/
• Reddit

Get in touch with Apple (especially if you have AppleCare+), point out our your issue and make sure that your voice is heard! Furthermore, use the Feedback Assistant app integrated in macOS to report the issue. It's not acceptable that we buy devices for thousands of dollars and they cannot even play music properly.

Moreover, get in touch with your audio interface manufacturers and report the issue.

I too have the RME ADI-2 DAC. I've had a ticket open with Apple since January 21st going back and forth with a support person and the last we spoke, my case was with the engineers and got escalated to some I assume better engineers. I've spent at least 10+ hours on the phone with Apple personnel and have done fresh installs, different users, different apps, different Thunderbolt Docks (Caldigit TS4 and OWC Thunderbolt Pro Dock), different USB hubs, different cables, and different ports. I got audio stutters once my memory pressure got near yellow. I didn't need to be yellow, just close to it. I'm continuing my efforts with Apple and I too recommend others do the same rather than sitting around hoping for a fix. We need numbers.

 

[jayadubya]

I too have the RME ADI-2 DAC. I've had a ticket open with Apple since January 21st going back and forth with a support person and the last we spoke, my case was with the engineers and got escalated to some I assume better engineers. I've spent at least 10+ hours on the phone with Apple personnel and have done fresh installs, different users, different apps, different Thunderbolt Docks (Caldigit TS4 and OWC Thunderbolt Pro Dock), different USB hubs, different cables, and different ports. I got audio stutters once my memory pressure got near yellow. I didn't need to be yellow, just close to it. I'm continuing my efforts with Apple and I too recommend others do the same rather than sitting around hoping for a fix. We need numbers.

That's a lot of troubleshooting! Dang. I'm working on another open ticket with Apple, and I think I'll start another for this. I can only imagine it will get elevated soon. I have to think it affects thousands of M1 users, conservatively. I realize not all, but anyone using a USB DAC (and probably other USB devices).

I switched over to Safari from Chrome to see if it makes a difference, and it is less common. That surprised me! I've been trying to get Element and a DAW setup to get that audio buffering in place, but I haven't been able to get that fully sorted yet.

 

[jayadubya]

Definitely..

On that note, very slightly used Jitterbug FMJ for sale! ! $50 obo. Mostly kidding, well... am I? I'll probably sell it on ebay There's a real taste for snake oil there!

 

[bellamy]

That's a lot of troubleshooting! Dang. I'm working on another open ticket with Apple, and I think I'll start another for this. I can only imagine it will get elevated soon. I have to think it affects thousands of M1 users, conservatively. I realize not all, but anyone using a USB DAC (and probably other USB devices).

I switched over to Safari from Chrome to see if it makes a difference, and it is less common. That surprised me! I've been trying to get Element and a DAW setup to get that audio buffering in place, but I haven't been able to get that fully sorted yet.

I read your post about using eqMac, unfortunately this method didn't work for me. I can't really tell if it's stuttering less, but it does still stutter from time to time (in fact, it stutters 5 times while I'm writing this ). Maybe anyone got better results with eqMac?

I'll give it a few days more to test out. I did consider using SoundSource, but I don't want to deal with lowering the security settings right now.

 

[jayadubya]

@IHeartAudio - I opened a ticket with Apple, and coincidentally I'm talking to an engineer at some point today (or a help rep). I took it to a genius bar, which solved nothing, but they were interested in tracking it down and troubleshooting. The customer service person I talked to didn't seem to think this was an 'open' or known issue, which I found surprising.

I do know they track case numbers, however, so feel free to give them mine, and if you want to share yours I will pass it along:
Case: 101946331698
Product: MacBook Pro (14-inch,2021)

Seems unlikely they could ignore or not link together their own ticket numbers!

 

[IHeartAudio]

@IHeartAudio - I opened a ticket with Apple, and coincidentally I'm talking to an engineer at some point today (or a help rep). I took it to a genius bar, which solved nothing, but they were interested in tracking it down and troubleshooting. The customer service person I talked to didn't seem to think this was an 'open' or known issue, which I found surprising.

I do know they track case numbers, however, so feel free to give them mine, and if you want to share yours I will pass it along:
Case: 101946331698
Product: MacBook Pro (14-inch,2021)

Seems unlikely they could ignore or not link together their own ticket numbers!

I've submitted logs and all sorts of crap. I love the hell out of this laptop except for this issue but as a lover of music and my ADI-2 DAC, this issue is so painful

Here's mine. My last communication with them was on April 1st and was the guy saying he hadn't heard back from engineering yet and he's sending a follow up.

Case Number: 101918860794
Product: MacBook Pro (14-inch,2021)

 

[etny]

Workaround: use the HDMI out on the MAC and an hdmi audio extractor connected to the TOSLINK in of your DAC (I'm using an RME Fireface UCXII). No more stutters. Of course, it's totally unacceptable from Apple. It's obviously a chip bug/limitation. Until they fix it (don't hold your breath), do yourself a favor: spend $20 and enjoy the music...

 

[gabxav]

My solution was to leave an ipad mini 6 on my desk and connect the DAC directly to it, then i can listen to music and watch my clips without crashes.

 

[jayadubya]

Welp, I've (currently) fixed the problem! After a long session with Apple's senior support folks, I went into a full safeboot, had my USB DAC plugged in, opened Tidal and no audio skipping. I'm kind of thrilled, because this has been driving me crazy for months now.

That's obviously not a 'fix' yet, but I have a follow-up call scheduled today to dig into it further. In safe mode I slowly re-opened each of the apps I normally use for work to see if things were compatible, and so far everything is nominal. That's actually confusing, because it means something else is loading up in normal mode to cause this issue.

Either way, I can confidently say that the issue is no longer present - so the M1 MB Pro can do it! More as I troubleshoot things further.

 

[qvanphong]

Welp, I've (currently) fixed the problem! After a long session with Apple's senior support folks, I went into a full safeboot, had my USB DAC plugged in, opened Tidal and no audio skipping. I'm kind of thrilled, because this has been driving me crazy for months now.

That's obviously not a 'fix' yet, but I have a follow-up call scheduled today to dig into it further. In safe mode I slowly re-opened each of the apps I normally use for work to see if things were compatible, and so far everything is nominal. That's actually confusing, because it means something else is loading up in normal mode to cause this issue.

Either way, I can confidently say that the issue is no longer present - so the M1 MB Pro can do it! More as I troubleshoot things further.

I just tried to boot into safe boot, the audio skipping/stutter still happens sometimes, but it improved dramatically

 

[jayadubya]

The other advice was to try a fresh, new admin account, and that's had the same effect as far as I can tell. A few intermittent skips, almost all when I'm carrying out actions within Chrome or Safari. I'll keep updating as I dig into this with the Apple Rep.

I think I was able to figure out that the skipping wasn't caused by any background software I was using (except of course for Chrome). And given the skipping tends to start about 4 hours after a reboot/restart, it suggests to me it's cache/memory related (which others on the thread have pointed out).

 

[Axo1989]

My audio has been behaving well since I posted (back in February I think) after adjusting my web browser habits and not leaving a gazillion tabs/pages open (Safari in my case but others have said they get the same thing in Chrome which isn't surprising as I think it's an OS/memory/audio process/priority issue rather than an app or DAC issue). That change basically obviated the issue and I haven't had to try any of the more elaborate measures.

Yesterday I got an audio pause/stutter again when opening a new web page/tab and noticed I had a whole lot of web browser action going on, which was repeatable. Closing a lot of that stuff made the issue go away again. I haven't tried Apple support yet, but may get around to it just to add my insignificant weight toward them addressing the issue.

 

[IHeartAudio]

My audio has been behaving well since I posted (back in February I think) after adjusting my web browser habits and not leaving a gazillion tabs/pages open (Safari in my case but others have said they get the same thing in Chrome which isn't surprising as I think it's an OS/memory/audio process/priority issue rather than an app or DAC issue). That change basically obviated the issue and I haven't had to try any of the more elaborate measures.

Yesterday I got an audio pause/stutter again when opening a new web page/tab and noticed I had a whole lot of web browser action going on, which was repeatable. Closing a lot of that stuff made the issue go away again. I haven't tried Apple support yet, but may get around to it just to add my insignificant weight toward them addressing the issue.

It's directly tied to memory usage. I can also make it skip when loading a bunch of sounds in my DAW. Such a dumb problem considering I have older, slower computers that never drop audio behind memory usage. I've given Apple soooooo much data on this issue. The fact that they still don't have a resolution lets me know not enough people are reporting the issue or Apple just doesn't care.

 

[etny]

Using the HDMI out of the Mac into a Monoprice BlackbirdTM 4K Series 7.1 Audio Extractor (with bitstream audio), 24 bits 48kHz, into a Schitt Modius via Toslink, into an amp. Zero drops so far, and I can't tell the difference from USB in sound quality (RME Toslink was ADAT, so not a good option, which is why I'm posting again with an updated config). This should work with any Toslink SPDIF-enabled DAC.

 

[IHeartAudio]

Using the HDMI out of the Mac into a Monoprice BlackbirdTM 4K Series 7.1 Audio Extractor (with bitstream audio), 24 bits 48kHz, into a Schitt Modius via Toslink, into an amp. Zero drops so far, and I can't tell the difference from USB in sound quality (RME Toslink was ADAT, so not a good option, which is why I'm posting again with an updated config). This should work with any Toslink SPDIF-enabled DAC.

Just ordered it. There are cheaper ones but my experience with Monoprice has been good so I went that route. I'll update with my results tomorrow when it's delivered. If it works, I'll just enjoy my music this way and I'll check my USB experience every time Apple releases a software update.

 

[Axo1989]

It's directly tied to memory usage. I can also make it skip when loading a bunch of sounds in my DAW. Such a dumb problem considering I have older, slower computers that never drop audio behind memory usage. I've given Apple soooooo much data on this issue. The fact that they still don't have a resolution lets me know not enough people are reporting the issue or Apple just doesn't care.

Memory architecture is quite different between the older Apple Intel models and their newer Apple silicon SoCs. Web browsing is an easy way to ramp up the memory pressures on my smaller M2 laptop. I wouldn't be surprised if other apps that grab a lot of memory do the same thing.

 

[elderbank]

I have the same issue on usb c output vs 3.5mm.. killing firefox and restarting fixes the issue as firefox for me is the main resource hog plus i play youtube so not sure that has any role to play

 

[IHeartAudio]

So I bought the Insignia HDMI Audio Extractor instead. Amazon delayed my order and made me dig around a little more and I preferred the Insignia due to it using micro-USB rather than a barrel plug charger. I have a ton of micro USB cables and USB-C to micro USB adapters which I highly prefer over barrel plugs as USB Hubs, monitors, TVs etc can all power the Insignia.

My M1 Pro MacBook is pretty slammed right now and hasn't skipped a beat. Normally if I'm this high on memory usage, I can force audio drops by just scrolling on a page or swapping tabs.

 

[raygun]

I've been following this thread as I've been pulling my hair out with my new SMSL c200 DAC with 2021 MBP M1 Pro and the stutters.

I've plugged in my older Audioengine D1 and I'm not getting any stutters at all? Could this be a USB1 vs USB2 thing?

Anyone think of a reason why this would work?