Oristo
Member
Having done both (not for AES), conference papers are more often about relatively recent innovations.
Journal paper reviewers will want more references to related journal papers (implicitly including theirs).
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Audio Engineering Society Paper and Help?
- Thread starter amirm
- Start date
Journal paper reviewers will want more references to related journal papers (implicitly including theirs).
Oristo
Member
Perhaps a focus on the conjecture (hypothesis?) that SINAD correlates with preference.
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thecheapseats
Addicted to Fun and Learning
hey - I like that angle...
I think we are putting the cart before the horse here. You need to write the paper you want, and then edit to fit the journal format/requirements. Also, why the rush to make this specific conference/journal issue? If this is your first thought to mine the ASR data, why rush the first attempt?
And if it's science, then attempt to do some science. What specific conclusions can be made from ASR data? For instance, floorstander speakers are always advertised as full-range speakers. What % of those tested actually meet this claim, within -3db @ 20 Hz?
Just some thoughts. I was involved with biology research papers 35 years ago...
And if it's science, then attempt to do some science. What specific conclusions can be made from ASR data? For instance, floorstander speakers are always advertised as full-range speakers. What % of those tested actually meet this claim, within -3db @ 20 Hz?
Just some thoughts. I was involved with biology research papers 35 years ago...
A lot of journals have a "proposal" process don't they? You submit more of an outline rather than write an entire paper and get feedback and proceed from there? AES for conference papers seemed to be soliciting "proposals".
You sort of hit the nail on the head with that example. What is "science" for purposes of a J. AES paper? Respectfully, is your example even "science"? Testing the speakers in accordance with scientific/professional standards is science, but it is established science. (Klippel is a Silver Medal recipient from AES and has published numerous articles in their journal relating to new methods of testing transducers and speakers). "Full range" is science, but established long ago. So testing speakers to see what their true bottom end is, that isn't really new science appropriate for publication is it? Assuming it is "archival" (of significant interest to members) as required by AES, like the directivity index database paper I quoted above, the fact that test results don't meet manufacturer specifications isn't science is it? (I'm sincerely asking, because it seems to be more "commerciality" which is frowned upon by AES in their publication guidelines).
I understand that was probably a quick example to give, but this seems to me to be the crux of the problem. The way the testing data and reviews are discussed in this Forum is using science to obtain objective data for consumers to evaluate and to also factor in specifications and price. That's probably not going to get published in a professional journal by AES, IEEE, etc.
However, the data that has been obtained in all of the testing can be reshaped into something that would be accepted and published by those types of journals, the key is finding out what they consider to be of interest to their "membership." That is something I am struggling with and can only offer examples of what has been accepted in the past.
For example, here is a fairly recent paper given as a presentation regarding a new method of speaker testing relating to distortion. As someone suggested earlier if we can help @amirm find a paper, any paper, that he can build upon, go the next step, connect the dots, with his data (speakers, dacs, amps, speaker wire, whatever) that gets your foot in the door and a much greater chance of being accepted, just like the example below did. I have attached the actual article because it is an AES "open-acess" paper.
The introduction doesn't contain any references/citations where I thought it should, I guess their discussion about distortion testing in loudspeakers is just so well-established it doesn't require any. They do sort of have a string of references at one point (2 - 7) which are these:
[3] Fielder, L. D. and Benjamin, E. M., “Subwoofer Performance for Accurate Reproduction of Mu-
sic,” J. Audio Eng. Soc, 36(6), pp. 443–456, 1988.
[4] Keele Jr., D. B., “Development of Test Signals for the EIA-426-B Loudspeaker Power Rating
Compact Disk,” in Audio Engineering Society Convention 111, 2001.
[5] Voishvillo, A., “Measurements and Perception of Nonlinear Distortion—Comparing Numbers and
Sound Quality,” in Audio Engineering Society
Convention 123, 2007.
[6]Starobin,B.,“CEA-2010:StandardMethodof MeasurementforPoweredSubwoofers,”2010. [7]Temme,S.andBrunet,P.,“ANewMethodfor MeasuringDistortionUsingaMultitoneStimulus andNoncoherence,”J.AudioEng.Soc,56(3),pp. 176–188,2008.
Use of Repetitive Multi-Tone Sequences to Estimate Nonlinear Response of a Loudspeaker to Music
Aside from frequency response, loudspeaker distortion measurements are perhaps the most commonly used metrics to appraise loudspeaker performance. Unfortunately the stimuli utilized for many types of distortion measurements are not complex waveforms such as music or speech, thus the measured distortion characteristics of the DUT may not typically reflect the performance of the device when reproducing usual program material. To this end, the topic of this paper will be the exploration of a new multi-tone sequence stimulus to measure loudspeaker system distortion. This method gives a reliable estimation of the average nonlinear distortion produced with music on a loudspeaker system and delivers a global objective assessment of the distortion for a DUT in normal use case.
Open
Access
Authors: Brunet, Pascal; Decanio, William; Banka, Ritesh; Yuan, Shenli
Affiliations: Samsung Research America, Valencia, CA USA; Audio Group - Digital Media Solutions; Samsung Research America, Valencia, CA, USA; Center for Computer Research in Music and Acoustics (CCRMA), Stanford University, Stanford, CA, USA(See document for exact affiliation information.)
AES Convention: 143 (October 2017) Paper Number: 9827 Permalink
Publication Date: October 8, 2017 Import into BibTeX
Subject: Transducers—Part 1
Attempting to build upon this idea. I think exploring the possibility of doing a joint paper with someone at Audio Precision would be an almost sure way to get on the presentation track (assuming the topics fit this year's theme(s), and have a paper published. Mark Martin had multiple papers published for Fall 2018 meeting. Big incentive for a current AP to come on board given the testing utilized. Bruce Hofer also has had a couple of papers published.
If you could get Dr. Richard Cabot, he is of course no longer there, doing his own consulting work, but if he was interested in co-authoring a paper it would for sure go in, along with the dozen or so he already has at AES and the 50 some odd total for IEC, IEEE, SMTP, etc, etc., He is currently the head of all AES Standards work, so there might be an angle there.
Klippel would also be good, but his 1/2 dozen articles are all tied in some way to the interrelationship between testing and design and/or manufacturing (QC). His AES papers all refer back to testing to AES standards. He worked for Floyd at Research Council and also at Harmon/JBL before returning to Germany, so he had a great mentor when it comes to papers for publication.
These are the ones I am aware of on here (besides the obvious ones previously mentioned):
@Tokyo_John
@Taiga
@Thomas_A and
@mhardy6647
What about @dualazmak? He has published papers.
Not actually "papers" on audio, but I have an intensive blog-style project thread in ASR Forum having Hyperlink Index here and here;
(I published so many peer-reviewed scientific papers in my field of profession, though...)
sam_adams
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That should be "dacs, amplifiers, and speakers" because you will be surprised when Kennedy, Stalin and two strippers show up to the party.
O' you are so modest.Not actually "papers" on audio, but I have an intensive blog-style project thread in ASR Forum having Hyperlink Index here and here;
(I published so many peer-reviewed scientific papers in my field of profession, though...)
OP
- Thread Starter
- #52
I contacted Dr. Toole and as usual he gave some good advice. Namely, present it as a conference paper or an engineering/review paper. One nice thing about the former is that we don't need to worry about typsetting profiles, etc. (they still use ancient LaTex).
On topic of getting AES interest, it is not an issue I worry about. I think they will be interested. But even if they are not, we can publish it here and I can do a video on it as well. Heaven knows we have more reach than AES anyway.
The real thing I need at this point is a collaborator/researcher. Someone I can bounce ideas with it and who is willing to do some data mining to collect the necessary information we need for the paper. We could for example do a statistical analysis of all the speaker reviewed, from frequency response to sensitivity. Personally I love to have such summary data.
On topic of getting AES interest, it is not an issue I worry about. I think they will be interested. But even if they are not, we can publish it here and I can do a video on it as well. Heaven knows we have more reach than AES anyway.
The real thing I need at this point is a collaborator/researcher. Someone I can bounce ideas with it and who is willing to do some data mining to collect the necessary information we need for the paper. We could for example do a statistical analysis of all the speaker reviewed, from frequency response to sensitivity. Personally I love to have such summary data.
Oh man, I wish I had any bona fides in this area. Such an assignment sounds like a lot of fun. Someone is going to have the time of their life.I contacted Dr. Toole and as usual he gave some good advice. Namely, present it as a conference paper or an engineering/review paper. One nice thing about the former is that we don't need to worry about typsetting profiles, etc. (they still use ancient LaTex).
On topic of getting AES interest, it is not an issue I worry about. I think they will be interested. But even if they are not, we can publish it here and I can do a video on it as well. Heaven knows we have more reach than AES anyway.
The real thing I need at this point is a collaborator/researcher. Someone I can bounce ideas with it and who is willing to do some data mining to collect the necessary information we need for the paper. We could for example do a statistical analysis of all the speaker reviewed, from frequency response to sensitivity. Personally I love to have such summary data.
The problem for me to support is two; time and that my area of expertise is different (infectious diseases and microbiology). I am currently submitting one article and have a couple more on the way.
That said and IMO speakers and headphones data would be nice to compile in groups with scores (e.g. six groups 1-2, 2-3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6, >6). Analysing median & SD for the curves and bass deviations. Personally I would be interested also in a 1-5 kHz region analysis.
Capitol C
Active Member
Amir,I contacted Dr. Toole and as usual he gave some good advice. Namely, present it as a conference paper or an engineering/review paper. One nice thing about the former is that we don't need to worry about typsetting profiles, etc. (they still use ancient LaTex).
On topic of getting AES interest, it is not an issue I worry about. I think they will be interested. But even if they are not, we can publish it here and I can do a video on it as well. Heaven knows we have more reach than AES anyway.
The real thing I need at this point is a collaborator/researcher. Someone I can bounce ideas with it and who is willing to do some data mining to collect the necessary information we need for the paper. We could for example do a statistical analysis of all the speaker reviewed, from frequency response to sensitivity. Personally I love to have such summary data.
I've written quite a few papers that have appeared in the physics literature (https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=M9VpMCMAAAAJ&hl=en). I think I could help with "how to put together a paper so that people will read beyond the abstract" , editing, dealing with referees without having your blood pressure go up, etc. It is a very good idea to build a bridge between ASR and AES.
Chris (Capitol C)
PS In my field, conference papers are quick publications to tell the latest news, journal papers present work that has more depth and substance.
thecheapseats
Addicted to Fun and Learning
^^^ grab this guy...
OP
- Thread Starter
- #57
Wonderful. I was about to lose hope! I will start a conversation....
Glad @amirm and @Capitol C connected.
Again, I’m happy to help in any way I can, but will probably be limited to doing background research you need on previous presentations and papers submitted to AES, research review (e.g., history of testing speakers/audio equipment, methods) for use as cited references in the paper.
Travis
The way back machine seems to cover this site, but maybe one shouldn't rely on the coverage being complete: https://web.archive.org/web/sitemap/https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php
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