Topping Pre90 Review (preamplifier)

[DHT 845]

From Pre90 I use RCA out to my tube monoblocks. I did not try XLR-RCA adapter from pre , no issues as I said.

 

[CristiK]

I had the volume control issue pop up briefly with my unit. I was using an XLR to RCA adapter that may have played a part. I am able to use the unit without this adapter and I am now doing so and now the volume control works as expected.

I have had many pre amps in my system and to me the Pre90 is the best. It switches between sources and outputs, changes the volume but does not do anything else. If you think that is somehow "clinical" you are partly right. If you want something different and more colored I suggest you try tubes. Personally I find the way the Pre90 reveals textures and musical intentions addictive and enjoyable.

DHT 845 mentioned Electrocompaniet pre amps above. I have had one and while it looked truly gorgeous the sound quality left a lot to be desired.

All my connections (except USB to D70S) were XLR, with Chord Clearway cables, exception being from D70s to Pre90, using Topping XLR cables :-(
I do maintain my opinion that Pre90 has a marvelous sound
What EC preamp did you have, can you remember? Thank you!

 

[Peternz]

All my connections (except USB to D70S) were XLR, with Chord Clearway cables, exception being from D70s to Pre90, using Topping XLR cables :-(
I do maintain my opinion that Pre90 has a marvelous sound
What EC preamp did you have, can you remember? Thank you!

The EC4. It did look amazing....

 

[Deki]

I just got my Topping Pre90 2 days ago, set it up and have some initial impressions. Coming from several previous preamps (Lazarus, Yaqin, Dayton Wright, Antique sound lab, Emotiva) the Pre90 is incredibly transparent. You can hear into the recording, soundstage is wide and deep, noise is non-existent. There was one big shortcoming though, the tonal balance seemed lean, missing something in the mid bass. None of my other preamps exhibited this character. The high end was so clear though, I didn't know that my system had the possibility to produce air and shimmer like that. Details emerged, sounded like illuminating the musicians so I can finally hear everything that was going on. I won't mention that replacing the stock power cord with a PS audio one warmed things up a little, because no one here will believe it. I went back and forth with my other preamp and it was still a trade off between detail and clarity or warmth and body. Finally ended up moving my equipment around a bit, rotated the speakers a few degrees and moved the chair back-previously this produced less detail and more bass, this time it suited the equipment well. I am running the Pre90 on it's RCA outputs, going to get some XLR connectors and switch my interconnects to balanced so I can finally use the XLR in on the power amp. I'll report back on what effect this has on the sound.
Before I moved the equipment, I had my wife listen to both preamps to see if she could hear the difference and have a preference. She certainly heard a difference and preferred the Topping. She described it as the music sounding closer and sharper. I most always trust her opinions, so persisted a bit with the setup and that's where I am now. I have a short time to evaluate it still to see if this is the sound I want to live with, and if it is I'll be picking up an EXT90.

 

[Peternz]

There was one big shortcoming though, the tonal balance seemed lean, missing something in the mid bass. None of my other preamps exhibited this character.

What you are probably hearing is a lack of second order harmonic distortion. It is likely that you will feel that something is missing if you are used to hearing that and it is suddenly taken away. There is nothing real missing unless you are talking about 80 kHz...

 

[DHT 845]

Of course pre90 is not sounding as tube preamp from your list.

 

[Deki]

I guess the question is, does anyone know of a tube preamp with Pre90 clarity?

 

[DHT 845]

I guess the question is, does anyone know of a tube preamp with Pre90 clarity?

No

 

[Peternz]

I guess the question is, does anyone know of a tube preamp with Pre90 clarity?

No, that would defeat the whole point of a tube preamp anyway.

 

[Slayer]

Yes, it was exactly the same when operating from the unit :-(
Thank you for the Benchmark LA4 suggestion; if I find one somewhere I am going to try it! Also thinking about Electrocompaniet EC 4.8 MKII, from another league of $$$….

You should look into the Holo Audio Serene pre.

 

[Gyroscopics]

I wish there is an option to get the Pre90 in D70 (or D70s) form factor. But that would be called Pre70 right? I'm still debating whether or not to get the Pre90. I am fine using my DAC(s) as preamp. My favorite setup right now is D70 feeding a pair of NC500MP mono-blocks driving a pair of legacy Phil-BMR bookshelves assembled by Dennis Murphy. My gear constantly evolve (for the better IMO) but the speakers stay the same.

 

[Gyroscopics]

I'm also interested in Home Theater bypass. Can some owner check that feature? Is there a 0dB input/output volume option so that I can connect AVR to it and bypass the pre90 volume control.

I have asked shenzhenaudio.com these questions also, but it seems they do not understand this question.

Pre90 does not support Home Theater Bypass. Neither does it have proper bass management. That's why I wouldn't part with my Parasound HINT. For the price of Pre90+Ext with such limited functionality, I would consider spending more and get a proper pre-amp (such as the Halo P6) with HT-Bypass for dual subwoofer and L/R speakers, and proper bass management (for 2 discrete subs) in non-bypass mode, etc. The internal DAC is a plus, and the owner could always use an external DAC like I do in my system using HINT.

 

[hmscott]

Pre90 does not support Home Theater Bypass. Neither does it have proper bass management. That's why I wouldn't part with my Parasound HINT. For the price of Pre90+Ext with such limited functionality, I would consider spending more and get a proper pre-amp (such as the Halo P6) with HT-Bypass for dual subwoofer and L/R speakers, and proper bass management (for 2 discrete subs) in non-bypass mode, etc. The internal DAC is a plus, and the owner could always use an external DAC like I do in my system using HINT.

Well, the Pre90+Ext is supposed to do what it does - and no more, it was designed that way. Why be upset with what it isn't?

And, you really overcooked the comparison, as that Parasound HINT P6 - while a true bargain for what it does - does a lot more than just being a Pre-amplifier, a better comparison would be the Parasound JC 2 BP - Preamplifier with Bypass:

Model Halo JC 2 « Parasound - JC 2 BP Preamplifier with Bypass
Home theater bypass enables seamless blending into a digital surround system
Home theater bypass functions with both unbalanced & balanced inputs and outputs
Home theater bypass function can be assigned to any input

Spoiler: JC 2 BP back panel

And, again that does a lot more than what the Pre90+Ext was designed to accomplish.

I think it is very nice to have the Pre90+Ext available, for those that need it.

And, as well the Parasound options for those that something else, more.

And, thanks for the HINT 6 pointer, I rather like this one - I'm looking for an Integrated Amplifier, and this one was designed (but not built) near me in San Francisco

Model HINT 6 Halo Integrated Amplifier « Parasound - Halo Integrated Amplifier
Home theater bypass input for surround sound integration

Spoiler: HINT 6 back panel

The Parasound site has other choices for both, with Class D small form factor options, that would be even better cross-comparisons. But I still prefer the minimalist approach of Topping when it fits my needs - I've found getting overly complex can be problematic support-wise long term.

And, simplicity of design can bring sonic benefits as well. Turning off all the "noise" generating "extras" is usually an included option in these overly complex builds, to improve the sound. Like "Pure Direct" or "CD Direct" or "Line Level Bypass", turn off all the digital processsing - even the front panel digital - and skip the tone processing, to allow the untouched line-level signal to be switched through.

As the Pre90+Ext is designed to accomplish.

 

[ZestClub]

I just got my Topping Pre90 2 days ago, There was one big shortcoming though, the tonal balance seemed lean, missing something in the mid bass. .

When bass distortion is removed you also lose energy in the bass and that manifests itself as a leaner bass sound.
Probably more a speaker short coming you are hearing now.

 

[Gyroscopics]

Well, the Pre90+Ext is supposed to do what it does - and no more, it was designed that way. Why be upset with what it isn't?

And, you really overcooked the comparison, as that Parasound HINT P6....

There is no HINT P6. It's HINT6 for the integrated-amp and HALO P6 for the pre-amp. The HALO P6 is more comparable to the Pre90, not the HINT6.

JC 2 is not a better comparison for Pre90+Ext90. The Parasound "NewClassic 200 Pre" pre-amp is more comparable to Pre90+Ext90 at almost the same price point.

BTW I have no affiliation to Parasound. I just happen to own Parasound integrated-amp and power amps hence I know the models. And for that matter I also own several Topping DACs. And in my earlier post (#711) I expressed interest on the Pre90 (to use in my 4th system) if not for the form factor.

 

[hmscott]

There is no HINT P6. It's HINT6 for the integrated-amp and HALO P6 for the pre-amp. The HALO P6 is more comparable to the Pre90, not the HINT6.

JC 2 is not a better comparison for Pre90+Ext90. The Parasound "NewClassic 200 Pre" pre-amp is more comparable to Pre90+Ext90 at almost the same price point.

BTW I have no affiliation to Parasound. I just happen to own Parasound integrated-amp and power amps hence I know the models. And for that matter I also own several Topping DACs. And in my earlier post (#711) I expressed interest on the Pre90 (to use in my 4th system) if not for the form factor.

Ahh, HALO P6, and HINT 6 without the 'P', a bit confusing. Both are huge overkill solutions - and nothing like the purity of the Pre90+Ext solution, at least that's how I see it.

And, I did see the NewClassic 200 Pre and shrunk down NewClassic 200 Integrated with a Class D AMP, after I started exploring the rest of the site, but they both include a DAC so I ruled them out, pretty much also overkill solutions compared to the Pre90+Ext, but thinner.

The P6 has Home Theater Bypass, but it also has a DAC, so I ruled that one out as a Pre90+Ext alternative.

The JC2 BP doesn't have a DAC, but it does have the Home Theater Bypass feature which is the subject of the missing feature - the Pre90-Ext doesn't have Home Theater Bypass. Size differences aside, similar to the NewClassic 200 Pre features, minus the DAC.

I am looking for an integrated AMP, actually just an AMP, but the pricing is such that I might as well get some source switching features too, but I don't need another DAC, so for me the HINT 6 is closer to what I am looking for than the Pre90+Ext - without an AMP. The Hint 6 is overkill for what I need as well.

I don't see how any of the Parasound products with all of their complexity of features compare to the simplicity - purity - of the Pre90+Ext...

 

[Gyroscopics]

I am looking for an integrated AMP, actually just an AMP, but the pricing is such that I might as well get some source switching features too, but I don't need another DAC, so for me the HINT 6 is closer to what I am looking for than the Pre90+Ext - without an AMP. The Hint 6 is overkill for what I need as well.

I don't see how any of the Parasound products with all of their complexity of features compare to the simplicity - purity - of the Pre90+Ext...

And the Pre90 seems to be the missing piece in my home office system consisting of Topping D70 --> Hypex nCore NC500MP monoblocks x2 --> Phil-BMR. If only it has the right form factor (and price?)

I agree the HINT6 is overkill in most cases. A Purify amp (or even a nCore Hypex amp) has better price to performance ratio and you are not stuck with the amp along that Pre in the case of HINT6. You may or may not like the Halo amp. The whole package is great for HT integration and occasional music. But I find mine dry (less musical) and lacking in bass punch especially in full range 2-ch music mode (say compared to NAD 375 Bee which is a bit colored integrated-amp). But with the right speakers it may sound musical (in 2 ch mode). For HT my statement above doesn't matter as room correction fixes all that. Cheers.

 

[gvl]

And the Pre90 seems to be the missing piece in my home office system consisting of Topping D70 --> Hypex nCore NC500MP monoblocks x2 --> Phil-BMR.

Yes, there is no doubt it is actually missing based on your description. What do you expect to gain by adding it?

 

[Pdxwayne]

I am thinking, again, to get the pre90. Main reason is I just went back to doing gustard x16 dac direct to amp. To get mqa to work, my node2i need to be in fixed (max) volume mode. It means I need to use x16 to control volume. Gustard said best to not use it's volume control as it would degrade the sound.......Thus I guess I need a preamp....Any cons in doing that other than I may hear no improvements? Pros?

 

[Gyroscopics]

Yes, there is no doubt it is actually missing based on your description. What do you expect to gain by adding it?

Cleaner sound and convenience of a physical knob? I currently use an in-line attenuator (Pearston IMA-1030) between the D70 and the monoblocks to keep the D70 at optimum level at normal listening levels with room to spare (between -6 and 0 dB) and adjust the D70 output level via remote. The NC500MP does not have adjustable gain unlike my class AB amps so front-end pairing is a little tricky.