Neumann KH 310A Review (Powered Monitor)

[andreasmaaan]

How it sounds in home is predicted by the “Estimated In-room Response” chart in Amir’s review (in near-field, would sound more like the “listening window” chart.)

This is the only part of your post I partly disagree with.

The research suggests that, even in the mid-field/far-field, the listening window/on-axis response will tend to be the primary determinant of perceived tonal balance (although it's true that, the further you move from the speaker, the more likely its off-axis response is to play a role).

I'd think the listening setup would need to be quite extreme for the PIR to actually take precedence over the direct sound in determining a speaker's perceived tonal balance.

Will try to find the research I have in mind to back this up...

 

[TimVG]

This is the only part of your post I partly disagree with.

The research suggests that, even in the mid-field/far-field, the listening window/on-axis response will tend to be the primary determinant of perceived tonal balance (although it's true that, the further you move from the speaker, the more likely its off-axis response is to play a role).

I'd think the listening setup would need to be quite extreme for the PIR to actually take precedence over the direct sound in determining a speaker's perceived tonal balance.

Will try to find the research I have in mind to back this up...

That's correct. Simply EQ'ing any loudspeaker to produce a good 'estimated in-room' curve doesn't guarantee anything as far as SQ goes.

 

[Vintage57]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.soundonsound.com/reviews/neumann-kh420?amp
Interesting comparison with K310, he's basically saying he couldn't tell them apart most of the time

I come to the same conclusion comparing the KH-120 with sub to the KH310’s bigger brother. Same tweeter and midrange. They’re amazing clear and distortion free. I have yet to hit the limiter with either speaker. I can play my 70-80’s rock at stupid levels. I do find the KH420’s provide a bigger soundstage with some music.
IMHO you can’t go wrong with any of the Neumann speakers

 

[Pepperjack]

Could it be used at home and how will it sound ?

I use them as lr with a kh120 as center above the tv. Works great except my wife just pretending they don’t exist out of obvious anger....

 

[yourmando]

That's correct. Simply EQ'ing any loudspeaker to produce a good 'estimated in-room' curve doesn't guarantee anything as far as SQ goes.

I might not be communicating well—I mean how the KH 310 sounds in home should look more like the PIR curve than the LW curve, if measured in and around the MLP in a normal home environment and distance. I’m not talking about EQing to match a curve, but about how the speaker’s uncorrected frequency response would be expected to look. Of course, PIR is just an estimate modeling a generic room.

In the near field, the KH 310 would have a less steep roll off of highs, because you have more direct vs reflected sound below critical distance range. In mid and far field, it would measure w/ more roll off, looking more like the PIR.

In either case, it would sound “flat“ and accurate and I agree I would not eq to match a different target curve (except for tone control preference reasons). Because of good directivity, it should also EQ well, but that was not brought up.

The case where I do match target curves is in a surround setup with different speakers and distances where I want better sonic integration, but that is also a different topic.

 

[TimVG]

I might not be communicating well—I mean how the KH 310 sounds in home should look more like the PIR curve than the LW curve, if measured in and around the MLP in a normal home environment and distance. I’m not talking about EQing to match a curve, but about how the speaker’s uncorrected frequency response would be expected to look. Of course, PIR is just an estimate modeling a generic room.

In the near field, the KH 310 would have a less steep roll off of highs, because you have more direct vs reflected sound below critical distance range. In mid and far field, it would measure w/ more roll off, looking more like the PIR.

In either case, it would sound “flat“ and accurate and I agree I would not eq to match a different target curve (except for tone control preference reasons). Because of good directivity, it should also EQ well, but that was not brought up.

The case where I do match target curves is in a surround setup with different speakers and distances where I want better sonic integration, but that is also a different topic.

You're absolutely correct as far as I'm aware.

 

[yourmando]

I come to the same conclusion comparing the KH-120 with sub to the KH310’s bigger brother. Same tweeter and midrange. They’re amazing clear and distortion free. I have yet to hit the limiter with either speaker. I can play my 70-80’s rock at stupid levels. I do find the KH420’s provide a bigger soundstage with some music.
IMHO you can’t go wrong with any of the Neumann speakersView attachment 97105

That’s amazing. Sounds like you get almost perfect sonic integration if you stick to the same family, such as larger ones for LCR and smaller for surrounds, especially w/ subs. Your speakers are looking great!!

 

[Pearljam5000]

I come to the same conclusion comparing the KH-120 with sub to the KH310’s bigger brother. Same tweeter and midrange. They’re amazing clear and distortion free. I have yet to hit the limiter with either speaker. I can play my 70-80’s rock at stupid levels. I do find the KH420’s provide a bigger soundstage with some music.
IMHO you can’t go wrong with any of the Neumann speakersView attachment 97105

I can't afford the KH420 so it's good to know KH750+ KH120 will get me close to it

 

[BYRTT]

This is the only part of your post I partly disagree with.

The research suggests that, even in the mid-field/far-field, the listening window/on-axis response will tend to be the primary determinant of perceived tonal balance (although it's true that, the further you move from the speaker, the more likely its off-axis response is to play a role).

I'd think the listening setup would need to be quite extreme for the PIR to actually take precedence over the direct sound in determining a speaker's perceived tonal balance.

Will try to find the research I have in mind to back this up...

That's correct. Simply EQ'ing any loudspeaker to produce a good 'estimated in-room' curve doesn't guarantee anything as far as SQ goes.

Think its interesting below top models dont directly target smooth as possible on axis or secondly the listening window as for example is speciale of KH 80, in the end they looked priotize the power response smooth, one can see it in right column where ideal DI (directivity index) is divided with actual DI that outputs the dark green curve, now compare that to spinorama's listening window wonder if KH 80 would benefit that policy when not used as near field monitor but as far field room speaker, KH 310 is not so much on axis flat tuned as KH 80 and could get flat power response using 4 times PEQ or so..

 

[Χ Ξ Σ]

Shouldn't the KH310 be quieter than the KH120? Then why are my KH310 noisier than my KH120?

My new KH310 is connected to nothing but the power cable, yet I can hear a slight electric buzzing from the midrange dome and tweeter hiss from my seat at 1.2m, and they don't disappear until I move to 2m away. My KH120 is silent at above 50cm.

I contacted Sennheiser/Neumann US technical support and the guy said that's not normal and suggested sending in for repair or requesting replacement units from the dealer. I haven't decided what to do since I find it pretty odd that both the left and right new speakers have the same noise problem. What are the odds?

Does anyone have both the KH310 and KH120? Would you mind shedding some light on my situation? Much appreciated.

 

[Vintage57]

Does anyone have both the KH310 and KH120? Would you mind shedding some light on my situation? Much appreciated.

I have the KH120 and there's absolutely no hiss, neither is there any hiss with the KH420. Unfortunately.
I have no experience with the KKH310.
I imagine it is very similar circuitry in the tweeter and midrange in the two models.

Could it be a line fault, did you try switching the power cords and XLR connectors between the two?

If you want to hear his you should of heard my Meyer Sound HD-1, you could hear them from the next room on a quiet morning.

 

[yourmando]

Shouldn't the KH310 be quieter than the KH120? Then why are my KH310 noisier than my KH120?

My new KH310 is connected to nothing but the power cable, yet I can hear a slight electric buzzing plus from the midrange dome and tweeter hiss from my seat at 1.2m, and they don't disappear until I move to 2m away. My KH120 is silent at above 50cm.

I contacted Sennheiser/Neumann US technical support and the guy said that's not normal and suggested sending in for repair or requesting replacement units from the dealer. I haven't decided what to do since I find it pretty odd that both the left and right new speakers have the same noise problem. What are the odds?

Does anyone have both the KH310 and KH120? Would you mind shedding some light on my situation? Much appreciated.

I can compare hiss between the KH 310 and KH 120 for you when I get them next week. Please remind me if I forget.

 

[Bamboszek]

According to these measurements KH310 should be the quietest from whole lineup.
What sensitivity / gain settings are you using?

 

[Χ Ξ Σ]

View attachment 97121
According to these measurements KH310 should be the quietest from whole lineup.
What sensitivity / gain settings are you using?

94dB output level and -15dB gain, lowest for both.

 

[Habu]

I come to the same conclusion comparing the KH-120 with sub to the KH310’s bigger brother. Same tweeter and midrange.

Hello from France

There is no soft dome midrange on KH120, only on KH310 and KH420 !
You can only upgrade KH310 to KH420 level with one or two KH750.
You can not upgrade KH120 to KH310 or KH420 level !

The medium dome is the reason why I upgrade from KH120 to KH310, I didn’t want to miss something !

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid-range_speaker

« A mid-range driver is called upon to handle the most significant part of the audible sound spectrum, the region where the most fundamentals emitted by musical instruments and, most importantly, the human voice, lie. This region contains most sounds which are the most familiar to the human ear, and where discrepancies from faithful reproduction are most easily observed. It is therefore paramount that a mid-range driver of good quality be capable of low-distortion reproduction.«

Sincerely yours

Habu

 

[Χ Ξ Σ]

So I called customer service at Pro Audio Star where I purchased my KH310. The guy says I can do replacement or return, but he also suggested that I tried a power strip/surge protector before I initiate the return process. I don't know much about electricity and I am not sure whether that's a valid option. My house is old though so it could have some electric problem, but that doesn't affect my KH120 so I am puzzled.

Any thoughts on my potential electricity problem?

 

[ernestcarl]

Music with more than one instrument paying will give away the spatial difference between these two speakers, thus revealing which pair is playing. Also solo piano music is my main dissatisfaction with the KH120 so it all worked out.

According to Neumman's documentation about the IMD performance, crossing over to a sub reduces the two-way's IMD levels, similar to that of a 3-way (KH310) design. May be you could try LR4 xo at 80Hz-120Hz -- higher the better.

Also, maybe you can try to compare the bass and low-mid difference before and after by using this particular track: Somewhere, Somebody -- Jennifer Warnes.

I'm almost quite certain that there is going to be a noticeable improvement with the KH120s. Although, from my own listening tests, it seems that there is still going to be a little muddling between the deep voice (parts) of the male singer and the Fender bass even after use of a sub with the KH120s.

 

[thewas]

According to Neumman's documentation about the IMD performance, crossing over to a sub reduces the two-way's IMD levels, similar to that of a 3-way (KH310) design.

Do you have that measurements saved on your PC as the good old Neumann website doesn't exist anymore and the only one I can find nowadays compares the IMD of a 2-way with a 3-way and 3-way with a 3-way with a subwoofer https://en-de.neumann.com/product_files/7950/download

Also my experience is that even with a sub the 5" cone of the KH120 will never reach the clarity and cleanness of their superb 3" mid, unfortunately for me who could only afford the first one.

 

[Vintage57]

There is no soft dome midrange on KH120, only on KH310 and KH420 !

Hello to France
what I said was “I come to the same conclusion comparing the KH-120 with sub to the KH310’s bigger brother. Same tweeter and midrange”

which means , comparing the KH120 with sub to the KH310’s bigger brother. The bigger brother to the KH310 is the KH420. I was not referring to the KH120.

 

[ichonderoga]

You can add two subwoofers, thanks,to igor_xxxx from pink fish media forum:

https://pinkfishmedia.net/forum/threads/neumann-kh-310-a-and-dual-subwoofers.228444/


View attachment 94862

View attachment 94863

View attachment 94964

And the latest iteration from igor_xxxx (With grilles, custom isolation between the monitors, subwoofers and floor in order to decrease some excessive energy),
Thanks again igor.

View attachment 95062

Really considering the KH 310s (and maybe later on your complete stack). Are the 310s all they're hyped up to be?