Gustard X16 Balanced MQA DAC Review

[BDWoody]

there is no pre-amplifier function in this DAC, so no volume control.

Well, the volume control kinda gives it Preamp function doesn't it?

This can be connected directly to a power amp without a preamp in between, using it's built in volume control.

Most DAC's with a 'DAC' mode simply fix the volume at 100%, it doesn't get sent through a separate circuit.

 

[abdo123]

Well, the volume control kinda gives it Preamp function doesn't it?

This can be connected directly to a power amp without a preamp in between, using it's built in volume control.

Most DAC's with a 'DAC' mode simply fix the volume at 100%, it doesn't get sent through a separate circuit.

i’m not very experienced, but i did pre-order the DAC. I wasn’t aware of the volume functionality on the remote. hopefully i will get to experience this first hand.

I’m planning to connect it to an integrated Amp with its own volume controls. My lazy ass is telling me to use the volume control on the DAC so i would only have to use one remote control (lol, first world problems). But i feel like i should do the sensible thing and control the volume from the amp. What is the scientific opinion on this?

 

[mocenigo]

i’m not very experienced, but i did pre-order the DAC. I wasn’t aware of the volume functionality on the remote. hopefully i will get to experience this first hand.

I’m planning to connect it to an integrated Amp with its own volume controls. My lazy ass is telling me to use the volume control on the DAC so i would only have to use one remote control (lol, first world problems). But i feel like i should do the sensible thing and control the volume from the amp. What is the scientific opinion on this?

The informed guess is that volume attenuation in the DAC is transparent, at least to reasonable levels (-30Db or so). If at max output the noise and distortion are inaudible, even assuming that they worsen linearly with the attenuation (so that a SINAD of 121 would become 91 at 30Db attenuation), which is a pessimistic approach, the effect is usually less detrimental than using a potentiometer.

 

[abdo123]

The informed guess is that volume attenuation in the DAC is transparent, at least to reasonable levels (-30Db or so). If at max output the noise and distortion are inaudible, even assuming that they worsen linearly with the attenuation (so that a SINAD of 121 would become 91 at 30Db attenuation), which is a pessimistic approach, the effect is usually less detrimental than using a potentiometer.

like i said, I’m really not that experienced. Infact, this the very first DAC i purchased.

could you please dumb this down to my level?

 

[Harmonie]

The informed guess is that volume attenuation in the DAC is transparent, at least to reasonable levels (-30Db or so). If at max output the noise and distortion are inaudible, even assuming that they worsen linearly with the attenuation (so that a SINAD of 121 would become 91 at 30Db attenuation), which is a pessimistic approach, the effect is usually less detrimental than using a potentiometer.

So in case attenuation 60db the SINAD would be 61db only ?
Really ?
I wonder

 

[BDWoody]

like i said, I’m really not that experienced. Infact, this the very first DAC i purchased.

could you please dumb this down to my level?

Basically, it won't matter much. If you want to use the DAC, set your amp volume as high as you'd set it for LOUD with your DAC at 100%, then use the DAC without worry of blowing up your speakers.

You could also do it the other way. Matching gain levels is a matter of fiddling sometimes. One isn't automatically better than the other.

Try each... See what you find more convenient.

 

[mocenigo]

So in case attenuation 60db the SINAD would be 61db only ?
Really ?
I wonder

Well, with respect to the level of the signal you are hearing, which would be quite attenuated. As I said, some noise is intrinsic thermal noise and this remains the same, so the weaker the signal, the smaller the difference between signal and noise. Other noise may be the product of the conversion process itself, which may not decrease as sharply. And then there is distortion, which in some cases (for instance for non-sign magnitude R2R DACs, which need not be discrete, they can be chips) remains constant, so its contribution to SINAD will "increase" as the signal decreases, but in other cases cases (for instance for sign magnitude R2R DACs) will be proportional to the signal. For sigma-delta DACs the relation to distortion is usually slightly more complex.

SINAD is the signal to noise-and-distortion ratio - if the signal is reduced but part of the noise and distortion remain constant, this ratio worsens.

 

[mocenigo]

like i said, I’m really not that experienced. Infact, this the very first DAC i purchased.

could you please dumb this down to my level?

Each device has a certain level of noise and distortion. This is usually measured at a fixed level (usually 4V for balanced out and 2V for unbalanced outs). If the signal is weaker, some contributions to noise and distortion will however remain unchanged, so the signal gets, relatively speaking, "dirtier". So once your system is set up to a very loud level (but one that will not damage your hearing), and, say, your DAC has a SINAD of 121 Db, it means that the noise and distortion are inaudible. It will usually remain inaudible if you listen to a more moderate level... Well this is not entirely true, for instance if there is some hiss from the speakers, it will not be perceived when the rest is very loud, but you may hear it during quiet passages – but for the hiss to be annoying the system must have bad or mismatched components.

In other words, do not worry.

 

[rudy]

I thought he was referring to bypassing the circuit-based volume control.

 

[rudy]

i wonder what the line out voltage of something like the Chord Qutest? i presume it would be measured in mil/v's and would and would contribute very little distortion when fed into a external pre-amp. this is what i was asking since i do not need a device that i can plug directly into a power amp. less is more. i was hoping that Gustard or RME would produce something that is a pure DAC w/o a headphone amp or volume control. now the Qutest or something like it may be my best option? thanks

 

[amirm]

i wonder what the line out voltage of something like the Chord Qutest?

I have reviewed it: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ew-and-measurements-of-chord-qutest-dac.5981/

Its max output is high at 3 volts.

On your question, the pre-amp in your amplifier will degrade the performance of this DAC fair bit. It is very difficult to find an amplifier that can keep up with DACs like this. If the pre-amp doesn't distort, set the output of the DAC to max and use it to attenuate the level, not amplify it.

 

[Pdxwayne]

I have reviewed it: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ew-and-measurements-of-chord-qutest-dac.5981/

Its max output is high at 3 volts.

On your question, the pre-amp in your amplifier will degrade the performance of this DAC fair bit. It is very difficult to find an amplifier that can keep up with DACs like this. If the pre-amp doesn't distort, set the output of the DAC to max and use it to attenuate the level, not amplify it.

Any preamp to recommend? I am not sure using Topping L30 as preamp for stereo amp is a good idea or not.

 

[TimF]

One year ago, I bought 2 Topping products DOA. No problem with Amazon, but one year later I cannot resist and I am ordering again some Topping products.

Frankly speaking, two years ago I've seen Gustard products and found the name is ridiculous (sound like mustard for me), surely bad products from China. Don't get me wrong, I am not saying China is only producing bad products, but the country was not, by this time, identified as great audio gear producer.

Two years later, surely because of ASR, I bought plenty of Chinese products from SMSL, Sabaj, Topping, and now Mustard, err, sorry, Gustard.

I understand your pretty bad impression, but things change.

Also, I lived in China, loved the country and the people, and I am more than happy to see these Chinese brands send some lessons to the audiophile community.

Who do you think makes the Apple smartphones, or the circuitry for all the supposedly top quality audio equipment, and electronic guts of most high-end products---the Chinese! If they are manufacturing the guts of all these supposedly American made great products they can certainly learn how to do it themselves.

 

[rudy]

just received this:
Hi friend,
X16 has no pre-amplification, and the volume is adjusted to the maximum (0dB) to pass through, that is, no attenuation.
Integrated amplifier, which has the function of pre-amplifier, try to use it as the volume control of the entire system. It is also advisable to adjust the volume of X16 in a small range (within -15dB).
Thanks

 

[amirm]

Any preamp to recommend? I am not sure using Topping L30 as preamp for stereo amp is a good idea or not.

I have not tested many preamps so no recommendation.

 

[renaudrenaud]

Who do you think makes the Apple smartphones, or the circuitry for all the supposedly top quality audio equipment, and electronic guts of most high-end products---the Chinese! If they are manufacturing the guts of all these supposedly American made great products they can certainly learn how to do it themselves.

I worked in China a while ago and I think things are not as simple as you describe and sometimes very different as what you experiment in occidental countries.

I think before to invest into a market, you have to believe in it. Anyway, I am waiting for the X16 and hope it will be here for XMas.

 

[ABall]

I have not tested many preamps so no recommendation.

Pull your finger out man!

 

[kopczas]

I have not tested many preamps so no recommendation.

I would love to see preamp output of Topping A90.

 

[James. B. Lansing]

Well, it looks like they may not be shipping these on the proposed release date due to lack of chips.

Such a shame, I will update as soon as I have more information.

 

[ABall]

Well, it looks like they may not be shipping these on the proposed release date due to lack of chips.

Such a shame, I will update as soon as I have more information.