Revel M105 Bookshelf Speaker Review

[daftcombo]

Hmm, I don't know, it's just the High Pass Filter in PEACE - an extension of Equaliser APO. You can set the Q value to whatever you want, I use 0.75Q.

Which one would it be, minimum or linear & would it matter?

Must be minimum phase. But with EqualizerAPO you can easily load an impulse into the built-in convolver module. That impulse can be created with RePhase and be linear phase.
But I don't know if you would really hear a difference. Worth a try.

 

[amirm]

Animated model prediction for Amir's used filters for M105, as i understand band 1 is told be a room correction specific for position he test bookshelf sized speakers, looks good on paper ..

Thanks. Considering that I just eyeball the filters from the graphs, that is not bad!

 

[daftcombo]

AP has built-in sharp filters so if that is what people want, that is easy to test.

I think it would be worth it, because with gentle slope (as opposed to: extremely steep/brickwall), we don't know if the benefit is caused by the relief for the woofer of not being compelled to produce content (or barely) under a certain frequency or caused by less stress at higher frequencies like 35Hz, 40Hz...

 

[Soniclife]

With AP, I can easily import an excel or text file for the EQ (frequency, gain). So if someone wants to give me one I can try it.

Do you have an example your could post, say what you used for this test, so I can get the format correct.

 

[Soniclife]

You might be interested in this 'study' I did. I tested a speaker with a 20-20kHz stimulus. Then tested it again with an 80-20kHz stimulus.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/erinsaudiocorner.11219/post-458455

Thanks very interesting, I'm sure it was explained but was the unexpected high frequency improvement measured from a speaker with a crossover? How can reducing the bass reduce the tweeter distortion?

 

[Rick Sykora]

'cause I hate it when "reviewers" fill the text with stuff like that.

Lol. Now that I know how you really feel, I'll see if I can bribe @pozz or someone else.

 

[pozz]

Lol. Now that I know how you really feel, I'll see if I can bribe @pozz or someone else.

Dimensions for every single speaker?

I won't lie, this will be a backburner item. @RickSanchez will set the price.

 

[hardisj]

Thanks very interesting, I'm sure it was explained but was the unexpected high frequency improvement measured from a speaker with a crossover? How can reducing the bass reduce the tweeter distortion?

The speaker has a passive filter for the tweeter. But there was no external crossover applied for the bass, if that's what you mean.

I am wondering if the decreased distortion with the limited stimulus in HF is due to the fact the woofer is not moving in/out as severely and, thus, maybe not contributing to some sort of doppler effect because, in reality, the woofer is just part of the baffle as far as the tweeter "sees" it.

 

[Rick Sykora]

Dimensions for every single speaker?

I won't lie, this will be a backburner item. @RickSanchez will set the price.

While I can offer some DIY speakers or something, if the fields are added to the database, would be willing to populate the past data.

 

[Soniclife]

I am wondering if the decreased distortion with the limited stimulus in HF is due to the fact the woofer is not moving in/out as severely and, thus, maybe not contributing to some sort of doppler effect because, in reality, the woofer is just another baffle as far as the tweeter "sees" it.

That's all I could think if too, something going on with the cabinet messing up the tweeter. It sort of doesn't matter what causes it if the test is done, so we can see how speakers really behave. Fixing it is a job for the designer.

 

[amirm]

Do you have an example your could post, say what you used for this test, so I can get the format correct.

Sure. I just created one with two eq points.

 

[ROOSKIE]

With all due respect, this does not sound right. Large speakers seem to maintain their presence at low volumes as well as high, while these bookshelves, as you say, need some type of loudness adjustment. My old Yamaha had a great loudness function, but my new Freya+ has no frequency adjustments. Second, I don't think these measurements are in fact across the board. Are they run at a constant db level? It does not appear that frequency response measurements are taken at low levels that are increased in any manner. Moreover, my understanding of speaker parameters is that they are not completely linear so that the crossover is in fact only accurate at a designed output level, and the speaker response varies slightly at different volumes.

Howdy, no, the crossover is not spl dependent at all.
Your ears do not hear low frequency sounds as well at lower volumes. The relationship is not linear with increase in spl. Pretty much any speaker needs a bass boost at lower volumes, unless the speaker already has boosted bass by design in which case it will likely have to much bass at higher spl.
I recommend buying equipment with tone control or using some for of eq.
In any case I don't believe there is a correlation with speaker size and low volume quality. It is case by case.

 

[BYRTT]

Thanks. Considering that I just eyeball the filters from the graphs, that is not bad!

Wau excellence and respect there, had a tiny little feeling about eyeball method in relation how else could one man site be so productive these days, myself couldn't do that craft without support well i better stop praising more into this post or chances is Qmuse will get the coffee wrong in the throat, don't know why but this review and KH 80 has something to like thanks, btw off topic suggest arrange let panthers leave for holidays in two groups and test US devices when golf panther is at home and vice versa.

 

[RickSanchez]

While I can offer some DIY speakers or something, if the fields are added to the database, would be willing to populate the past data.

You can start a PM with me (and @pozz) if you'd like. But given the backlog of items I have on my plate for all of the non-speaker stuff I'd agree with pozz that this would be back burner. Or maybe it's just Friday afternoon and I don't feel like thinking about more work ...

Out of curiosity: what is the use case to see length / width / height / weight on ASR? I'm thinking about cost/benefit and not sure I see the benefit part. I spent a fair bit of time building out the product page URL feature -- plus maintaining the data -- to handle this type of request so that dimensions (and other info) are one or two clicks away ...

 

[Robbo99999]

Must be minimum phase. But with EqualizerAPO you can easily load an impulse into the built-in convolver module. That impulse can be created with RePhase and be linear phase.
But I don't know if you would really hear a difference. Worth a try.

Yeah, I heard about that, but don't really understand it completely. Hoodoo with your voodoo!

 

[GelbeMusik]

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Revel M105 Bookshelf/stand-mount speaker.

Two things I don't like. First the industrial design is less fortunate. Really? Looks like an accident. Second the industrial design. It is pricewise prohibitive, and I argue by intent.

Which actually is a pity, since the technical design is well done within the limitations of the driver. With a port tuned to 60Hz one expects the worst excursion at about 100Hz. That is seen here as a rise in distortion even for higher components like HD4 / HD5. Maybe these make the spike in the multitone at around 400Hz / 500Hz. Another spike at about 200Hz / 250Hz may correspond to the exaggerated excursion below the tuning, say 50Hz or so. Due to the rise in distortion an X/O to a sub at that frequency of 100Hz or lower wouldn't be too reasonable.

I wonder what the 5kHz bump is. It probably isn't the woofer. The raw data doesn't show anything like that:

https://sbacoustics.com/product/5in-sb15nac30-4/

The waveguide maybe?

Whatever, quite successful, but I personally think that a variant with a less pretentious, I'm flattering, enclosure would sell even better. At least me would rather prefer some yellowish particle board, no joke. You can overdo with "design", and then it just flips.

 

[ROOSKIE]

Two things I don't like. First the industrial design is less fortunate. Really? Looks like an accident...
...
Whatever, quite successful, but I personally think that a variant with a less pretentious, I'm flattering, enclosure would sell even better. At least me would rather prefer some yellowish particle board, no joke. You can overdo with "design", and then it just flips.

Hmmm, I am not a fan of piano finishes but you really don't like these that much?
I certainly don't think that what you describe would sell well nor sell at a price that would allow a company to make money and pay employee's.
What you describe is for the DIY community.
Particle board??? Now if they would offer a matte or satin finish, I'd be on board, that gloss...

 

[restorer-john]

You should see the ugly drill holes on the bottom for their stand...

That's interesting. Many Japanese branded speakers which used recessed captive nuts for stand mounting covered the captive nuts with a perfectly fitted round, removable felt plug of the same colour as the speaker.

It speaks to the holistic attitude of the company in my opinion. If the factory workers don't really care about the only parts the consumer sees, what about the rest of the product they don't see?

I see the same all the time on many European cars. The badges on AU$150,000+ cars are often not carefully placed. I've always blamed the Australian importers because I figured BMW/Mercedes/Audi etc surely wouldn't allow their cars out the door with wonky badges. (Do they fit badges in the country after importing?). It's rare to see Japanese manufactured vehicles (actually out of Japan factories) with anything other than perfect badges.

The badges/name/model plates are the final piece in many cases and should show pride in the product as it goes into the carton- wonky/angled badges show the exact opposite.

 

[Jimbob54]

That's interesting. Many Japanese branded speakers which used recessed captive nuts for stand mounting covered the captive nuts with a perfectly fitted round, removable felt plug of the same colour as the speaker.

It speaks to the holistic attitude of the company in my opinion. If the factory workers don't really care about the only parts the consumer sees, what about the rest of the product they don't see?

I see the same all the time on many European cars. The badges on AU$150,000+ cars are often not carefully placed. I've always blamed the Australian importers because I figured BMW/Mercedes/Audi etc surely wouldn't allow their cars out the door with wonky badges. (Do they fit badges in the country after importing?). It's rare to see Japanese manufactured vehicles (actually out of Japan factories) with anything other than perfect badges.

The badges/name/model plates are the final piece in many cases and should show pride in the product as it goes into the carton- wonky/angled badges show the exact opposite.

Its gravity, innit. Makes the badges want to turn upside down when they cross the equator. So the glue is friction, but it gives up with the heat from being too near the sun, or maybe the earths core and gravity takes over.

So yeah, science explains it.

 

[restorer-john]

Its gravity, innit. Makes the badges want to turn upside down when they cross the equator. So the glue is friction, but it gives up with the heat from being too near the sun, or maybe the earths core and gravity takes over.

So yeah, science explains it.

It will be due to the cheap adhesive or the badge on the speaker is a single spigot and rotates about the pin. Some companies worked out a long time ago that two pin badges don't twist...