Denon AVR-X4700 AVR Review (Updated)

[raistlin65]

Thanks that's the first thing I'm going to try when I get home . I kind of rushed it last night

If you have never read it, this subwoofer calibration guide at AVS Forum is super informative regarding Audyssey

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-...e-subwoofer-calibration-bass-preferences.html

 

[peng]

So when the internal amps are clipping, the pre-outs just have an increase in distortion. Does that mean you always get a cleaner output from external amps?

Assuming you meant the internal amps are disconnected, I would say yes, as long as the external amp has better SINAD and other audio quality related specs, more powerful and have the same, nearly the same or higher gain than the internal power amp.

Note: I edited my post after I realized I might have misunderstood yours.

 

[Big Rev]

This is my exact interest in this thread. I received my Denon X3700H on the 2nd of July. It's still sitting in the box unopened. I'm eagerly awaiting a review of it here since I intend to only use it as a processor connected to either Pass Labs or Mark Levinson LCR amplification. I'm new to Home theater and I have a dedicated 2-channel listening room as well as a 17 x 30 dedicated HT room. (just starting out, Epson 5050ub and Denon are all I've purchased so far.) Any help/suggestions would be welcomed. So, should I expect the 3700 and 4700 to have the same performance when used strictly as a pre/pro?

 

[peng]

This is my exact interest in this thread. I received my Denon X3700H on the 2nd of July. It's still sitting in the box unopened. I'm eagerly awaiting a review of it here since I intend to only use it as a processor connected to either Pass Labs or Mark Levinson LCR amplification. I'm new to Home theater and I have a dedicated 2-channel listening room as well as a 17 x 30 dedicated HT room. (just starting out, Epson 5050ub and Denon are all I've purchased so far.) Any help/suggestions would be welcomed. So, should I expect the 3700 and 4700 to have the same performance when used strictly as a pre/pro?

Its highly unlikely they would measure exactly the same, but I see no reason why they would be much different either. My guess is, they will be within 3 dB in SINAD to each other for pre-amp/DAC performance. Linearity, IMD, SNR, DNR 32 tones test will also be very closed. We should know within a week or two.

 

[tobykeith]

Hello everyone I have the Denon X4700H .. I have it configured and set it up for 7.1 .. and hooked it up a 5 channel amp and set it up in pre amp mode....my question can I use the internal amps to power the rear surround back speakers only and use the pre amp(amplifier 5 channel amp) mode to power the front,center and surround sound speakers? I have it configured in this mode but the rear surround back speakers don't play..is there someway to allow the internal amps to work here or do I need a extra 2 channel amp?

 

[theory]

Hello everyone I have the Denon X4700H .. I have it configured and set it up for 7.1 .. and hooked it up a 5 channel amp and set it up in pre amp mode....my question can I use the internal amps to power the rear surround back speakers only and use the pre amp(amplifier 5 channel amp) mode to power the front,center and surround sound speakers? I have it configured in this mode but the rear surround back speakers don't play..is there someway to allow the internal amps to work here or do I need a extra 2 channel amp?

Pretty sure you can only disconnect the front LR or disconnect all via preamp mode. You can’t turn some channels on or off outside of the front LR.

 

[shellback]

This is my exact interest in this thread. I received my Denon X3700H on the 2nd of July. It's still sitting in the box unopened. I'm eagerly awaiting a review of it here since I intend to only use it as a processor connected to either Pass Labs or Mark Levinson LCR amplification. I'm new to Home theater and I have a dedicated 2-channel listening room as well as a 17 x 30 dedicated HT room. (just starting out, Epson 5050ub and Denon are all I've purchased so far.) Any help/suggestions would be welcomed. So, should I expect the 3700 and 4700 to have the same performance when used strictly as a pre/pro?

I have a 3700 arriving Monday and am anxious to read Amir's testing on it as well.

 

[tparm]

Hello everyone I have the Denon X4700H .. I have it configured and set it up for 7.1 .. and hooked it up a 5 channel amp and set it up in pre amp mode....my question can I use the internal amps to power the rear surround back speakers only and use the pre amp(amplifier 5 channel amp) mode to power the front,center and surround sound speakers? I have it configured in this mode but the rear surround back speakers don't play..is there someway to allow the internal amps to work here or do I need a extra 2 channel amp?

11CH mode enables you to disconnect the LR channels. Pre-amp mode unhooks all internal amplifiers requiring external amplification for all channels.

 

[zelig]

I have a 3700 arriving Monday and am anxious to read Amir's testing on it as well.

Me too. I guess this is a new world of distributed warehousing. Manufacturers build the devices and immediately ship them to people who might decide to keep them... or not.

 

[cowsgomoo62]

Me too. I guess this is a new world of distributed warehousing. Manufacturers build the devices and immediately ship them to people who might decide to keep them... or not.

I have a 3700 preordered at my local Video Only (west coast home theater chain) and crossing my fingers every day to even get an update when it will be in. Confident that this will be a step up from my current Sony STR-DH770, regardless of the review. Definitely jealous of everyone who has one already!

 

[DrewMcG]

....my question can I use the internal amps to power the rear surround back speakers only and use the pre amp(amplifier 5 channel amp) mode to power the front,center and surround sound speakers?

You can use the external amp to power the rear surrounds only, give it a try, but without using pre-amp-only mode.

 

[valerianf]

You could also have a wireless transmission between the rear pre-out and the external amp for the rear surround.
But for that you need to add a radio transmitter.

 

[jalaute]

There are a number of reasons I would be interested in using an external amp. One of which, is that I see the 1.4V "ish" pre-out drive level "knee" as a goal to not exceed, with the L/R/C channels being the most likely to push that envelope. Right now, the options for optimal 4700 SINAD, are to buy either a 2, 9, or 11 channel amp (2/11/13 for the 6700) to support the current L/R or “all” pre-out options.

I believe across the board, individual channel level control (pre-amp/amp control and actual amp reallocation) only occurs with the 8500 model, and that it is the only Denon model that does not have unamplified "orphan" pre-outs.

The rest of this is a sort of a “Pokemon GO”/unicorn hunt.

There had been some discussion of the hardware requirements to support pre-out/amp control beyond "L/R or all". I believe the "consensus" was that current hardware might support L/C/R control (firmware?), but probably not (much) beyond that. Did I understand correctly?

If so, and assuming implementation of the unicorn level L/C/R option, the external amp options expand to include much more desirable/useful/realistic 3 or 5 channel amps, supporting the 3 front base channels and possibly the 2 "orphan" surrounds. It seems to me that the sweet spot should (could?) be a 3 or 5 channel amp solution. Just need that firmware unicorn to make an appearance.

I’m really surprised that, if technically possible, LCR pre-out is not an option at the 3000/4000 level of Denon’s “X” series. The current L/R option is inadequate, and the "all" option is not very realistic (at least for me).

 

[Gedeon]

I read too many, but reasonable, doubts about gain and voltage pre-outs.

Nowadays most (if not all, I just can't be totally sure about all brand models out there) power amps intended to be used in consumer and home theater setups have a 29db gain, and the internal amp sections also have that gain.

Those numbers come from historical THX and Dolby Digital standards, AFAIK.

And most AVRs also give a "clean enough" signal until 1.4volts.

So I wouldn't be very worried about that "matching" once checked impedance (10kohms or more) and 29db gain (28.8volts for 1v input).

 

[Daniel0]

Does anyone know at what temperature the fans come on?

The Fans start running at 69-70 degrees Celsius. I heard that somewhere from a Sound United guy, but I don't remember where.

People are way too worried about Temperature, the most sensitive parts inside an AVR are the electrolytic capacitors and they are usually rated somewhere around 80-90 degrees Celsius.
I mean many PCs and especially Notebooks run very close to 100 degree Celsius at the hotspots under load and they don't die that easily.

But you can buy an Aircom for peace of mind.

 

[peng]

I am not worried about failures, but longevity, as I want a >$1,000 AVR to last for at least 2 HDMI version changes.

 

[doodlebro]

Reason for Second Review

This is why I trust Amir and his methodology; nobody in the AV review space is this detail oriented. You won't find content like this anywhere else!

 

[Dj7675]

For those keeping track of things Amir should have my x8500 today. Not sure what order the reviews will be coming in... but we have an x3700, x6700 and x8500 in the que I believe. Once all of these are done, we will have an excellent idea regarding performance of the current Denon line. It will be interesting to see if performance tops the x3600, or if you just get more channels (in the case of the x6700/x8500), a bit more power, more features. And add to it the JBL SDP-55 which I believe is also upcoming.

 

[amirm]

I have made a few measurements on the 6700 and sent them to Japan before I continue with the rest. So I will probably switch to testing the 3700 unless an answer comes back quick on that. The throughput is extremely slow now on Denon products due to this "review" loop.

 

[John Galt]

I have made a few measurements on the 6700 and sent them to Japan before I continue with the rest. So I will probably switch to testing the 3700 unless an answer comes back quick on that. The throughput is extremely slow now on Denon products due to this "review" loop.

I’m so anxious to read your 3700 report that I really wish you’d just leave Denon out of the loop.