What does that data look like?Can you calculate the Preference rating of the EQ-ed version if I send you the filter?
What does that data look like?Can you calculate the Preference rating of the EQ-ed version if I send you the filter?
What does that data look like?
If you ever decide to, just plug the rough sensitivity @2.83V into this pre-ready Wolfram function I just put together. It’s set to achieve 100dB, you can of course change it. Or, since you are measuring at 1/3m does it need to be altered (~9.5dB difference)? Also, how are you measuring a 1/3m distance, just using 13 inches?Repeating what I already know is not helpful. What is helpful is showing how the extra effort is worth it at the expense of measuring another speaker. And remember, it is not just time to measure but capture the results, format, annotate and publish. And field questions about it like I am doing now.
I’m not at home for the weekend, so doing this all on my phone. If you could use the same CEA-2034 and Estimated In-Room files in the original zip file but just with the different data, then I can easily import it (So, load the originals in Sheets/Excel, replace with the EQ’d data, export as CSV).I can supply corrected on-axis, LW, ER and SP exported from REW. Here is how it looks for on-axis data.
Isn’t it +11dB?Power = voltage * voltage /impedance. The impedance varies here but using 5 ohm, the power would be 100/5 = 20 watts.
SPL increase would be 12 dB.
I’m not at home for the weekend, so doing this all on my phone. If you could use the same CEA-2034 and Estimated In-Room files in the original zip file but just with the different data, then I can easily import it (So, load the originals in Sheets/Excel, replace with the EQ’d data, export as CSV).
EDIT: If you don’t have the corrected in-room, I’d have to calculate that, which unless I can find where I manually calculated it before, it would have to wait till I get home.
If I would own these loudspeakers I wouldn't EQ the almost 10dB dip though as it would take the increased distortions to an even higher point, but the rest can be nicely EQed as you show. The good thing is that our hearing is also not very sensitive to narrow dips, opposite to narrow peaks.Exceptionaly smooth directivity indexes allow for effective EQ. This filter variant has been optimised for flat on-axis response:
On-axis:
View attachment 53310
LW & PIR:
View attachment 53311
I don't agree. Current measurements are done according to CEA-2034 standard which is based on parameters proven to be the most relevant for SQ.
I did some in-room measurements recently while trying to figure out the problem, that showed a mysterious notch in the SPL at about 1.5kHz. Now you mention it, a HF driver wired backwards could well explain that.
I reversed the wires to the tweeter and repeated the measurement. The notch disappeared and on listening to music, the midrange output seemed a lot better.
As it relates to listener preference, yes. And that, based on every research shows that THD is not a factor.
In listening tests, I comment on power handling.
Quality is superbly there in the spinorama measurements. They are state of the art and comply with the best of what we know to characterize listener preference. Your request is to pile on more quantity with little value relative to work already being done.
It is not like we are sitting on data from 1000 speakers already to spend time drilling down on a few. We need to get good coverage of performance from all the major brands to know who is and who is not building good speakers.
Exactly that. THD is not that important unless we're talking about high amount in mid or high frequencies; can also be useful to choose between speakers already having good spins, I guess. It's also useful since it's mostly what signals that the speaker is exceeding its physical capabilities.Dr. Floyd Toole: "A spinorama shows linear performance. Collectively the curves reveal evidence of resonances, bandwidth, spectral balance, smoothness and directivity....Then there are the other variables: power handling, power compression and non-linear distortions. These are not shown in the spinorama, but competent design engineers measure them in the selection and design process. Tweeters with identical domes, for example, can exhibit very different behaviors because of differing motor designs - which are invisible.Summing up, unless there is serious misbehavior in one of these other variables, the linear behavior described by a spinorama is the dominant clue about potential sound quality."If you have two speakers with identical spinorama and power handling, how would you know which one has better SQ playing at concert levels? How do you know if there is no "serious misbehaviour"? I don't think you can without additional measurements.
This is correct, but I also agree that a SOTA speaker also needs to have proper SPL capabilities.As it relates to listener preference, yes. And that, based on every research shows that THD is not a factor.
In listening tests, I comment on power handling.
Quality is superbly there in the spinorama measurements. They are state of the art and comply with the best of what we know to characterize listener preference. Your request is to pile on more quantity with little value relative to work already being done.
It is not like we are sitting on data from 1000 speakers already to spend time drilling down on a few.
Dr. Floyd Toole: "A spinorama shows linear performance. Collectively the curves reveal evidence of resonances, bandwidth, spectral balance, smoothness and directivity....Then there are the other variables: power handling, power compression and non-linear distortions. These are not shown in the spinorama, but competent design engineers measure them in the selection and design process. Tweeters with identical domes, for example, can exhibit very different behaviors because of differing motor designs - which are invisible.Summing up, unless there is serious misbehavior in one of these other variables, the linear behavior described by a spinorama is the dominant clue about potential sound quality."If you have two speakers with identical spinorama and power handling, how would you know which one has better SQ playing at concert levels? How do you know if there is no "serious misbehaviour"? I don't think you can without additional measurements.
Isn’t it +11dB?
20•log10(10/2.83)≈11dB
Conversely:
2.83^2 /5 ≈ 1.6W
10^2 /5 = 20W
20/1.6 = 12.5 ratio
10•log10(12.5)≈11dB
If I would own these loudspeakers I wouldn't EQ the almost 10dB dip though as it would take the increased distortions to an even higher point, but the rest can be nicely EQed as you show. The good thing is that our hearing is also not very sensitive to narrow dips, opposite to narrow peaks.
I’m not at home for the weekend, so doing this all on my phone. If you could use the same CEA-2034 and Estimated In-Room files in the original zip file but just with the different data, then I can easily import it (So, load the originals in Sheets/Excel, replace with the EQ’d data, export as CSV).
EDIT: If you don’t have the corrected in-room, I’d have to calculate that, which unless I can find where I manually calculated it before, it would have to wait till I get home.